Best 18 Holes Built in the Last 50 Years - Consensus (see p. 6)

[John Kirk]

Kirk takes the coveted 100th reply position!

Pacific Dunes, 3^rd hole, 499 yards (Doak)

Bandon Dunes, 4^th hole, 410 yards (Kidd)

Pronghorn Resort (Fazio), 8^th hole, 187 yards (Fazio)

Boston GC, 12^th hole, 433 yards (Hanse)

Pronghorn Resort (Nicklaus), 12^th hole, 342 yards (Nicklaus)

Sand Hills GC, 14^th hole, 508 yards (Coore/Crenshaw)

La Quinta (Mountain), 15^th hole, 517 yards (Dye)

Poipu Bay Resort, 16^th hole, 501 yards (R.T. Jones, Jr.)

Pumpkin Ridge (Ghost Creek), 17^th hole, 329 yards (Cupp/Fought)

This was a difficult exercise.  I kept two 12th holes.  The list is biased to longer holes.  I might have chosen all long par 4s and par 5s if I were to truly pick my favorites.  There's a bit of  a west coast influence as well.


JVDB, nice call on Broken Top #11.  Like Pronghorn #8, it takes advantage of a beautiful rock formation.



 

[Pete_Pittock]

Chiming in again with my 5th and 6th picks


Wairikei Golf and Sanctuary, NZ
1970 Harris/Woolveridge/Thomsen
#12 Par 4 296
Got to the tee and had the 'wow' feeling. Bunkering stream and rough in my 200 yd away landing area. Pure drive. Pure wedge. Eagle.


Tobacco Road # 6  Par 3 117-148
Mike Strantz
Tees spread out like a football formation ala run and gun

[Tom_Doak]

Tally so far:


209 holes nominated, from 144 courses, by 62 different architects!


40 holes with at least two votes, including every hole number except the 1st and 12th.

[jim_lewis]

#12 Forest Creek North-Fazio. Looks like a par 5 from the tee, and plays like one for most players, but it is a par 4 on the score card.

[JC Jones]

This is subject to revision, and its only a Par 71, but here we go:


1 - Tobacco Road (5)
2 - Ballyhack (5)
3 - Whistling Straits (3)
4 - Loop Black (4)
5 - Bandon Dunes (4)
6 - Mammoth Dunes (4)
7 - Old Mac (4)
8 - Kingsley (4)
9 - Trinity Forest (4)
10 - Friars Head (3)
11 - Pacific Dunes (3)
12 - Arcadia Bluffs (Bluffs) (4)
13 - Bandon Trails (4)
14 - Sand Hills (5)
15 - World Woods (Pine Barrens) (4)
16 - Erin Hills (3)
17 - TPC Sawgrass (3)
18 - Kiawah Ocean (4)


Lots of really good stuff on the cutting room floor.  Might come back with some edits.

[jeffwarne]

This is subject to revision, and its only a Par 71, but here we go:


1 - Tobacco Road (5)
2 - Ballyhack (5)
3 - Whistling Straits (3)
4 - Loop Black (4)
5 - Bandon Dunes (4)
6 - Mammoth Dunes (4)
7 - Old Mac (4)
8 - Kingsley (4)
9 - Trinity Forest (4)
10 - Friars Head (3)
11 - Pacific Dunes (3)
12 - Arcadia Bluffs (Bluffs) (4)
13 - Bandon Trails (4)
14 - Sand Hills (5)
15 - World Woods (Pine Barrens) (4)
16 - Erin Hills (3)
17 - TPC Sawgrass (3)
18 - Kiawah Ocean (4)


Lots of really good stuff on the cutting room floor.  Might come back with some edits.

"Each poster can nominate up to 9 holes,and the holes much each be from a different architect"

[JC Jones]

Rules are meant to be broken.

[jeffwarne]

Rules are meant to be broken.

well in fairness you did impose an even harder set of rules on yourself by retaining hole #s...
and 18 of them no less

[Mark Pritchett]

1.   Wade Hampton

3.   Old Mac
4.   Sweetens Cove


5.   Cuscowilla
6.   Shoal Creek


9.   Erin Hills


11.  Tobacco Road



16.  Bandon Dunes


17.  Ohoopee

[JC Jones]

Rules are meant to be broken.

well in fairness you did impose an even harders set of rules on yourself by retaining hole #s
and 18 of them no less

I did tweak the exercise a bit  .  It was a bit hard, not that I would ever have sympathy for Ran.  But, for example, I think the 8th hole at Sand Hills is better than the 8th hole at Kingsley and I almost went that route except that I think the 14th at Sand Hills is the best hole out there and didnt want to foresake it.

