Some Oak Hill photos

[Matthew Rose]

The East Course is reopening today following Andrew Green's makeover. I gathered a few pics from Twitter.

Low aerial




New 5th




New 6th




Hillocks between 10 and 13





New 15th

[Rob Marshall]

I'm playing there next Friday. Can't wait.

[John Blain]

I'm playing there next Friday. Can't wait.

Rob-
It would be great if you could report back on your thoughts about the course. The pics look fantastic. The only thing I have heard from a couple of members is that the bunkers are extremely deep!  I'm sure the tree huggers are none too happy but the course had gotten so overgrown the tree removal was long overdue. I'm not sure how it looks in person but just based on the photos I've seen it almost looks like an entirely different golf course but in a good way.
I hope you're well.
-John

[John Foley]

Driving through the property recently I'm amazed by the vistas opened up by the tree removal. They are still there, but it's not claustrophobic. I think it looks very well done. That "new" 5th hole looks VERY cool.

[Ben Stephens]

Looks pretty impressive and all traces of RTJ and Fazio works seem to have been erased.


Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

[John Blain]

Looks pretty impressive and all traces of RTJ and Fazio works seem to have been erased.


Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

Ben-
The original 18th green site was not restored to what Ross had built. The original Ross green was about 40 yards further back than where the green sits now. Fazio moved the green forward so bleachers could be set-up where the original green once was. It's too bad because some of the older members have told me the original 18th that Ross built was one of the best greens on the entire course. It was a subtle two-tier green with a runway and flanked on both sides by bunkers.
The "new" 5th, 6th and 15th did not go back to the original Ross but as you said the RTJ and Fazio is gone thank god.  The holes hopefully resemble what Ross would have built today if he were still alive, at least that was the intent of Andrew Green. It will be interesting to see what the general consensus is regarding the overall changes. I have a friend who is a member and a very good player and he told me it looks like it is going to be about 3-4 shots tougher! 
-John

[Tom_Doak]

Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

I am sure that if Donald Ross were still alive today, he would be taking steroids.   


He probably would have had to, to make it to age 148.

[Ben Stephens]

Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

I am sure that if Donald Ross were still alive today, he would be taking steroids.   


He probably would have had to, to make it to age 148.

Nice one Tom and maybe GCA can have a celebration on Ross' 150th birthday

[Ben Stephens]

Looks pretty impressive and all traces of RTJ and Fazio works seem to have been erased.


Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

Ben-
The original 18th green site was not restored to what Ross had built. The original Ross green was about 40 yards further back than where the green sits now. Fazio moved the green forward so bleachers could be set-up where the original green once was. It's too bad because some of the older members have told me the original 18th that Ross built was one of the best greens on the entire course. It was a subtle two-tier green with a runway and flanked on both sides by bunkers.
The "new" 5th, 6th and 15th did not go back to the original Ross but as you said the RTJ and Fazio is gone thank god.  The holes hopefully resemble what Ross would have built today if he were still alive, at least that was the intent of Andrew Green. It will be interesting to see what the general consensus is regarding the overall changes. I have a friend who is a member and a very good player and he told me it looks like it is going to be about 3-4 shots tougher! 
-John

John,


Much appreciated with this great feedback - one wonders what the original 18th green would have looked like and was it a par 5 or a par 4 with the tee pushed forward?


The bunkers look much deeper than the RTJ/Fazio shallow looking bunkers.


Andrew Green is definitely building up a reputation like Keith Foster did then. Green's work at Inverness and Oak Hill look phenomenal as he updates a course making it look 50-100 years old rather than a brand new course. His work at Congressional is already looking really impressive and gets rid of RTJ and Rees work making it more like an Emmet course on steroids.


Cheers
Ben

[John Blain]

Looks pretty impressive and all traces of RTJ and Fazio works seem to have been erased.


Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

Ben-
The original 18th green site was not restored to what Ross had built. The original Ross green was about 40 yards further back than where the green sits now. Fazio moved the green forward so bleachers could be set-up where the original green once was. It's too bad because some of the older members have told me the original 18th that Ross built was one of the best greens on the entire course. It was a subtle two-tier green with a runway and flanked on both sides by bunkers.
The "new" 5th, 6th and 15th did not go back to the original Ross but as you said the RTJ and Fazio is gone thank god.  The holes hopefully resemble what Ross would have built today if he were still alive, at least that was the intent of Andrew Green. It will be interesting to see what the general consensus is regarding the overall changes. I have a friend who is a member and a very good player and he told me it looks like it is going to be about 3-4 shots tougher! 
-John

John,


Much appreciated with this great feedback - one wonders what the original 18th green would have looked like and was it a par 5 or a par 4 with the tee pushed forward?


