[Paul OConnor]

Does anyone know Brian LaBardi? He has played and reviewed most of the Chicago greats. It pays to read the rest of his reviews to put this beaut about Chicago Highlands in perspective.


https://www.top100golfcourses.com/golf-course/chicago-highlands

I don't know this LaBardi guy,  but I share the same opinion of Chicago Highlands.  Although I don't mind the volcano 9th, and do like some of the bold greens, like the 7th, the rest of the course is very average Arthur Hills pablum.  Looks like a links, plays like an over watered target golf course.    A Doak 4 at best. 

[Jon Claydon]

The best thing about Chicago golf was that there was a lot of money here in the late 1800s/ early 1900s.  So even though the land is uninspiring, there are still a lot of really great old tracks.

The land at Shoreacres is so dramatic for this area even though it really wouldn't be that special in other areas of the Country.  After Shoreacres, I don't even know what would be the next best land here.  Maybe the back nine at Dubsdread or the land at the Merit Club.

Negatives:
Flat land
Heavy soil
Short season
Most good courses are private
No courses utilize the lake

The land at Olympia Fields North is pretty darn good in my humble opinion. 

[Jason Thurman]

I'd be excited if I heard somebody say they were heading to Chicago for a golf trip, but I'd probably be more excited if they told me they were heading to Chattanooga. Blake, have you played around Chattanooga?


A home base of Green Lake, WI puts you within 1:30 or so of at least seven legitimate Top 100 contenders, at least 5 other courses of national acclaim, and at least 5 or 6 hidden gems that might actually be better than anything on the "national acclaim" list. Kohler might not be enough to beat Chicago by itself, but considering that there have been Chicagoans on this site who cite Spring Valley as the best public in the Chicago area, I think we must also consider the Whistling Straits/Sand Valley/Erin Hills triangle a single destination that clearly belongs on this list.

[Bill Seitz]

Considering that there have been Chicagoans on this site who cite Spring Valley as the best public in the Chicago area, I think we must also consider the Whistling Straits/Sand Valley/Erin Hills triangle a single destination that clearly belongs on this list.

Jud Tigerman is no longer a Chicagoan, and his opinion is suspect at best. 

[Jason Thurman]

I said "Chicagoans" because I just assumed there was at least one other person he eventually brought over to Team "You're Still in Chicagoland when you get to the Cheese Castle."


Hell, just consider all the legendary GCAers who have left Chicago in the last 10-15 years. When's the last time a golf architecture geek moved away from Ripon?

[Ira Fishman]

I'd be excited if I heard somebody say they were heading to Chicago for a golf trip, but I'd probably be more excited if they told me they were heading to Chattanooga. Blake, have you played around Chattanooga?


A home base of Green Lake, WI puts you within 1:30 or so of at least seven legitimate Top 100 contenders, at least 5 other courses of national acclaim, and at least 5 or 6 hidden gems that might actually be better than anything on the "national acclaim" list. Kohler might not be enough to beat Chicago by itself, but considering that there have been Chicagoans on this site who cite Spring Valley as the best public in the Chicago area, I think we must also consider the Whistling Straits/Sand Valley/Erin Hills triangle a single destination that clearly belongs on this list.

A 1:30 circle would make New Brunswick, NJ the Golf Capital of the World.


Ira

[Ian Mackenzie]

I'd be excited if I heard somebody say they were heading to Chicago for a golf trip, but I'd probably be more excited if they told me they were heading to Chattanooga. Blake, have you played around Chattanooga?


A home base of Green Lake, WI puts you within 1:30 or so of at least seven legitimate Top 100 contenders, at least 5 other courses of national acclaim, and at least 5 or 6 hidden gems that might actually be better than anything on the "national acclaim" list. Kohler might not be enough to beat Chicago by itself, but considering that there have been Chicagoans on this site who cite Spring Valley as the best public in the Chicago area, I think we must also consider the Whistling Straits/Sand Valley/Erin Hills triangle a single destination that clearly belongs on this list.

You'd be surprised at how many UK-ers come to Chicago for "high end" golf and offer host clubs the same reciprocity and hospitality in the UK.


CGC, Shoreacres, Old Elm, Skokie and maybe some others. Dinners, etc.
Then Chicago golfers go play in London and then to their host's Scottish clubs.


