Awkward Architecture: Quirk That Just Don't Work

[Mike Hendren]

The 17th green at Cape Arundel.
The 17th hole at Pebble Beach. (Throwing the Treehouse a bone since this is one of my favorite golf holes in America.)
The 12th fairway at The Old Course (Doesn't work when the caddy tells you the best line from the tee is the right rough.)
The "so called Redan" at Shinnecock Hills.
The (wait for it) Biarritz at Yale.

Sometimes quirk just misses.  Doesn't it?

If so, other examples?

Bogey

[Pete Lavallee]

Bogey,


Just got back from PB and I hit a low 3 iron from 170; ball hit pin high 6 paces on and stayed on the back of the green, 2 putted for par. What’s not to like! The new green does give you a chance to hit and hold on the US Open side; thankfully we didn’t get to play the Pro Am side.


First time playing #12 @ TOC I went to the tee and stripped one down the middle before our caddies and playing partners had arrived. Sure enough I was in one of the central bunkers!


What’s not to like about 9 at Yale? One of the deepest Biarritz swales on the planet. Shame the pin is often in the front section.

[Ira Fishman]

Number 16 at Royal Dornoch is the only quirk laden hole I have disliked but maybe it is not quirky and just not a good hole. On the other hand, I liked Number 14 at The Island Club which many would deem a bad hole, and my wife found Number 13 at NB over the top.


Ira

[Ronald Montesano]

Quirk misses when you misspell it in the thread title.

[Peter Pallotta]

Bogey -
a question for you and others who have played and liked a lot of quirk, from someone (me) who has played little and not much liked the few examples of quirk I have played:
What makes quirk "miss"? For you, why doesn't it work when it doesn't?

[Sean_A]

I immediately thought of European Club.

Ciao

[mike_malone]

While I think it’s only quirk if it works I’ll nominate The Road Hole which has a near impossible approach angle for a low shot.

[Mike Hendren]

Peter, imho quirk should be negotiable at worst and useful at best.


Cheers.

[Sean_A]

While I think it’s only quirk if it works I’ll nominate The Road Hole which has a near impossible approach angle for a low shot.

Not if its the second approach shot.

Ciao

[Thomas Dai]

Would greens shaped like fish heads and multiple chocolate drop mounds count as quirk?
Atb

[Mike Hendren]

Would greens shaped like fish heads and multiple chocolate drop mounds count as quirk?
Atb

Context is critical but the former is a novelty while the latter is quirk. Nobody did chocolate drops like The Old Man.

[Tony_Muldoon]

Repetition can quickly turn quirk into yawn.

Too many blind greens.

Homages to Sawgrass 17 on courses largely devoid of water.

[Jim Hoak]

I think quirk only works when it happens naturally.  When it is forced--or done just to call attention to it--it misses.
For example, holes that crisscross on a course are a pet peeve of mine, although I tolerate it on old courses where there seems to be no other alternative.  Some of the middle holes at TOC almost crisscross, and that seems fine--even charming.  But when Greg Norman did it at Doonbeg, I find it objectionable.  Seems to be done there for no reason of necessity.

[Mike Hendren]

Interesting take, Jim.  Thanks.  On the other hand I tend to see quirk as generally manufactured.  Off the top of my head I thought of a few of my favorites:

The tiny 15th green at Fenway.
Pit at North Berwick's West Links.
The unique 4th green at Spyglass.
The amazing 11th green at Yahnundasis. 

Cheers.

Bogey

[Jim Hoak]

Michael, there is a pit at Carmel Valley Ranch, done by Pete Dye.  I certainly find it objectionable, but I kind of like the one at North Berwick--one seems natural, and the other only contrived.

[Ira Fishman]

I wonder if we are conditioned to the fact that earth moving equipment generally has led to less quirk that is part and parcel of the land. I remember very little of Doonbeg but that is probably because it was sandwiched between Ballybunion Old and Lahinch (talk about brilliant quirk). However, generally Number 14 at Bandon Trails (great hole) and Number 8 at Kingsbarns (not great) are among the few modern courses that I remember having holes with quirk. Add Old Mac 3.