The bunkers look much deeper than the RTJ/Fazio shallow looking bunkers.


Andrew Green is definitely building up a reputation like Keith Foster did then. Green's work at Inverness and Oak Hill look phenomenal as he updates a course making it look 50-100 years old rather than a brand new course. His work at Congressional is already looking really impressive and gets rid of RTJ and Rees work making it more like an Emmet course on steroids.


Cheers
Ben

Ben-
The 18th was always a par four. When Fazio moved the green forward they simply moved the tee back so the yardage basically remained the same until a new tee was put in for the 2003 PGA.
Good observation on the bunkers. I have heard they are very deep to put it mildly. I'm guessing there will be a fair amount of complaining from the members who are not particularly good bunker players that they are "unfair" and I have also heard the golf shop is loading up on 64 degree wedges
-John

[Ben Stephens]

Looks pretty impressive and all traces of RTJ and Fazio works seem to have been erased.


Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

Ben-
The original 18th green site was not restored to what Ross had built. The original Ross green was about 40 yards further back than where the green sits now. Fazio moved the green forward so bleachers could be set-up where the original green once was. It's too bad because some of the older members have told me the original 18th that Ross built was one of the best greens on the entire course. It was a subtle two-tier green with a runway and flanked on both sides by bunkers.
The "new" 5th, 6th and 15th did not go back to the original Ross but as you said the RTJ and Fazio is gone thank god.  The holes hopefully resemble what Ross would have built today if he were still alive, at least that was the intent of Andrew Green. It will be interesting to see what the general consensus is regarding the overall changes. I have a friend who is a member and a very good player and he told me it looks like it is going to be about 3-4 shots tougher! 
-John

John,


Much appreciated with this great feedback - one wonders what the original 18th green would have looked like and was it a par 5 or a par 4 with the tee pushed forward?


The bunkers look much deeper than the RTJ/Fazio shallow looking bunkers.


Andrew Green is definitely building up a reputation like Keith Foster did then. Green's work at Inverness and Oak Hill look phenomenal as he updates a course making it look 50-100 years old rather than a brand new course. His work at Congressional is already looking really impressive and gets rid of RTJ and Rees work making it more like an Emmet course on steroids.


Cheers
Ben

Ben-
The 18th was always a par four. When Fazio moved the green forward they simply moved the tee back so the yardage basically remained the same until a new tee was put in for the 2003 PGA.
Good observation on the bunkers. I have heard they are very deep to put it mildly. I'm guessing there will be a fair amount of complaining from the members who are not particularly good bunker players that they are "unfair" and I have also heard the golf shop is loading up on 64 degree wedges
-John

John


Do you or anyone have a picture of the old Ross green on 18?


One wonders whether Severiano would have beaten Lehman on Andrew Green's version rather than the course that played in the 1995 Ryder Cup?


Cheers
Ben

[John Blain]

Looks pretty impressive and all traces of RTJ and Fazio works seem to have been erased.


Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

Ben-
The original 18th green site was not restored to what Ross had built. The original Ross green was about 40 yards further back than where the green sits now. Fazio moved the green forward so bleachers could be set-up where the original green once was. It's too bad because some of the older members have told me the original 18th that Ross built was one of the best greens on the entire course. It was a subtle two-tier green with a runway and flanked on both sides by bunkers.
The "new" 5th, 6th and 15th did not go back to the original Ross but as you said the RTJ and Fazio is gone thank god.  The holes hopefully resemble what Ross would have built today if he were still alive, at least that was the intent of Andrew Green. It will be interesting to see what the general consensus is regarding the overall changes. I have a friend who is a member and a very good player and he told me it looks like it is going to be about 3-4 shots tougher! 
-John

John,


Much appreciated with this great feedback - one wonders what the original 18th green would have looked like and was it a par 5 or a par 4 with the tee pushed forward?


The bunkers look much deeper than the RTJ/Fazio shallow looking bunkers.


