[Matt_Cohn]

Are there any good solutions? Even the internal OB leaves the same very weird tee shot for the pros. Hideki hit an iron off the tee yesterday. On Google Earth it looks like the fairway could extend straight out towards the houses much farther than it does now with the removal of a small number of trees. Or is there an argument for why it should stay as is?

[David_Tepper]

Aerial photo of the hole here:

https://www.geoffshackelford.com/homepage/2021/1/14/athletes-waialae-gets-a-last-minute-internal-ob

[Brian Finn]

Are there any good solutions? Even the internal OB leaves the same very weird tee shot for the pros. Hideki hit an iron off the tee yesterday. On Google Earth it looks like the fairway could extend straight out towards the houses much farther than it does now with the removal of a small number of trees. Or is there an argument for why it should stay as is?

What is the argument for changing it?

[Kalen Braley]

As much as Pros have been able to take advantage of extra length to score better on longer holes, if it also means some holes are more awkward because they are teeing off with 3 wood/long iron on a par 5, then so be it.  Having internal OB along 10 almost seems a necessity now. 

P.S.  Google Maps doesn't show anywhere else to go as the site looks pretty cramped as is.  https://www.google.com/maps/@21.2742025,-157.7751633,799m/data=!3m1!1e3

[Josh Bills]

Use a local rule.  Hit your tee ball on 17, then hit your tee ball on 18 from the same spot.  Problem solved.  Another 200 yards added.  Unfortunately you would still need the OB on the left for the safety of those on 10.  A nice 720 yard par 5. 

[Tom_Doak]

It is a very awkward hole.  It's also confusing to discuss because they switch the nines for the tournament -- I will use the tournament numbering to describe it below.


Raynor's original routing had the 18th playing back down today's 10th fairway; the original 10th hole was along the beach, now occupied by some very expensive condos and the Kahala Hotel.  [The 11th and 16th holes were originally along the beach as well.]


When the club decided to do those land deals and brought in RTJ, he used the old 18th fairway for the 10th, and moved the 18th hole further inland, so that it doglegs around the 10th.  To prevent people taking liberties with the short-cut, there is a line of palm trees on the left 50-100 yards off the tee, kind of like the "wall" teams form for penalty shots in soccer -- you don't play too close to them for fear of hitting one and having no clear shot for your second.


Until last year, players might try to hook a tee shot to cut the corner, but no one ever tried to play down #10.  I don't know if they lost a tree in the wrong spot, or if the players just hit it so high now they are confident in playing up over the trees -- it's been three years since my last visit.  I think the internal o.b. is an appropriate solution.  It might be the best result permanently, as well -- the trees have always been an awkward solution.

[Matt_Cohn]

What is the argument for changing it?

As I understand it: driver is basically a hit-and-hope shot, but you might as well do it, because hitting a shorter club straight down the fairway leaves you 270+ to the front of the green. There's no upside there when you can at least have a chance at reaching the green by hitting driver and getting lucky with your bounce and/or lie in the rough.


I was unable to find the fairway hit percentage for the hole. Can anyone else find it?

[Amol Yajnik]

Until last year, players might try to hook a tee shot to cut the corner, but no one ever tried to play down #10.  I don't know if they lost a tree in the wrong spot, or if the players just hit it so high now they are confident in playing up over the trees -- it's been three years since my last visit.  I think the internal o.b. is an appropriate solution.  It might be the best result permanently, as well -- the trees have always been an awkward solution.

It's not that there were trees lost to the left of the 18th tee.  It has more to do with the absence of spectators and the huge grandstands/hospitality areas around the 18th green.  With all of those gone, playing down the 10th fairway gave players a clear view to the 18th green and a much shorter 2nd shot into the 18th.  A bunch of players were doing that in the practice rounds, so the internal OB decision was a knee-jerk reaction that came down on Wednesday.

[Erik J. Barzeski]

It's not that there were trees lost to the left of the 18th tee.  It has more to do with the absence of spectators and the huge grandstands/hospitality areas around the 18th green.  With all of those gone, playing down the 10th fairway gave players a clear view to the 18th green and a much shorter 2nd shot into the 18th.  A bunch of players were doing that in the practice rounds, so the internal OB decision was a knee-jerk reaction that came down on Wednesday.

This. They said it was the lack of spectators and temporary buildings that necessitated it this year.

[Matt_Cohn]

They just showed on TV—since 2003, the hardest single fairway to hit on the PGA tour. 37.3%.

[Philippe Binette]

The fairway is hard to hit because they are attacking it at a 90 degree angle.
So basically, the fairway is 30 yards long. When the ball come off the driver, the player doesn't know if it will carry 265 yards or 275 yards so they run out of fairway really quickly.


The only option I see is a shared back tee with the 12th hole, which would open up the angle and adjusting the bunkers a bit so the 18th fairway is easier to hit so playing toward the 10th fairway is a pointless risk

[Tom_Doak]

The fairway is hard to hit because they are attacking it at a 90 degree angle.
So basically, the fairway is 30 yards long. When the ball come off the driver, the player doesn't know if it will carry 265 yards or 275 yards so they run out of fairway really quickly.


The only option I see is a shared back tee with the 12th hole, which would open up the angle and adjusting the bunkers a bit so the 18th fairway is easier to hit so playing toward the 10th fairway is a pointless risk

I actually looked at that possibility a few years ago.  But I think they would still likely take the short cut because it would be easier to get up and over the trees on the more direct line via #10.

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