But, no, not public-access trips. Better golf for that in WI, MI, MN.

[JC Jones]

The land at Shoreacres is so dramatic for this area even though it really wouldn't be that special in other areas of the Country. 

Outside of the big ditch that affects play on a couple holes, the land isnt dramatic at all.  There is more movement, for example, at CGC, Beverly, Medinah #3 and OFCC(N), by far.


The course is fun and the conditioning is great, but Im always confused how that one element that is most impactful as a single, drop-shot par3, seems to make people forget how flat most of the rest of the course is.

[Ted Sturges]

The land at Shoreacres is so dramatic for this area even though it really wouldn't be that special in other areas of the Country. 

Outside of the big ditch that affects play on a couple holes, the land isnt dramatic at all.  There is more movement, for example, at CGC, Beverly, Medinah #3 and OFCC(N), by far.


The course is fun and the conditioning is great, but Im always confused how that one element that is most impactful as a single, drop-shot par3, seems to make people forget how flat most of the rest of the course is.

Agree on all.  And I love SA.  I always tell people that the land there is dramatic, but the playing surfaces are pretty flat.  You could hold soccer practice on all but about 4 fairways on the non one-shot holes.


TS

[George Myers]

Jeff,


As a graduate engineer and avid golfer I lived in Chicago from 84-88 and didn't play a single course you mentioned. A tad exclusionary don't you think?

a lot of the publics listed hadn't even been built then...

[SL_Solow]

A couple of qualifiers.  First, I hold an executive position with the CDGA.  As such,although I have seen almost all Chicago has to offer,I am somewhat constrained to comment negatively about any member.  Second, I find it somewhat incongruous that my friend Barney, a sworn enemy of raters and rating, now seeks to rate entire regions.


As for Chicago, the first question is what constitutes a metro area.  Are the Hamptons part of NYC?  If so, where does SW Michigan fit, not to mention parts of Wisconsin.  Sticking to Chicago and the burbs, the very top end may fall a little short of some other areas, depending on your view of Chicago Golf, Shoreacres etc.  What Chicago has is tremendous depth.  You can play a new course every day for more than a month without ever finding one that is uninteresting 

[John Kavanaugh]

Shel,


I have not played Chicago Golf, Shoreacres, Medinah #3, Old Elm, Rich Harvest Links or Skokie. I also haven't played most if not all of the great courses in the other regions mentioned. So I would hardly call whatever my list may be but I wouldn't say it falls to the level of ranking.

[Ian Mackenzie]

The land at Shoreacres is so dramatic for this area even though it really wouldn't be that special in other areas of the Country. 

Outside of the big ditch that affects play on a couple holes, the land isnt dramatic at all.  There is more movement, for example, at CGC, Beverly, Medinah #3 and OFCC(N), by far.


The course is fun and the conditioning is great, but Im always confused how that one element that is most impactful as a single, drop-shot par3, seems to make people forget how flat most of the rest of the course is.

The "flat" holes at SA are: 1, 7, 9, 17, 18.
Mmeh...maybe 10, too.


5/18 does not come to be "most" holes, but rather as some holes.


True, #12 has a dramatic elevation drop.
True the the Bev and OFCC have nice land movement.


But making any other equivalencies after that is just trolling....

[PCCraig]

The land at Shoreacres is so dramatic for this area even though it really wouldn't be that special in other areas of the Country. 

Outside of the big ditch that affects play on a couple holes, the land isnt dramatic at all.  There is more movement, for example, at CGC, Beverly, Medinah #3 and OFCC(N), by far.


The course is fun and the conditioning is great, but Im always confused how that one element that is most impactful as a single, drop-shot par3, seems to make people forget how flat most of the rest of the course is.

The "flat" holes at SA are: 1, 7, 9, 17, 18.
Mmeh...maybe 10, too.


5/18 does not come to be "most" holes, but rather as some holes.


True, #12 has a dramatic elevation drop.
True the the Bev and OFCC have nice land movement.


But making any other equivalencies after that is just trolling....

That "ditch" comes into play on at least half of the holes?


Land can be dramatic without having major humps and rolls every fairway. The 2nd at SA doesn't have the "ditch" in play but that's a fairly dramatic setting and resulting hole, no?