[JC Jones]

1.   Wade Hampton

3.   Old Mac
4.   Sweetens Cove


5.   Cuscowilla
6.   Shoal Creek


9.   Ohoopee


11.  Tobacco Road



16.  Bandon Dunes


18.  Harbour Town

I wanted to include 1 at Wade but I was in a toss up on Tobacco Road and decided to take the 11th at PacDunes instead. 


HarbourTown was built before 1976 so its DQ'ed!!

[Kevin Pallier]

4   Barnbougle Dunes (Doak/Clayton)
7   National-Old (Trent Jones Jnr)
8   Streamsong-Black (Hanse)
11   MPCC-Shore (Strantz)
12   Kingsbarns (Phillips)
15   Friars Head (Coore & Crenshaw)
16   Bandon Dunes (Kidd)
17   TPC Sawgrass (Dye)
18   Cape Wickham (Devries/Oliver)

[Pete Lavallee]

Rustic Canyon #13, Hanse
Barona Creek #4, Eckenrode
Bandon Dunes #5, Kidd
Barnbougle Dunes #4, Doak Clayton
Old MacDonald #7, Doak +
Pinnacle Point ZA #8, Matcovitch
Black Creek #17, Silva
Sand Valley Poland #12, Ristola
Sweetens Cove #9, King Collins

[Mark Pritchett]

1.   Wade Hampton

3.   Old Mac
4.   Sweetens Cove


5.   Cuscowilla
6.   Shoal Creek


9.   Ohoopee


11.  Tobacco Road



16.  Bandon Dunes


18.  Harbour Town

I wanted to include 1 at Wade but I was in a toss up on Tobacco Road and decided to take the 11th at PacDunes instead. 


HarbourTown was built before 1976 so its DQ'ed!!

1976 has nothing to do with this thread.  That said, I’ll add another Dye hole as HT is a tad over 50 years. 

[JC Jones]

This is subject to revision, and its only a Par 71, but here we go:


1 - Tobacco Road (5)
2 - Ballyhack (5)
3 - Whistling Straits (3)
4 - Loop Black (4)
5 - Bandon Dunes (4)
6 - Mammoth Dunes (4)
7 - Old Mac (4)
8 - Kingsley (4)
9 - Trinity Forest (4)
10 - Friars Head (3)
11 - Pacific Dunes (3)
12 - Arcadia Bluffs (Bluffs) (4)
13 - Bandon Trails (4)
14 - Sand Hills (5)
15 - World Woods (Pine Barrens) (4)
16 - Erin Hills (3)
17 - TPC Sawgrass (3)
18 - Kiawah Ocean (4)


Lots of really good stuff on the cutting room floor.  Might come back with some edits.

Pritchett's right.


1 - Wade Hampton (5)
2 - Pacific Dunes (4)
3 - Whistling Straits (3)4 - Loop Black (4)5 - Bandon Dunes (4)6 - Mammoth Dunes (4)7 - Old Mac (4)8 - Kingsley (4)9 - Trinity Forest (4)10 - Friars Head (3)11 - Tobacco Road (5)12 - Ballyhack (4)13 - Bandon Trails (4)14 - Sand Hills (5)15 - World Woods (Pine Barrens) (4)16 - Erin Hills (3)17 - TPC Sawgrass (3)18 - Kiawah Ocean (4)

Still a par 71

[jeffwarne]

Am I the only one who wasn't that enamored with #18 at Cape Wickam?
Lots of fantastic holes out there-just didn't think that was one of them......maybe it was the hike up from there to the clubhouse(though the hike back to the clubhouse at St. Andrew's Beach was the ultimate buzzkill)
Small wonder both courses were littered with carts

[Jeff Schley]

Am I the only one who wasn't that enamored with #18 at Cape Wickam?
Lots of fantastic holes out there-just didn't think that was one of them......maybe it was the hike up from there to the clubhouse(though the hike back to the clubhouse at St. Andrew's Beach was the ultimate buzzkill)
Small wonder both courses were littered with carts

