Walking with trolleys

[John Kavanaugh]

No good comes from saying that trolleys are healthier than cart balling. Skin cancer risk and not playing at all outweigh any aerobic benefits.


If you are going to spend four hours subjected to the sun a roof is a roof is a roof.


I used to love trolleys. Now I just play with fewer clubs. I would never use more than one club if my ego could take being a 90 shooter. In that vein, trolleys are an ego boost. Look mommy!!!! I can walk and still beat daddy!!!

[Michael Whitaker]

It is sad, really, that golf became primarily a riding game in the US. There are so many health benefits to be gained at golf by walking.

Mike-A lot of good points in your post. Although the game had already gone the way of carts in the U.S. the number of modern golf courses built with very long green to tee walks didn’t help. Those that came to the game playing these courses didn’t know there was any other way to play.

Tim - there was a thread years ago about the things that have had the best & worst impact on golf I’m the US throughout the years. As I remember, carts were highly ranked on both sides of the argument. On the one hand, carts brought the masses to the game and allowed more people to play than might otherwise... but, the downside is that they allowed courses to be built in places that were totally unsuited for golf and destroyed the walking culture of golf in those areas. And, as you say, carts allowed for green to tee distances to be spread so far apart that the courses became virtually unwalkable. As much as I prefer to walk, there are some course that I just can’t (or refuse to) walk. I’m always amazed and impressed by my good friend Craig Disher who ABSOLUTELY refuses to ride any course, regardless of its suitability for walking. He is definitely the poster boy for golf as a walking game... at all costs! 😂


I have many perfectly healthy friends who would not play golf if they had to walk. They see golf as a riding game and can’t imagine playing any other way!

[Michael Whitaker]

Saying that walking with a trolley is not healthier than riding in a cart is like saying riding a bicycle is not healthier than riding in an automobile. 🥴


Pretty bad analogy from you, John. You must be posting without your wife’s help this morning! 🤣🤣🤣

[John Kavanaugh]

By a factor of thousands more bicyclists are killed or injured per mile than in automobiles.

[John Kavanaugh]

Golf carts have basically saved my life. The only reason I don’t weigh over 400lbs is because every time I push 300lbs I get in a cart and golf.

[Mark_Fine]

Walking is walking.  The issue is when you walk, why can’t you drag or push your bag vs putting it on your shoulder.  That is the part that is ridiculous. 


Lou,
A trolley does less damage (compaction) to a green than a person walking on it.  Most don’t wheel theirs over the green but you could. 

[John Kavanaugh]

I hear the same argument made about tucking in your shirt or taking photographs. I’d rather see a course full of trolley pushers than one untucked double strapped photographer.

[Michael Whitaker]

Any thoughts on the impact on the greens if these carts could be pushed/pulled through the greens?  There is an impact on the pace of play when they have to be rolled around large green complexes and creeks.

Lou - in Australia they allow trolleys to be taken across the greens... at least they did a few years ago when I was there for Scott Warren’s “Boomerang.” The greens are all some form of Bermuda. I don’t think it would be possible on any type of bent grass greens.

[Thomas Dai]

If we’re discussing ‘private members clubs’ why can’t the members put forward a rule change to allow there use?
Atb

[John Kavanaugh]

Is there anything a golfer should not be allowed to do if it does not interfere with other golfers on the course? Or, are there any club rules that make the game more enjoyable?

[Michael Whitaker]

By a factor of thousands more bicyclists are killed or injured per mile than in automobiles.

... per mile? Ha ha ha, why did I know that would be your retort!!! Same is probably true for joggers! It’s a great argument to remain sedentary and protected inside a vehicle... you know, the ones that smack into the bicyclists and joggers! 😭😭😭

[John Kavanaugh]

If we’re discussing ‘private members clubs’ why can’t the members put forward a rule change to allow there use?
Atb

As odd as this may sound I singlehandly was able to get electric trolleys allowed at my home course. I simply asked permission to use the trolley in the winter and pay the same as if I was using a cart. After a couple of months of being a perfect citizen. ie: We all know where not to push a cart. More people became interested and it was accepted as standard practice. I believe this is what will be the case after Covid at most clubs as long as the members are being good citizens. They are not toys to be pushed down hills for your amusement. They are and should only be seen and used as equipment transport devices.

[Michael Whitaker]

John - according to Google:  California, Florida and Texas are the most dangerousstates for cycling, according to a recent report released by CarInsurance.org. The report found that the three states accounted for about 41% of the nation's cyclist fatalities.

Looks like you moved to the right place! Get busy!!!

[John Kavanaugh]

By a factor of thousands more bicyclists are killed or injured per mile than in automobiles.

... per mile? Ha ha ha, why did I know that would be your retort!!! Same is probably true for joggers! It’s a great argument to remain sedentary and protected inside a vehicle... you know, the ones that smack into the bicyclists and joggers! 😭😭😭

My wife and I ride most every morning on A1A in Florida. It is scary as hell but that is half the fun.

[Michael Whitaker]

Wowsa! Seems you might be on the wrong end of the stick for once.


What’s more dangerous... your morning ride or not wearing a mask at the mall?

[John Kavanaugh]

After considerable deliberation I have come to the conclusion that I have nothing good to say about the mall.

[Michael Whitaker]

After considerable deliberation I have come to the conclusion that I have nothing good to say about the mall.

👍👍

[Kalen Braley]

Micheal,

It is certainly true that Americans in general care a lot about image, hence the ban on push carts and such.