Golf courses aside, can anyone really say the land is more dramatic at Chicago than Shoreacres?

[SL_Solow]

Barney,  I don't want to belabor the point but when you suggest that anything , including golf course areas, ranks inside or outside the "top 50", you are by definition creating a ranking.  Moreover, when you thereafter propose a top 10, you are doing a ranking.  Its OK, just realize the implications.  It is also instructive that you concede that you haven't played many of the courses that define the excellence, or lack thereof , of the areas in question.  I suspect that is why the ratings systems, flawed as they may be, seek a numerical ranking so that they can compile data from a variety of "experts", none of them who have seen the bulk of the courses under consideration.  Another disclaimer, I was a member of the Golfweek panel but withdrew.

[Ted Sturges]

The land at Shoreacres is so dramatic for this area even though it really wouldn't be that special in other areas of the Country. 

Outside of the big ditch that affects play on a couple holes, the land isnt dramatic at all.  There is more movement, for example, at CGC, Beverly, Medinah #3 and OFCC(N), by far.


The course is fun and the conditioning is great, but Im always confused how that one element that is most impactful as a single, drop-shot par3, seems to make people forget how flat most of the rest of the course is.

The "flat" holes at SA are: 1, 7, 9, 17, 18.
Mmeh...maybe 10, too.


5/18 does not come to be "most" holes, but rather as some holes.


True, #12 has a dramatic elevation drop.
True the the Bev and OFCC have nice land movement.


But making any other equivalencies after that is just trolling....

11 might be the flattest fairway on the property.  I realize the ravine is right of and at the end of the fairway, but you could paint lines and play a futbol match on that fairway.  The only fairways without a significant flat section would be 2, 3, 4 and 13 and 16.  9/14 (excluding the one shot holes) is "most".


TS

[Ted Sturges]

Shel,


I have not played Chicago Golf, Shoreacres, Medinah #3, Old Elm, Rich Harvest Links or Skokie. I also haven't played most if not all of the great courses in the other regions mentioned. So I would hardly call whatever my list may be but I wouldn't say it falls to the level of ranking.

Having not played CG, SA and OE, you've missed the best that Chicago has to offer (the 3 best in my humble opinion).  Odd that you want to offer an opinion when you haven't seen the top end of the area.


TS

[John Kavanaugh]

Shel,


I have not played Chicago Golf, Shoreacres, Medinah #3, Old Elm, Rich Harvest Links or Skokie. I also haven't played most if not all of the great courses in the other regions mentioned. So I would hardly call whatever my list may be but I wouldn't say it falls to the level of ranking.

Having not played CG, SA and OE, you've missed the best that Chicago has to offer (the 3 best in my humble opinion).  Odd that you want to offer an opinion when you haven't seen the top end of the area.


TS

Ted,


I've never bought into the long running con that a golfer needs to play a course to have a legitimate opinion. Putting my money where my mouth is I have joined several private courses before I had the opportunity to play them.

[JC Jones]

The land at Shoreacres is so dramatic for this area even though it really wouldn't be that special in other areas of the Country. 

Outside of the big ditch that affects play on a couple holes, the land isnt dramatic at all.  There is more movement, for example, at CGC, Beverly, Medinah #3 and OFCC(N), by far.


The course is fun and the conditioning is great, but Im always confused how that one element that is most impactful as a single, drop-shot par3, seems to make people forget how flat most of the rest of the course is.

The "flat" holes at SA are: 1, 7, 9, 17, 18.
Mmeh...maybe 10, too.


5/18 does not come to be "most" holes, but rather as some holes.


True, #12 has a dramatic elevation drop.
True the the Bev and OFCC have nice land movement.


But making any other equivalencies after that is just trolling....

Golf courses aside, can anyone really say the land is more dramatic at Chicago than Shoreacres?

Anyone who has played them both.

[Eric Smith]

Chattanooga 5... *Fonz jumping the shark*

The future of golf bunked up in the Birdhouse may never have heard of the Fonz. You simply can not discount a town with The Honors and Sweetens Cove. Chattanooga is the heart and soul of everything good in the game both past and future.

Chattanooga isn't even the golf capital of Tennessee.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Golf courses aside, can anyone really say the land is more dramatic at Chicago than Shoreacres?