OUCH! I guess our first name is all that we have in common.
That was the one hole on my list that will not be touched, moved, or nudged. It is firmly implanted with concrete footers all the way to bedrock as my #18 hole in celebration of Mike Devries and Darius Oliver. Eye candy I admit, but a hero carry off the tee (depending how far you bite off) and then still have to hit the green with H2O mist from the crashing waves to the right. I loved the hole myself. Also when I played it one guy in my group played from the beach below and recovered for a bogey!
BTW even more beautiful from the air. (sorry I don't know how to scale it down)

[jeffwarne]

Am I the only one who wasn't that enamored with #18 at Cape Wickam?
Lots of fantastic holes out there-just didn't think that was one of them......maybe it was the hike up from there to the clubhouse(though the hike back to the clubhouse at St. Andrew's Beach was the ultimate buzzkill)
Small wonder both courses were littered with carts

OUCH! I guess our first name is all that we have in common.
That was the one hole on my list that will not be touched, moved, or nudged. It is firmly implanted with concrete footers all the way to bedrock as my #18 hole in celebration of Mike Devries and Darius Oliver. Eye candy I admit, but a hero carry off the tee (depending how far you bite off) and then still have to hit the green with H2O mist from the crashing waves to the right. I loved the hole myself. Also when I played it one guy in my group played from the beach below and recovered for a bogey!
BTW even more beautiful from the air. (sorry I don't know how to scale it down."





Ok-you win-18 was cool!
I guess I need a second look
I really liked many of the holes-a lot.specifically 2, 4,6, 9,10,11,12 , 14-17---and yes 18 certainly is exciting.
To be fair on 18, my back was out for the first half of that trip and any carry over 180 was daunting, and that pull up that hill on 18 really wiped me out.(I think we were the only group walking that day)

[Jeff Schley]

Am I the only one who wasn't that enamored with #18 at Cape Wickam?
Lots of fantastic holes out there-just didn't think that was one of them......maybe it was the hike up from there to the clubhouse(though the hike back to the clubhouse at St. Andrew's Beach was the ultimate buzzkill)
Small wonder both courses were littered with carts

OUCH! I guess our first name is all that we have in common.
That was the one hole on my list that will not be touched, moved, or nudged. It is firmly implanted with concrete footers all the way to bedrock as my #18 hole in celebration of Mike Devries and Darius Oliver. Eye candy I admit, but a hero carry off the tee (depending how far you bite off) and then still have to hit the green with H2O mist from the crashing waves to the right. I loved the hole myself. Also when I played it one guy in my group played from the beach below and recovered for a bogey!
BTW even more beautiful from the air. (sorry I don't know how to scale it down."





Ok-you win-18 was cool!
I guess I need a second look
I really liked many of the holes-a lot.specifically 2, 4,6, 9,10,11,12 , 14-17---and yes 18 certainly is exciting.
To be fair on 18, my back was out for the first half of that trip and any carry over 180 was daunting, and that pull up that hill on 18 really wiped me out.(I think we were the only group walking that day)

OMG you walked???  Wow that wouldn't not be an easy walk at all.  BTW I really think 1 is a great opening hole and 10 an easy and beautiful short par 4 down to the ocean with a waterfall edge green. Gorgeous course.

[John Kavanaugh]

Am I the only one who wasn't that enamored with #18 at Cape Wickam?
Lots of fantastic holes out there-just didn't think that was one of them......maybe it was the hike up from there to the clubhouse(though the hike back to the clubhouse at St. Andrew's Beach was the ultimate buzzkill)
Small wonder both courses were littered with carts

OUCH! I guess our first name is all that we have in common.
That was the one hole on my list that will not be touched, moved, or nudged. It is firmly implanted with concrete footers all the way to bedrock as my #18 hole in celebration of Mike Devries and Darius Oliver. Eye candy I admit, but a hero carry off the tee (depending how far you bite off) and then still have to hit the green with H2O mist from the crashing waves to the right. I loved the hole myself. Also when I played it one guy in my group played from the beach below and recovered for a bogey!
BTW even more beautiful from the air. (sorry I don't know how to scale it down)

This is just one of my issues with drones. I seriously doubt if from the ground you can see the perfectly linear nature of the bunker layout. They look like dinosaur droppings.