Andrew Green is definitely building up a reputation like Keith Foster did then. Green's work at Inverness and Oak Hill look phenomenal as he updates a course making it look 50-100 years old rather than a brand new course. His work at Congressional is already looking really impressive and gets rid of RTJ and Rees work making it more like an Emmet course on steroids.


Cheers
Ben

Ben-
The 18th was always a par four. When Fazio moved the green forward they simply moved the tee back so the yardage basically remained the same until a new tee was put in for the 2003 PGA.
Good observation on the bunkers. I have heard they are very deep to put it mildly. I'm guessing there will be a fair amount of complaining from the members who are not particularly good bunker players that they are "unfair" and I have also heard the golf shop is loading up on 64 degree wedges
-John

John


Do you or anyone have a picture of the old Ross green on 18?


One wonders whether Severiano would have beaten Lehman on Andrew Green's version rather than the course that played in the 1995 Ryder Cup?


Cheers
Ben

Ben-
I don't believe I have a photo of the original 18th green, unfortunately. If I do stumble upon one I will certainly let you know.
For what it's worth I think your man Seve would have had a much greater chance against Lehman on this "new" course just based on the amount of trees that have been taken out. I watched a good portion of that match in 1995 and I have to tell you that it was truly incredible where Seve was hitting it!  He found some parts of that golf course that I didn't even know existed! His recovery shots were off the charts but eventually it caught up to him as Lehman just wore him out hitting fairways and greens.
All the best,
john

[Rob Marshall]

Looks pretty impressive and all traces of RTJ and Fazio works seem to have been erased.


Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

Ben-
The original 18th green site was not restored to what Ross had built. The original Ross green was about 40 yards further back than where the green sits now. Fazio moved the green forward so bleachers could be set-up where the original green once was. It's too bad because some of the older members have told me the original 18th that Ross built was one of the best greens on the entire course. It was a subtle two-tier green with a runway and flanked on both sides by bunkers.
The "new" 5th, 6th and 15th did not go back to the original Ross but as you said the RTJ and Fazio is gone thank god.  The holes hopefully resemble what Ross would have built today if he were still alive, at least that was the intent of Andrew Green. It will be interesting to see what the general consensus is regarding the overall changes. I have a friend who is a member and a very good player and he told me it looks like it is going to be about 3-4 shots tougher! 
-John

John,
I’m guessing you talked to Carter. I would say it’s 4 shots harder. The tree removal is outstanding. The place looks great. The new 6th hole is a beast. The bunkers look great. One of the members I played with said some of the back lips of the green side bunkers are so steep that you can’t take a back swing if your ball ends up near them. I could see it happening on the bunkers left of the second green.


Tree removal didn’t really open up the driving corridors because the rough while not real high, was brutal.


They expanded the greens. Whoever set the pins was not in a good mood today. Every pin but 17 was tucked in a corner. If you have any specific questions fire away.

[John Blain]

Looks pretty impressive and all traces of RTJ and Fazio works seem to have been erased.


Donald Ross experts - is this more like a Ross course now or a Ross course on steroids?

Ben-
The original 18th green site was not restored to what Ross had built. The original Ross green was about 40 yards further back than where the green sits now. Fazio moved the green forward so bleachers could be set-up where the original green once was. It's too bad because some of the older members have told me the original 18th that Ross built was one of the best greens on the entire course. It was a subtle two-tier green with a runway and flanked on both sides by bunkers.
The "new" 5th, 6th and 15th did not go back to the original Ross but as you said the RTJ and Fazio is gone thank god.  The holes hopefully resemble what Ross would have built today if he were still alive, at least that was the intent of Andrew Green. It will be interesting to see what the general consensus is regarding the overall changes. I have a friend who is a member and a very good player and he told me it looks like it is going to be about 3-4 shots tougher! 
-John

John,
I’m guessing you talked to Carter. I would say it’s 4 shots harder. The tree removal is outstanding. The place looks great. The new 6th hole is a beast. The bunkers look great. One of the members I played with said some of the back lips of the green side bunkers are so steep that you can’t take a back swing if your ball ends up near them. I could see it happening on the bunkers left of the second green.


Tree removal didn’t really open up the driving corridors because the rough while not real high, was brutal.


They expanded the greens. Whoever set the pins was not in a good mood today. Every pin but 17 was tucked in a corner. If you have any specific questions fire away.

