Putting

[jeffwarne]

Reverse overlap with a flanged bullseye, and I'm not that old

learn this way
then adapt if you must
can't even imagine teaching a kid to start with one of these branding irons with wings on a stick

[Kalen Braley]

I estimate that it takes me 10-12 seconds from the time I start reading the putt (assuming I am putting first) until I make the stroke. Is that within the norm?

Ira

Yes, very fast....especially if you are putting first.

If not putting first, and you've had a chance to look at it, then that seems like a good amount of time, but still on the quick side.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Reverse overlap with a flanged bullseye, and I'm not that old

learn this way
then adapt if you must
can't even imagine teaching a kid to start with one of these branding irons with wings on a stick

I Cory Pavin still using a Bull's Eye?

[John Crowley]

Reverse overlap with a flanged bullseye, and I'm not that old

learn this way
then adapt if you must
can't even imagine teaching a kid to start with one of these branding irons with wings on a stick

I Cory Pavin still using a Bull's Eye?

Yup

[David_Tepper]

Bob Charles and Mark McNulty both putted great with a Bullseye as well.

[Ira Fishman]

I estimate that it takes me 10-12 seconds from the time I start reading the putt (assuming I am putting first) until I make the stroke. Is that within the norm?

Ira

Yes, very fast....especially if you are putting first.

If not putting first, and you've had a chance to look at it, then that seems like a good amount of time, but still on the quick side.

May explain my poor putting. Never take a practice stroke. Never look from anywhere but behind the ball. But also never take a practice swing on full shots either.


Ira

[A.G._Crockett]

There is quite a bit of backstory to it, but about 6 years ago, I realized I wasn't likely to ever hit the ball any farther, which meant that I wasn't likely to ever hit the badell closer, which meant that I'd better find a way to putt as well as possible.

So I started putting side saddle, and it's maybe the best golf decision I ever made.  It's just a better way to roll a golf ball, period.  Very natural, binocular vision, one hand performing the motion, done the way you roll a ball, or shoot a free throw, or toss a wad of paper, or throw a dart, or bowl, or bunt; most anything in any sport that is a precision movement. 


One of the issues with side saddle is that you can't walk into Golf Galaxy and mess around the the side saddle putters, so some experimentation is involved.  Bobby Grace has been making beautiful putters for many years, and for the last few years, he's been turning out some wonderful side saddle putters; I currently use one of his called the F22. 


I really cringe now when I see somebody still using a broomstick.  They're already using one hand, which is better, but they're swinging their arm across their body, which isn't better, and dealing with the visual distortion of standing parallel to the line, which is even worse.  But I digress...

[Rob Marshall]

There is quite a bit of backstory to it, but about 6 years ago, I realized I wasn't likely to ever hit the ball any farther, which meant that I wasn't likely to ever hit the badell closer, which meant that I'd better find a way to putt as well as possible.

So I started putting side saddle, and it's maybe the best golf decision I ever made.  It's just a better way to roll a golf ball, period.  Very natural, binocular vision, one hand performing the motion, done the way you roll a ball, or shoot a free throw, or toss a wad of paper, or throw a dart, or bowl, or bunt; most anything in any sport that is a precision movement. 


One of the issues with side saddle is that you can't walk into Golf Galaxy and mess around the the side saddle putters, so some experimentation is involved.  Bobby Grace has been making beautiful putters for many years, and for the last few years, he's been turning out some wonderful side saddle putters; I currently use one of his called the F22. 


I really cringe now when I see somebody still using a broomstick.  They're already using one hand, which is better, but they're swinging their arm across their body, which isn't better, and dealing with the visual distortion of standing parallel to the line, which is even worse.  But I digress...

I thought side saddle was illegal no?

[David Ober]

I was previously NOT a very good putter for a scratch/below golfer. I would miss one or more 3 - 4 foot putts every round (probably averaged 1.5 misses per round). I got sick of that about a two years ago and committed to fixing it, which I have. I did three main things:

I now use the line on (virtually) all putts.

• I went to a VERY upright (77.5 degrees) putter that is 36 inches long
• I switched to a CLOSED stance, which gives my right arm plenty of room to move DOWN my line (I'm fat and have a big belly)
• I switched to the claw (the same version that Mickelson uses)

I also have come to believe that ALL good putting starts with finding the right "speed of the day" on a straight-in 4-footer. I now practice those more than I have in my entire life. It's pretty much all I practice (when I do, which is rare).