Anyone who has played them both.



I have, and, say what?    Shoreacres was an instant fave the second I saw the first valley.  I mean, not even PB has all ocean holes.  BTW, I always wondered why they reserved the lake view for the clubhouse, with no holes along the water there?


In another very Chicagoish advantage, even a flat ground course like Chevy Chase becomes more interesting when you know the course's gangster history.  Ditto, a very flat Mt. Prospect, a course that was five miles from my childhood home and that I played often, well before the current remodel of course.


And, I fell in love with golf at the rolling no. 3 course at Medinah.  1 and 2 were pretty flat, but that one has spectacular trees and hills.


Ever since I started golf at age 12, I was aware of courses in more exotic locales (thanks to an early purchase of World Atlas of Golf and other reading of golf magazines) but yes, I always figured there was local golf and other golf, with other golf generally being better in many cases.  On the other hand, I always found the Chicago courses pleasant enough to enjoy the game and was fond of the parkland look that generally developed on the gently rolling farmland that was converted to golf.


This has got me to wondering just how much of the perception is tied to where you grew up and played?  I will also say, that when I moved to Texas, I was less than impressed with the quality of courses around DFW, Colonial included, compared to any number of Chicago clubs on similar clay, flat to gently rolling ground.  Of course, the roster of Golden Age gca's working around Chicago outnumbered those working in Texas (mostly Bredemus, Plummer, some Maxwell, etc.)

Overall, I think ranking Chicago out of the top 50 is a big mistake.

[Ian Mackenzie]

The land at Shoreacres is so dramatic for this area even though it really wouldn't be that special in other areas of the Country. 

Outside of the big ditch that affects play on a couple holes, the land isnt dramatic at all.  There is more movement, for example, at CGC, Beverly, Medinah #3 and OFCC(N), by far.


The course is fun and the conditioning is great, but Im always confused how that one element that is most impactful as a single, drop-shot par3, seems to make people forget how flat most of the rest of the course is.

The "flat" holes at SA are: 1, 7, 9, 17, 18.
Mmeh...maybe 10, too.


5/18 does not come to be "most" holes, but rather as some holes.


True, #12 has a dramatic elevation drop.
True the the Bev and OFCC have nice land movement.


But making any other equivalencies after that is just trolling....

11 might be the flattest fairway on the property.  I realize the ravine is right of and at the end of the fairway, but you could paint lines and play a futbol match on that fairway.  The only fairways without a significant flat section would be 2, 3, 4 and 13 and 16.  9/14 (excluding the one shot holes) is "most".


TS

Sure...;-)...right after you drive over a huge ravine with, as you said, a 75' drop-off on the right that is only semi-visible from the tee and if you are 250 yards off the tee you go down into yet another ravine giving you an improbable chance at saving par as the front right of the green bleeds right into the 12th tee box.


But, yes, the fairway is flat and so is the deck of a moving aircraft carrier...;-)

[Jeff Schley]

But, yes, the fairway is flat and so is the deck of a moving aircraft carrier...;-)

Ian that is a good analogy. I admit SA doesn't have a lot of movement/mounds in their fairways/playing surface, but if you are offline around the ravine dropoffs you are in trouble. That foliage is pretty native too. I really like hole 11, which for those with a slice almost guarantees you are going to be down in the ravine. The fairway actually looks like an aircraft carrier, but outside of that.... watch out.

[Paul OConnor]

If Barney doesn't get invited to play Medinah #3, CGC, SA, and OE by the next page of this thread I will eat my hat.  I'm sure he already has the trip booked, all that's left is to find the right marks to finish off the game.  What a genius, this ruse works every time. 

[John Kavanaugh]

If Barney doesn't get invited to play Medinah #3, CGC, SA, and OE by the next page of this thread I will eat my hat.  I'm sure he already has the trip booked, all that's left is to find the right marks to finish off the game.  What a genius, this ruse works every time.

I already have standing invites. I even went to Chicago for my honeymoon in 1982. We were married on July 3rd and attended the Western Open at Butler National, not to mention Taste of Chicago. Oddly enough the internet is how I managed all my invites and the internet is why I no longer travel to Chicago. Internet shopping killed the weekend trips with the wife.

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