Hi Rob-
That's great that you were able to play there yesterday. I've only seen pictures but it looks fantastic and the tree removal makes it look like an entirely different course. It goes to shows you how overgrown the course had truly become. Just a few quick questions:
1) What were your impressions of the two new par 3's, #'s 5 and 15? Approximately how long do they play from the championship tees? Did you find those to be pretty difficult overall?  Miss the green at either one and it will be tough to make par?
2) Did they open up the right side of number 9? It used to be that you had to drive it either into the extreme left side of the fairway or even into the left rough to have a shot at hitting that green. Any drive right of center was pretty much blocked out by those trees. I never liked that about that hole, hopefully they cut down a few trees.
3) How is the look on number 4 tee?  The trees they took out were huge and blocked any view. I imagine it looks totally different but also visually very appealing.
4)  Is there anything about the renovation that you didn't like or feel like they could have done differently? How about the members that you played with, do they like it? Did you get the sense that there was some grumbling about all the tree removal that took place?
Anyway, I look forward to your response and I hope that you are well and that your game is as solid as ever!
Best,
John   

[Rob Marshall]

John,
The new par 3 5th plays 180 from the tips. It's got a  mid-sized two tiered green. It's really well bunkered. We played from the blues and it was solid 8 iron. They added a ledge on the slope in front of the 3rd green so if you land on the front the ball won't funnel all the way down to the bottom of the hill (230 yards from the back). The 15th looks great. The right side of the green drops off severely where the old pond was located. The left side has some deep bunkers. It only tips out at 160 yards but the green is very long and narrow. It will be tough to hit when the wind is up an green is firm.


On 9 it looked like they removed some trees on the right but it's still a difficult driving hole and if you miss the fairway left the rough was brutal. They made the green larger. Probably my least favorite hole on the course.


The view from the 4th tee is amazing with the trees gone. I didn't walk back but the hole from the championship tees plays 615.


No one mentioned any grumblings about the tree removal. The members I played with love the changes but I think everyone agrees it's much harder. I'm not sure how many members would want to play it every day. Men's tees range from 6195 to 7360.


The 6th hold is 500 yards from the championship tees. On opening day Jeff's nephew Trevor Sluman played the championship tees. Hit driver and still had 195 in. 6 thru 9 is a tough stretch of holes (500, 460, 430, 480)


My 1.6 was 5 from the blues and with the rough I needed more. Rumor has it that there will be an announcement soon about another event coming down the road.

[John Blain]

John,
The new par 3 5th plays 180 from the tips. It's got a  mid-sized two tiered green. It's really well bunkered. We played from the blues and it was solid 8 iron. They added a ledge on the slope in front of the 3rd green so if you land on the front the ball won't funnel all the way down to the bottom of the hill (230 yards from the back). The 15th looks great. The right side of the green drops off severely where the old pond was located. The left side has some deep bunkers. It only tips out at 160 yards but the green is very long and narrow. It will be tough to hit when the wind is up an green is firm.


On 9 it looked like they removed some trees on the right but it's still a difficult driving hole and if you miss the fairway left the rough was brutal. They made the green larger. Probably my least favorite hole on the course.


The view from the 4th tee is amazing with the trees gone. I didn't walk back but the hole from the championship tees plays 615.


No one mentioned any grumblings about the tree removal. The members I played with love the changes but I think everyone agrees it's much harder. I'm not sure how many members would want to play it every day. Men's tees range from 6195 to 7360.


The 6th hold is 500 yards from the championship tees. On opening day Jeff's nephew Trevor Sluman played the championship tees. Hit driver and still had 195 in. 6 thru 9 is a tough stretch of holes (500, 460, 430, 480)


My 1.6 was 5 from the blues and with the rough I needed more. Rumor has it that there will be an announcement soon about another event coming down the road.

Thanks, Rob. Sounds like the renovation was by all accounts a success. Regarding an announcement in the near future the only thing I have heard is that the club was interested in hosting the 2027 US Amateur. Whether that is what's coming down the pike or maybe something else I guess we will find out soon enough.
By the way, I heard CCR is having their invitational this weekend but it's a smallish field of 50 or so and just local players, members and maybe some past champions. No socializing or member-guest division, just golf. That was always such a nice event and one that I looked forward to for many years although I don't think I've played in it for 6 or 7 years.
Be well.
John

[Rob Marshall]

I thought they said 2028 but you could be right