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Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
The 10th and the 13th (at least in its current form) at Augusta National call for a big hook from the right handed player.  13 looks particularly awkward to my eye as it has narrowed over the years. 


Would we like those tee shots on any other course?

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
You don't HAVE TO hit a hook on those two holes, but it's a distinct advantage if you can.  That's not easy to set up, but pretty cool if you can.

David Ober

  • Karma: +0/-0
You don't HAVE TO hit a hook on those two holes, but it's a distinct advantage if you can.  That's not easy to set up, but pretty cool if you can.


Exactly. You just can't attack those holes without a hook. I actually really like holes that greatly favor bending the ball one way or the other off the tee. One or two a round is fine by me.

Pete Lavallee

  • Karma: +0/-0
With the original green on 10, right of the squiggly bunker, you needed to stay to the right side of the fairway. Catching the speed slot to the left gave you a horrible angle in. I guess you can blame Perry Maxwell not the Good Dr. For requiring the big hook!
"...one inoculated with the virus must swing a golf-club or perish."  Robert Hunter

Ben Hollerbach

  • Karma: +0/-0
Exactly. You just can't attack those holes without a hook. I actually really like holes that greatly favor bending the ball one way or the other off the tee. One or two a round is fine by me.


BS! In both cases a dead straight drive of 290 yards will stay in the fairway and will not limit your chance to hit an approach shot close. A player is not penalized for hitting a straight ball on either hole, but they are not given a super advantage either.

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
There is a local course with a short par 4 where one can hit a mid iron straight off the tee which leaves a 150-170 yard approach from a downhill lie to an uphill green but if you can hit a big hook with more club, you have a short wedge shot. 


It strikes me as similar to 10 and 13 in the choices it presents.  Most people strongly dislike the hole. 




jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
You don't HAVE TO hit a hook on those two holes, but it's a distinct advantage if you can.  That's not easy to set up, but pretty cool if you can.


This.
To say nothing of the contours on the ground and the challenges they present.
And its hardly a 'duck hook"
Ask Rory how well duck hooks work on those holes.
The holes call for draws- one of the ONLY shots made harder by modern equipment-
Hence the difficulty the players have on 13.
The players have grown up with minimally curving equipment and hot enough equipment that a left to right slider loses no distance and has become the preferred shot.When they say "duck hook" they mean a shot they rarely use with a driver anymore-a draw.


I will say the drone shots highlight how well Augusta has retained its relevance via trees, a direct result of the USGA,'s dereliction of duty.While initially not a fan of the recent plantings,their maturity and the never ending further distance advances have become a reasonable match,while retaining shotmaking excitement rather than the bomb, gouge and pitch of contrived deep rough setups.


Ive never watched this much Augusta on TV and must say the camera work is incredible at finally showing the contours and the fall texture is incredible.
Sure would've loved to have seen no overseed this go round.(and a mid October date)


Sub air has to be the most over rated priduct on the market.....
« Last Edit: November 13, 2020, 12:53:31 PM by jeffwarne »
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Matt_Cohn

  • Karma: +0/-0
Exactly. You just can't attack those holes without a hook. I actually really like holes that greatly favor bending the ball one way or the other off the tee. One or two a round is fine by me.


BS! In both cases a dead straight drive of 290 yards will stay in the fairway and will not limit your chance to hit an approach shot close. A player is not penalized for hitting a straight ball on either hole, but they are not given a super advantage either.


I haven't been to Augusta, but I don't think this is correct:
  • If a 290 straight ball were totally fine, I feel like you'd see more guys just doing that?
  • Several pros have specifically referred to hitting duck/snap hooks off of those tees.
  • Right side of the fairway is a disadvantage on both of those holes. On 10, you lose run out and have a sidehill lie. On 13, you have a much hillier lie than down by the creek.
  • Google Maps shows that direct lines to preferred landing areas on both of those holes are extremely close if not within the overhanging trees.

Jeff_Brauer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Pre Rees, Medinah No. 3 was known for both snap hooks (no. 9 tee shot) and snap slices (no. 18)  The root cause is simple - Bendelow put the doglegs at 200 yards, not thinking about increasing tee shot distances.  It's one reason I typically shy away from sharp doglegs, those over 30 degrees, for sure.
Jeff Brauer, ASGCA Director of Outreach

Ben Hollerbach

  • Karma: +0/-0
In both cases the approach lie may not be flat, but it does not hurt you to play an approach from the right side of either hole. In the first round the tenth was birdied only 6 times, both Mickelson and Thomas made birdie from the right side after hitting straight drives. There may have been more, but at least 1/3rd of the birdies came from that spot.


Yes, there is an advantage to playing a right to left shot off those holes, but they are not a requirement for playing those holes well. Especially having to hit a hook, let alone a duck hook. That simple all I'm trying to say.

James Reader

  • Karma: +0/-0
We clearly have different ideas of what a duck hook looks like!!

Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
I laud seeing the whole golf course. I never want to see patrons nor grandstands again.
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Just watched Sung-jae hit a fade with a three metal off 10.
Center cut, caught the bowl-got some roll-left center of fairway.
The opposite of a "duck hook" though hitting the fade into a right to left slope rightfully cost him extra roll
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
the corollary is the success of left handed golfers. It is all a matter of perspective.


Jeff W - Rahm can now speak about duck hooks, too.

archie_struthers

  • Karma: +0/-0
 ???


Interesting that Rory M is +2 on #13 for the first three rounds. He is seven under (-7) on the other three par fives.


You would think that if anyone would eat up this hole it would be Rory.


Andrew Harvie

  • Karma: +0/-0
Exactly. You just can't attack those holes without a hook. I actually really like holes that greatly favor bending the ball one way or the other off the tee. One or two a round is fine by me.


BS! In both cases a dead straight drive of 290 yards will stay in the fairway and will not limit your chance to hit an approach shot close. A player is not penalized for hitting a straight ball on either hole, but they are not given a super advantage either.


I haven't been to Augusta, but I don't think this is correct:
  • If a 290 straight ball were totally fine, I feel like you'd see more guys just doing that?
  • Several pros have specifically referred to hitting duck/snap hooks off of those tees.
  • Right side of the fairway is a disadvantage on both of those holes. On 10, you lose run out and have a sidehill lie. On 13, you have a much hillier lie than down by the creek.
  • Google Maps shows that direct lines to preferred landing areas on both of those holes are extremely close if not within the overhanging trees.


Google Earth Pro is telling me its 298 yards straight through the fairway on 10. 70 feet downhill on that line. It's why guys are often pulling 3 woods, lets them have more room.


275 yards straight through on 13, not assuming they hit it on a straight line over the corner, which has a lot more room