[Jeff Schley]

John you are correct sir!  Also no way was the water that turquoise so unless you are in an air balloon between holes you can't appreciate it probably fully.  But there are probably few courses that benefit from drone footage as much as CW.

[Brian Finn]

My first crack at this was simply a list of the best modern holes I could think of, so included multiple 13th holes, 6th holes, and more par 4s and 5s than 3s.  I decided to try to switch it up and try to keep it to one per hole # and one per architect that fit together reasonably well as a 9 hole course (perhaps not in the exact order listed).  Not exactly what Tom Doak asked for, but anyway...

4th Pacific Dunes par 4 463 (Doak)
5th Long Cove par 4 317 (Dye)
6th Black Creek par 5 559 (Silva)
8th Tobacco Road par 3 178 (Strantz)
9th Streamsong Black par 4 450 (Hanse)
13th Kingsley par 4 292 (Devries)
14th Sand Hills par 5 508 (Coore & Crenshaw)
15th Dismal River White par 3 186 (Nicklaus)
16th Bandon Dunes par 4 363 (Kidd)
9 holes par 36 3,316 yards

[Bob Montle]

I would like to suggest

1) Dismal White
5) Caledonia Fish
9) Sweetens Cove
12) Cedarbrook (Ellis Maples)
18) Dismal Red

[Tom_Doak]

Okay - it looks like everyone who wanted to vote has voted, so I will attempt to compile some results here.

 As with routing a golf course, assembling an eclectic is an exercise in leaving out some of the best holes to make the pieces fit together well.  Before we get to that part, though, we first need to take stock of the pieces.
Choosing holes by popular vote is not entirely fair for two reasons:  there are some candidates which very few of us have seen, and some architects' vote was split multiple ways.  Nevertheless, it would be foolish not to recognize the popularity of the following holes:

Only four holes got five or more votes for the list:
3rd at Castle Stuart, five votes
4th at Barnbougle Dunes, six votes
11th at Tobacco Road, six votes, and the
16th at Bandon Dunes, the runaway winner with a dozen votes
Note that three of these are short par-4's and the other is a very short par-5.  We like our half-par holes on the easy side here!

Another eight holes received four votes for the list, and here we have to start arranging them by architect, to keep track of the potential overlaps:
Coore & Crenshaw:  8th Sand Hills, 14th Sand Hills, 15th Friars Head
Doak & associates:  3rd Old Macdonald, 4th Barnbougle, 7th Ballyneal [all short 4's]
Hanse:  3rd Castle Stuart, 17th Ohoopee
Fazio:  4th World Woods (Pine Barrens)
Strantz:  11th Tobacco Road
Phillips:  6th Kingsbarns [another short 4]
Kidd:  16th Bandon Dunes

So that's seven short par-4's out of 12 holes, and three shortish par-5's -- we wouldn't use them all even if they were by a dozen different architects.

[Tom_Doak]

 Holes by other architects that got more than one vote:
DeVries:  2nd Kingsley, 15th Kingsley, 18th Cape Wickham
Dye:  5th Casa de Campo, 11th TPC Sawgrass, 17th TPC, 17th Whistling Straits
Whitman:  9th Sagebrush, 11th Cabot, 16th Cabot
Nicklaus:  6th Shoal Creek
Hurdzan/Fry:  9th Erin Hills
RTJ II:  14th Chambers Bay
Hackett:  17th Carne
Hawtree:  8th Burnham (Channel)
Ebert:  16th Goodwood
Weiskopf:  17th TPC Scottsdale
King/Collins:  4th Sweetens Cove, 9th Sweetens Cove
Hixson:  5th Wine Valley
Turner:  2nd Lofoten
Nuzzo:  6th Wolf Point
Silva:  6th Black Creek
Spann:  14th Black Mesa


The only multi-vote candidates for certain hole numbers were by architects with more popular holes:
1st - Wade Hampton (Fazio) was the only opening hole with two votes
10th - MPCC Shore (Strantz) had two votes
12th - Kingsbarns (Phillips) had two votes
13th - Rustic Canyon, Ohoopee, and Tobacco Road each had two or three votes