[Bernie Bell]

"I had missed it after bailing from the thread when it became a bashing of Jack Nicklaus.  I don't agree with his politics, but of course I don't agree with a lot of people's politics, including people who seek to 'cancel' other people on the basis of their politics."

Bingo!

Lets revisit in a year and see how its going.  I assume that support for a violent authoritarian coup attempt could not be written off a "politics" but will be very happy (for the sake of the game of golf) if proven wrong!

Yeah, let's do that.  I'll calendar that for 12 January 2022.  Care to lay odds on whether they've kicked Jack out of the World Golf HOF and the Augusta locker room?  What rubbish.

[David_Elvins]

Yeah, let's do that.  I'll calendar that for 12 January 2022.  Care to lay odds on whether they've kicked Jack out of the World Golf HOF and the Augusta locker room?  What rubbish.

The question, imo, is not whether it happens, but what is the blowback on the game of golf if it doesn't happen?


Obviously there is a lot to play out and although to date Nicklaus has failed this test of integrity, there is a possibility that Nicklaus listens to counsel wiser than him or faces enough commercial pressure to at least publicly express a position that somewhat minimises the harm to his reputation or that of the game.


My opinion is based on the assumption that he won't, and like I said, I will be somewhat relieved if I happen to be wrong.

[Tim Leahy]

"I had missed it after bailing from the thread when it became a bashing of Jack Nicklaus.  I don't agree with his politics, but of course I don't agree with a lot of people's politics, including people who seek to 'cancel' other people on the basis of their politics."

Bingo!

Lets revisit in a year and see how its going.  I assume that support for a violent authoritarian coup attempt could not be written off a "politics" but will be very happy (for the sake of the game of golf) if proven wrong!

Yeah, let's do that.  I'll calendar that for 12 January 2022.  Care to lay odds on whether they've kicked Jack out of the World Golf HOF and the Augusta locker room?  What rubbish.

OJ is still in the football HOF and welcome in the USC locker room, so that's not a great measure.

[JLahrman]

The world should be grateful to golf. I'm thankful for anything that kept Donald Trump out of the White House, off of Twitter, and away from rallies. Golf is the #1 thing that has accomplished that over the past four years. I would gladly have paid more taxes to keep him playing 36 a day every day.


Other than that, I think golf has been laying pretty low. The pandemic has meant that lots more golf has been being played. I don't know whether that's been regular golfers playing more or new golfers trying the game. If it's been more the latter then the image of golf has probably improved.



Lots of people on this board like to disparage Top Golf. While it's not golf, a lot of Top Golf patrons probably don't think golf is a dorky as they otherwise would have.


I don't think who Jack Nicklaus voted for has anything to do with the image of golf.


We've got a thread here right now about "US public's you'd want to play every day". Popular entries include Bandon, Streamsong, Wild Horse, Rustic, Mid-Pines, etc. Huh? Thankfully, most golfers want to play the goat track right next door to them every day! That should be the image of golf.

[John Emerson]

The world should be grateful to golf. I'm thankful for anything that kept Donald Trump out of the White House, off of Twitter, and away from rallies. Golf is the #1 thing that has accomplished that over the past four years. I would gladly have paid more taxes to keep him playing 36 a day every day.


Other than that, I think golf has been laying pretty low. The pandemic has meant that lots more golf has been being played. I don't know whether that's been regular golfers playing more or new golfers trying the game. If it's been more the latter then the image of golf has probably improved.



Lots of people on this board like to disparage Top Golf. While it's not golf, a lot of Top Golf patrons probably don't think golf is a dorky as they otherwise would have.


I don't think who Jack Nicklaus voted for has anything to do with the image of golf.


We've got a thread here right now about "US public's you'd want to play every day". Popular entries include Bandon, Streamsong, Wild Horse, Rustic, Mid-Pines, etc. Huh? Thankfully, most golfers want to play the goat track right next door to them every day! That should be the image of golf.

I agree with your sentiments 99.9%.  Only thing I disagree with is in red.  The fact that golfs first or second greatest ambassador aligns with trumpengroper ideals and promotes them, further perpetuates the thought that golf is for the rich and white.

[JLahrman]

I don't think who Jack Nicklaus voted for has anything to do with the image of golf.

I agree with your sentiments 99.9%.  Only thing I disagree with is in red.  The fact that golfs first or second greatest ambassador aligns with trumpengroper ideals and promotes them, further perpetuates the thought that golf is for the rich and white.

John, I guess I just don't feel like many casual golfers or non-golfers even noticed what Nicklaus said, or associate him with Trump at all. I was disappointed to see Nicklaus's remarks before the election last year, and since he went public then it would be nice to see him say something public now. But it's not like Nicklaus is off in batshit-crazy Curt Schilling territory or is being an internet troll. IMHO I don't think Nicklaus's moved the needle for golf's image a bit, and if it did it was more than compensated for by the PGA's recent disassociation with Trump. If golf's image has taken a hit because of the last four years of this administration, it would be because of Trump himself, not because Nicklaus made a statement or two about Trump.

[Sean_A]

The world should be grateful to golf. I'm thankful for anything that kept Donald Trump out of the White House, off of Twitter, and away from rallies. Golf is the #1 thing that has accomplished that over the past four years. I would gladly have paid more taxes to keep him playing 36 a day every day.