[Erik J. Barzeski]

I thought side saddle was illegal no?

Straddle (the line) putting is illegal. Side saddle is not.

[Peter Pallotta]

I got a bit better as a putter when I realized that, with an overlap grip and an old Ping Anser putter, if I *think* straight-back-and-straight-through the putter doesn’t actually *go* straight-back-straight-and-through — but that’s just fine, because at least the ‘arc’, which is what the putter and my stroke seems to *want* to do, naturally, is now much subtler, ie it doesn’t get too inside/open going back or close too quickly going forward....all of which seems to keep it ‘square’ for that crucial bit longer. But only if I (gently) think ‘straight-back-and-straight-through’ throughout the entire stroke, without ever  trying to force it to happen.


 

[Pat Burke]

I do it at night - with the 15-year-old daughter of the Dean.
F.

Bob Hope??
Or
Mitch C?

[Pat Burke]

80-90% reverse overlap
As a kid I learned cross handed and had success at times that way as well


I was a tinkerer all the time
Good short putter


Not great long putter until I turned 55 [size=78%]and worked with Stockton. By then it was too late!![/size]

[Jeff Schley]

I envy the confidence some of you have in your putting game. Wish I had it. I was traditional until a 2007 trip to Whistling Straits and lipped out 6 putts from a variety of lengths. I switched the next day to left hand low and became an average putter to streaky at best. Last couple years haven't played much and my putting isn't good at all, but I don't play much let alone practice. I watch some of the old matches on TV and see Palmer use almost all wrists, which I have "too much of" apparently.

[A.G._Crockett]

There is quite a bit of backstory to it, but about 6 years ago, I realized I wasn't likely to ever hit the ball any farther, which meant that I wasn't likely to ever hit the badell closer, which meant that I'd better find a way to putt as well as possible.

So I started putting side saddle, and it's maybe the best golf decision I ever made.  It's just a better way to roll a golf ball, period.  Very natural, binocular vision, one hand performing the motion, done the way you roll a ball, or shoot a free throw, or toss a wad of paper, or throw a dart, or bowl, or bunt; most anything in any sport that is a precision movement. 


One of the issues with side saddle is that you can't walk into Golf Galaxy and mess around the the side saddle putters, so some experimentation is involved.  Bobby Grace has been making beautiful putters for many years, and for the last few years, he's been turning out some wonderful side saddle putters; I currently use one of his called the F22. 


I really cringe now when I see somebody still using a broomstick.  They're already using one hand, which is better, but they're swinging their arm across their body, which isn't better, and dealing with the visual distortion of standing parallel to the line, which is even worse.  But I digress...

I thought side saddle was illegal no?

Perhaps you were confused by what happened several years ago with DeChambeau, who putted side saddle quite a bit during his amateur career, and announced that he would be going back to it. 


He putted side saddle for a couple of tournaments before the USGA ruled the putter that he was using to be non-conforming, which I knew was likely the case the first day I watched.  What has always bothered me about it was that I felt reasonably certain that he knew as well that he was using a non-conforming putter from the beginning; I think all of us that putt this way know the pertinent equipment rules pretty well because we have to have the putters more or less custom built.  Some of the guys that build them even make available a letter from the USGA stating that their putter has been ruled to be conforming.

If you aren't referring to DeChambeau, then Erik is spot on about straddling the line.  The only other question would be anchoring, which none of the side saddle guys do anyway.  Think of it as putting with one hand from an EXTREMELY open stance...

[Erik J. Barzeski]

He putted side saddle for a couple of tournaments before the USGA ruled the putter that he was using to be non-conforming, which I knew was likely the case the first day I watched.  What has always bothered me about it was that I felt reasonably certain that he knew as well that he was using a non-conforming putter from the beginning; I think all of us that putt this way know the pertinent equipment rules pretty well because we have to have the putters more or less custom built.  Some of the guys that build them even make available a letter from the USGA stating that their putter has been ruled to be conforming.

The lie angle must be at least 10° from vertical, yeah. Traditional putters are around 70°, but getting close to that 80° limit is good for side saddle putters. What's your putter AG? 80°?

[archie_struthers]

 


Aha, sure to three putt after writing this , the golf gods you know but putting is such a favorite subject of mine. When you are younger I think it's as much the vision as anything that allows people to remember how fondly they used to putt. So get a friend to stand behind you and make sure you are hitting it where you are aiming. Eyes change with the years.