At the same time thou, you also won't catch us in that hideous UK golfing gear with knee length shorts and near knee high socks.  I recall a pic of you sporting that stuff from a previous thread, but damned if I can find it! 

But outside of someone running in-between shots, i'd bet a large chunk of change a single walking wouldn't be able to keep up anywhere close to a single in a cart of same golfing skill. (Assuming a wide open course in front)

P.S. I think a lot of Americans want to take carts so they have somewhere to carry their beer and sit while they wait... shot after shot, hole after hole... enduring a grind house 5 hour weekend round.

[Michael Whitaker]

Micheal,

It is certainly true that Americans in general care a lot about image, hence the ban on push carts and such.

At the same time thou, you also won't catch us in that hideous UK golfing gear with knee length shorts and near knee high socks.  I recall a pic of you sporting that stuff from a previous thread, but damned if I can find it! 

But outside of someone running in-between shots, i'd bet a large chunk of change a single walking wouldn't be able to keep up anywhere close to a single in a cart of same golfing skill. (Assuming a wide open course in front)

P.S. I think a lot of Americans want to take carts so they have somewhere to carry their beer and sit while they wait... shot after shot, hole after hole... enduring a grind house 5 hour weekend round.

Kalen -  I have to admit that I really enjoy the old school traditions of UK golf... the matches, the jacket & tie lunches, the pre & post-game locker room rituals, the drinks after a game and, yes, the long socks with shorts. It is very civilized, you know! (I guess that should be civilised) 

I've never been a "speed" golfer and don't really enjoy trying to play in 3 hours... it's too fast for me. I like a good 3:45 - 4:00 round (if a 4-ball). That seems to be the best pace for my body. At Deal the rounds go very quickly because most games are a two-ball. 3 hours is about normal. But, trying to justify riding or walking by which is faster never made much sense to me. That's not the point.

I agree that many golfers have become so accustomed to having a cart to haul around their beer, speakers and such that they wouldn't be happy walking without a couple of litter-bearers (not caddies!).

By the way... here is that famous photo of my golf hose... in the Deal colors, no less!

[Kalen Braley]

Michael,

Yes, that's the one!  I hope you changed before you left the premises just in case you bumped into the fashion police. 

I too appreciate tradition, but not just for traditions sake.  Some things make great sense and are certainly worth keeping, and I appreciate that in the UK, most rounds seem to still be under 4 hours as the "play like a Tour Pro" phenomena hasn't infected the game.

At the same time as people get older and wear out, golf can be a lot more enjoyable in a cart.  As I approach 50, I've developed arthritis in my lower back and a propensity for stress fractures in my feet, and walking 18 would be an exercise in near agony at this point.  Throw in hot weather climate where most summer days are near 100, and its a tough ask.  On a playful side note, how many of my UK brethren would still be walking in 80-90 degree weather, which I understand is fairly rare over there? 

P.S.  We can agree on speakers, I always thought part of the basic etiquette was remaining quiet while others are playing?

[Adam Lawrence]

You do need to understand that the number of UK clubs that require long socks with shorts is tiny, in double figures at most. I went to Royal Cinque Ports on a hot day a couple of weeks ago wearing shorts, and remembered that it was a long sock club just as I was parking my car (I had to buy a pair of RCP long socks in the pro shop).

[Michael Whitaker]

You do need to understand that the number of UK clubs that require long socks with shorts is tiny, in double figures at most. I went to Royal Cinque Ports on a hot day a couple of weeks ago wearing shorts, and remembered that it was a long sock club just as I was parking my car (I had to buy a pair of RCP long socks in the pro shop).

We do a lot of long sock business with guests & visitors at Deal!!! 

[Mike_Clayton]

Any thoughts on the impact on the greens if these carts could be pushed/pulled through the greens?  There is an impact on the pace of play when they have to be rolled around large green complexes and creeks.

Lou - in Australia they allow trolleys to be taken across the greens... at least they did a few years ago when I was there for Scott Warren’s “Boomerang.” The greens are all some form of Bermuda. I don’t think it would be possible on any type of bent grass greens.

Michael,


They used to allow 'buggies' (as they are known as here) across all the greens on the sandbelt but no longer. Royal Melbourne banned it under the guise (real of not) of keeping poa out of the greens and the rest followed.
The majority of sandbelt greens are bent grass (the only Bermuda greens are in Queensland - same climate as Florida) and buggies never seemed to adversely affect the surfaces.
Having said that, at Metropolitan (where I'm a member) the greens are much better than they were when the buggies were going across - but there are other factors to consider in Metro's case.

[Mark_Fine]

A few courses/clubs have already been mentioned but what top clubs allow trolleys?  I know most in Europe and Asia do.  It would be great to have a strong list to help the cause.

[SL_Solow]

Here in Chicago there has been a long standing tradition against the use of trolleys largely because of private clubs' overwhelming support of the Evans Scholar Program.  In order to keep caddie programs vibrant, most clubs choose to require those who walk to take a caddie.  While carts are allowed, trolleys and carrying are not.  Almost all of the clubs have an abundance of caddies.  It is a fine summer job and the WGA awards a lot of scholarships.  Clearly, some members would prefer to change the rules but in my experience, the vast majority like it the way it is.  Currently, during the Covid crisis, the State does not allow caddies and most clubs are allowing trolleys.
We are working to make the powers that be understand that the the use of caddies and social distancing are not mutually exclusive and I expect that the old rules will go back into effect at most if not all clubs when caddies are permitted.  Meanwhile, I am walking with a trolley.