Other than that, I think golf has been laying pretty low. The pandemic has meant that lots more golf has been being played. I don't know whether that's been regular golfers playing more or new golfers trying the game. If it's been more the latter then the image of golf has probably improved.



Lots of people on this board like to disparage Top Golf. While it's not golf, a lot of Top Golf patrons probably don't think golf is a dorky as they otherwise would have.


I don't think who Jack Nicklaus voted for has anything to do with the image of golf.


We've got a thread here right now about "US public's you'd want to play every day". Popular entries include Bandon, Streamsong, Wild Horse, Rustic, Mid-Pines, etc. Huh? Thankfully, most golfers want to play the goat track right next door to them every day! That should be the image of golf.

Just to be sure, it is OK not to feel obligated to play the goat track next door everyday? I might slit my wrists if playing my local was my Groundhog Day.

Ciao

[JLahrman]

Just to be sure, it is OK not to feel obligated to play the goat track next door everyday? I might slit my wrists if playing my local was my Groundhog Day.

It's possible that I'm being too literal regarding the title of that thread. Some people were listing some local favorites. But others were going right to the top shelf of non-private courses in the country, with the implication (if I'm taking the title of the thread literally) that not much else would suffice for everyday play.


I get that the GCA-minded folks out here have a higher bar for architecture than the average player, and also generally have the means and desire to see a lot of courses. But golf would be in a lot of trouble if most golfers weren't pretty happy to play the vast majority of their golf at the handful of public courses around them.

[John Emerson]

Just to be sure, it is OK not to feel obligated to play the goat track next door everyday? I might slit my wrists if playing my local was my Groundhog Day.

It's possible that I'm being too literal regarding the title of that thread. Some people were listing some local favorites. But others were going right to the top shelf of non-private courses in the country, with the implication (if I'm taking the title of the thread literally) that not much else would suffice for everyday play.


I get that the GCA-minded folks out here have a higher bar for architecture than the average player, and also generally have the means and desire to see a lot of courses. But golf would be in a lot of trouble if most golfers weren't pretty happy to play the vast majority of their golf at the handful of public courses around them.

I don’t think you’re being too literal at all!  Call a spade a spade.  The overwhelming vast majority of golfers play at all the courses far far outside of the top 100...or 200 for that matter.

[Brian Brown]

In todays NYTimes there is an article about the "Course in the Southeast Bronx".  If you are so inclined to read the comments on the article you will see that golf at least in this vocal group is not well regarded.  The comments have the same negative stereotypes that we have heard for forever:  rich white man's game that excludes everyone else, waste of space that is better used for other public enjoyment as well as the idea that all courses use excessive water and fertilizer and pollute the environment.

[Rob Marshall]

In todays NYTimes there is an article about the "Course in the Southeast Bronx".  If you are so inclined to read the comments on the article you will see that golf at least in this vocal group is not well regarded.  The comments have the same negative stereotypes that we have heard for forever:  rich white man's game that excludes everyone else, waste of space that is better used for other public enjoyment as well as the idea that all courses use excessive water and fertilizer and pollute the environment.

You would think that a city owned course would have very discounted rates for residents like Bethpage and Torrey pines. I assume it was built with taxpayer dollars. Also a program to introduce beginners to the game.

[Mike Sweeney]

In todays NYTimes there is an article about the "Course in the Southeast Bronx".  If you are so inclined to read the comments on the article you will see that golf at least in this vocal group is not well regarded.  The comments have the same negative stereotypes that we have heard for forever:  rich white man's game that excludes everyone else, waste of space that is better used for other public enjoyment as well as the idea that all courses use excessive water and fertilizer and pollute the environment.

You would think that a city owned course would have very discounted rates for residents like Bethpage and Torrey pines. I assume it was built with taxpayer dollars. Also a program to introduce beginners to the game.

1) I am a NYC resident, and I can play Trump Ferry Point for a reduced rate. To date, I have not played Ferry Point or any Trump course. Honestly, not for political reasons, just not that interested in "faux links" next to major highways.


2) My son is Active Duty Military, and he can (maybe it ends) get a cheap rate at Trump Ferry Point during the week. We tried once or twice, but it just did not work out, logistically.


3) My son has served, serves, and will serve under President Obama, President Trump, and soon President Biden. My suggestion is to read the US Constitution. It sucks, and it is the best deal out there, in my opinion. Stop at https://constitutioncenter.org between your rounds at Pine Valley and Merion. We have a wonderful country:


PS - Rob and Brian - Not addressing you directly. It just fell in my feed on a Friday.

[Brian Brown]

You would think that a city owned course would have very discounted rates for residents like Bethpage and Torrey pines. I assume it was built with taxpayer dollars. Also a program to introduce beginners to the game.

The Bronx is not lacking for public golf.  I believe there are four other city run courses in the Bronx alone.  In addition they have more park acreage than anywhere else in the city.  The First Tee has a learning center also in the borough no more than 4 miles away. 
My point with the article was that people outside the game don't see the benefits the game offers and their image of golf certainly hasn't improved.  I think we as golfers need to make sure that people understand that the game has great benefits for health, the environment and the building of character.  Organizations like the First Tee and Youth on Course are what will change that image and need to be
brought to the publics attention.

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