Reading greens is an art and the best caddies/putters tend to first walk behind the hole and look at which way its been cut into the turf, it's really a great tool. When doing this you can also get the feel in your feet walking back to the ball. It's also a settling routine that doesn't slow play.


Think speed first and line second when putting.  If the speed isn't right the line becomes moot. Caddied a bunch of rounds for Crenshaw at Pine Valley and he may have asked me the break in a green two or three times in twenty rounds. However he asked me the speed of a particular green about ten times per eighteen holes. That's telling!

 You have to be realistic but optimistic when putting   Trust your read but err on the high side more often than not. This becomes more and more important on longer putts. If you over read a big breaking putt by two feet on the high side with proper speed you end up with two footer, the same misread low often runs out 4-5 feet below the hole given the slope. Miss it high !






Caddied close to 20 rounds for Ben Crenshaw at PV and he  may have asked me the line a couple times .

[David_Tepper]

Tales of a frustrated (side-saddle) putter:

https://randyhaag.com/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7LskCXLtpA

[Tommy Williamsen]

I have changed how I see the line. For years I saw a spot I aimed at, i.e. two balls left, a little mark on the green etc. Then I took a lesson from Dave Pelze who said there are two kinds of putters, those who do that and those that see the arch of the ball. That's me. I picture the whole putt kind of like the line they show on a tv broadcast. I has made a world of difference. I also found that I tend to play more break that way.

[Kalen Braley]

I envy the confidence some of you have in your putting game. Wish I had it. I was traditional until a 2007 trip to Whistling Straits and lipped out 6 putts from a variety of lengths. I switched the next day to left hand low and became an average putter to streaky at best. Last couple years haven't played much and my putting isn't good at all, but I don't play much let alone practice. I watch some of the old matches on TV and see Palmer use almost all wrists, which I have "too much of" apparently.

Don't envy me Jeff, if you saw me hitting the driver, it would quickly switch to pity! 

Putting is the only thing in golf that came naturally, even long before I hit any other club.  I've always had the ability to see and feel lines on the green.  And when I start thinking on the green, I usually putt worse...

[Mike Hendren]

It needs to be said: putting is silly.


Bogey

[A.G._Crockett]

He putted side saddle for a couple of tournaments before the USGA ruled the putter that he was using to be non-conforming, which I knew was likely the case the first day I watched.  What has always bothered me about it was that I felt reasonably certain that he knew as well that he was using a non-conforming putter from the beginning; I think all of us that putt this way know the pertinent equipment rules pretty well because we have to have the putters more or less custom built.  Some of the guys that build them even make available a letter from the USGA stating that their putter has been ruled to be conforming.

The lie angle must be at least 10° from vertical, yeah. Traditional putters are around 70°, but getting close to that 80° limit is good for side saddle putters. What's your putter AG? 80°?

Erik,

Yes, and the fact that you know the 10* rule is what bothered me about BDC.  I guarantee you that he knew it, too, along with the corollary that if the putter is designed so that it can be used vertically, it can be ruled non-conforming and an additional angle of up to 24* (I think) might be required.  When I saw BDC putt with the shaft absolutely vertical but the heel of the putter NOT off the ground, well...

The other thing you want in a side saddle putter is very little loft, usually only a degree or a degree and a half.  Beyond that, it's a matter of preference; getting the length right and figuring out what weight you want.  Besides Bobby Grace, the best side saddle putter is probably the one made by a guy named Juan Elizondo, who teaches out on Tour and has worked with Singh and Simpson, among others. 

[Ira Fishman]

Does anyone use different putters on bent and Bermuda?

[JMEvensky]

Does anyone use different putters on bent and Bermuda?

Not exactly on point but I grew up with a guy (a great player and still the best amateur putter I've ever played with) who used different putters for slow and fast greens (everything was common Bermuda). He putted with an 8802 on fast greens and a Ray Cook mallet on slow--said the RC was more solid and he could make the same stroke as he did on faster greens.


I doubt many instructors would've recommended this but it sure worked for him.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Does anyone use different putters on bent and Bermuda?

Not exactly on point but I grew up with a guy (a great player and still the best amateur putter I've ever played with) who used different putters for slow and fast greens (everything was common Bermuda). He putted with an 8802 on fast greens and a Ray Cook mallet on slow--said the RC was more solid and he could make the same stroke as he did on faster greens.


I doubt many instructors would've recommended this but it sure worked for him.

Many years ago I did use different putters for fast and slower greens. It didn't work very well. It seemed that Icould use the same stroke for different speed greens but didn't work out that way.