[Tom_Doak]

Tom,
You said many of the locals didn't care about restoration of the golf course.  Did they make the call?  This is a sincere question as I get it asked often, who should decide these things and/or who should make recommendations as to what should be done and what should that be based on?  As we both know, many owners/members/golfers often don't know what they have or don't have.  Many also don't have the vision to know what it could be because it has been changed so much and/or hasn't aged well.

I said I couldn't get the locals to identify any features that were of particular interest.  [I only asked a few guys with long histories there.]  They seemed to love the PLACE, more than the course.


And no, the local golfers did not make the call.  The guy who raised millions of dollars to do the deal said he wanted to make it a better course worthy of hosting the world's best players.  I didn't think it was that, so we redesigned it.  In the whole process, the only time I heard John Bredemus' name used was when I brought him up.

[Tim_Weiman]

Mark Fine,


I think what Tom Doak said is correct. People in Houston loved Memorial. The place. The vibe. The friendliness. But, I don’t recall anyone specifically liking the course itself. Indeed, it is hard to recall more than one or two holes that were decent.


As best I can tell, the project has been a success. People are still happy with the place, but now they have a far better golf course.

[Mark_Fine]

Thanks Tom.  Everything I have heard has been positive as we all know, not every old course needed to be "restored", whatever that means

Tim,
I just went through a very similar process (though we only had literally a fraction of the Memorial budget) and did a fairly complete transformation of Bethlehem GC which is a Municiple course in PA.  But just like at Memorial, it was NOT a restoration nor intended to be but in this case I did want it to retain much of the Gordon look and characteristics.  It is now a new and improved golf course but if you study Gordon and Flynn (who Gordon worked under for a long time), most would think it is one of Gordon's better designs which was the goal.  Golfers love it which is actually much more important than who they thought designed it. 

[David Wuthrich]

Mark,
Jim Crane, owner of the Astros and the Houston Open pushed for the change.  The city and other stakeholders allowed it to happen when the money was raised and it didn't cost them anything.

[Mark_Fine]

David,
When travel gets easier again, I hope to get down there.  We will need to tee it up.  We didn't have the benefit of that kind of financing at my project.  Good for Memorial and Houston. 

[Steve Lang]

   Mark,


You need to put things into a little more perspective, just some simple facts alone:
- Memorial Park is about 12% of the size of Bethlehem
- the Houston MSA is almost 8 times larger than the Lehigh Valley MSA
- Houston is 30 times larger than Bethlehem in population, heck, the Woodlands alone has more than 50% greater population


Memorial was always primed for the City Am in the fall, upkeep a little suspect at other times the rest of the year, but very playable.   Most folks I met were very pragmatic about it, cheap, a challenge, nice walk or ride in the park, don't lose a lot of balls, good food, quick get-away...


I worked 10 minutes away in downtown for 30 years and really enjoyed it, especially after the redo in 1996 which switched the 9's and improved the greens surrounds... putting the best holes as the front 9...  so one would check in with the starter about tee times just around 11am, perhaps walk directly on joining a group, or grab lunch at Beck's and/or hit some balls, chip & putt ... can get a lot done in two hours and back to work, no worse for wear than playing racquetball or basketball at the downtown Y, and often playing 18 with my golf nut managers ... 

[Mark_Fine]

Steve,
Hey I get it and no problem on my end.  Maybe you can join David and me when I get down that way for a round.  I am sure I will love it.


Hope you can get to the northeast and we can play Bethlehem.  I don’t know if you knew much about the course before we renovated it but I think you will find it a lot of fun and interesting to play. 

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