Ira

[Sean_A]

Interesting take, Jim.  Thanks.  On the other hand I tend to see quirk as generally manufactured.  Off the top of my head I thought of a few of my favorites:

The tiny 15th green at Fenway.
Pit at North Berwick's West Links.
The unique 4th green at Spyglass.
The amazing 11th green at Yahnundasis. 

Cheers.

Bogey

Speaking of Pit, it's a world class charming hole with the prevailing wind. Turn the wind around and the charm disappears to leave a very difficult hole. It's brilliant either way because wind direction can only top up an already brilliant hole. Just acknowledging that the poor souls who have only seen the hole in a contrary wind and thought WTF? That said, I topped successive drives on successive days last month and hit 4 wood into that green both days. It's doable even for hack like me.

For the record, manufactured or not, quirk is a cornerstone of architecture and should be accepted as such.

Ciao

[Adam Lawrence]

I think quirk only works when it happens naturally.  When it is forced--or done just to call attention to it--it misses.
For example, holes that crisscross on a course are a pet peeve of mine, although I tolerate it on old courses where there seems to be no other alternative.  Some of the middle holes at TOC almost crisscross, and that seems fine--even charming.  But when Greg Norman did it at Doonbeg, I find it objectionable.  Seems to be done there for no reason of necessity.

And yet, I think of the first time I saw the fourth hole at Sweetens Cove, a par three that can play between ninety and more than 200 yards, with a 20,000 sq ft green that is mostly blinded by a man-made mound. I told Rob Collins that, although I loved the course with a passion, I thought he was insane to build that hole.


But what do I know? The hole is one of the most loved at Sweetens.

[Ally Mcintosh]

I’m a bit like Jim. I prefer my quirk to be natural; or at least resulting from the routing.


Pit at NB qualifies because the wall pre-dates the hole.

[Sean_A]

I’m a bit like Jim. I prefer my quirk to be natural; or at least resulting from the routing.

Pit at NB qualifies because the wall pre-dates the hole.

Even we call natural, the unbelievably well placed fairway bunkers aren't.

Ciao

[Erik J. Barzeski]

While I think it’s only quirk if it works I’ll nominate The Road Hole which has a near impossible approach angle for a low shot.

I bounced and rolled a 6I from 180 (that flew about 95) to 15 or 20 feet on the Road Hole.

15-20 feet right of the hole, to be clear.

[Peter Flory]

There was a lot of manufactured quirk at the original Erin Hills.  Tree in the fairway on 1, tiny green on 2, the 3rd green, Dell hole, biarritz par 5 10th.  All of it seems to have been erased.  The 2 green is still small, but modified from the original.  Even the bye hole was a quirky concept on a new course at the time. 

[Ben Malach]

Adam:


I know I am in the minority on this but I think that the quirk at Sweetens Cove on almost every hole is too much for me. Its almost the line for me as what works as a quirk or what is a gimmick. As every hole has a bunch of random forced features on a relatively flat site. If Tad and Rob had dialed it back 20% I think they still would have had a really cool golf course, but in return I think it would be more playable and simpler to maintain every day.

[archie_struthers]

 


Old York CC in NJ is a Gary Player course with a lot of quirky holes. The first hole has a fairly large swath of rough/fescue right in the middle of the fairway about 250 out from the back tees when I played there about 20 years ago . It could be gone now for all I know. It wasn't a lot or a cross hazard more like a bad haircut. Also the course had many sharp angles and a ninety degree par four of about 270 yards (number 10)


Didn't work

[Niall C]

I’m a bit like Jim. I prefer my quirk to be natural; or at least resulting from the routing.

Pit at NB qualifies because the wall pre-dates the hole.

Even we call natural, the unbelievably well placed fairway bunkers aren't.

Ciao

Firstly, quirk suggests something unusual or different and as we know, back in the day playing over walls was very much the norm. Where the Pit is maybe a bit unusual is that as time went on the hole direction changed from more head on to the wall (ie. from Quarry green) to where it's played from now.


Also, while the wall pre-dates the hole, the routing doesn't require the position of the green to be over the wall so it is very much a contrivance.


Niall