Magazine raters and the oldest profession......

[Greg Tallman]

Paul, if every panelist were as respectful and professional as yourself there would be no issue. I can assure you this is not the case, with any of the magazines.

Greg:


Nice to see an old voice weigh in on this, and thank you.  The panelists all insist that problems are few and far between, but many of the golf professionals I know would agree with your take.

TD, I had always threatened to write a “tell all” if I were to leave the club I was at. While I would enjoy doing so, putting names to incidents, I’ll refrain from doing so. As you are well aware the most egregious of the unseemly dealings with regard to the ratings has been cleaned up. It was painful to watch that occur as part of the panel that had previously been only professional but was allowed to devolve into a profession.

[JC Urbina]

Greg,


I know of what you speak, I was having lunch with the GM at Pasatiempo eons ago when he received a phone call from the Pro Shop asking what they should do regarding a group of raters that had just shown up.  I overheard the conversation and was surprised that the raters in question were so demanding.  I know the GM was doing his best to accommodate the raters but nothing seemed to be good enough.


I felt sorry for him.


On the other hand I recently played a course with a member at a course in the south, he asked if I rated for Golf Magazine, I said yes, he asked me not to rate the course.   He just wanted us to enjoy the golf course and have fun playing it

[Mike_Young]

It's not easy being Doak.  A few years back we played a few rounds together and his presence generated responses ranging from "they had no idea who he was" to "can you come in and join our greens committee meeting?"  In the latter instance Tom graciously returned to the clubhouse (did I detect a shoulder slump?) while I hit the bricks.

Bogey

Michael,I don't know if TD remembers this but a few years ago he was playing with myself, Freddie M( pro at CD) and a redneck friend of mine.  When we walked off the 8th green my buddy said to Tom " now what do you do?"....obviously my friend was not on any panel or even had a clue what he was playing...that's whay I play with him.

[Mike_Young]

Greg,


I know of what you speak, I was having lunch with the GM at Pasatiempo eons ago when he received a phone call from the Pro Shop asking what they should do regarding a group or raters that had just shown up.  I overheard the conversation and was surprised that the raters in question were so demanding.  I know the GM was doing his best to accomdate the raters but nothing seemed to be good enough.


I felt sorry for him.


On the other hand I recently played a course with a member at a course in the south, he asked if I rated for Golf Magazine, I said yes, he asked me not to rate the course.   He just wanted us to enjoy the golf course and have fun playing it

Greg and Jim,
I to have seen the rater issues you mention above.   While you were having the issue at a resort course of not being on a list to be rated because you had already been there,  it is an even greater issue for those courses throughout the country who will never be on a list but the rater shows up with his buddies for a normal round and shows his card asking for comp with no intention of rating you...that's my gripe..

[Peter Pallotta]

It's not easy being Doak.  A few years back we played a few rounds together and his presence generated responses ranging from "they had no idea who he was" to "can you come in and join our greens committee meeting?"  In the latter instance Tom graciously returned to the clubhouse (did I detect a shoulder slump?) while I hit the bricks.

Bogey

Michael,I don't know if TD remembers this but a few years ago he was playing with myself, Freddie M( pro at CD) and a redneck friend of mine.  When we walked off the 8th green my buddy said to Tom " now what do you do?"....obviously my friend was not on any panel or even had a clue what he was playing...that's why I play with him.

I would've paid big money to see Tom fall into a southern drawl and answer "Well, sir, ah build these here golf courses -- right in America and I reckon jus' about all over God's green earth too". 

[Mike_Young]

It's not easy being Doak.  A few years back we played a few rounds together and his presence generated responses ranging from "they had no idea who he was" to "can you come in and join our greens committee meeting?"  In the latter instance Tom graciously returned to the clubhouse (did I detect a shoulder slump?) while I hit the bricks.

Bogey

Michael,I don't know if TD remembers this but a few years ago he was playing with myself, Freddie M( pro at CD) and a redneck friend of mine.  When we walked off the 8th green my buddy said to Tom " now what do you do?"....obviously my friend was not on any panel or even had a clue what he was playing...that's why I play with him.

I would've paid big money to see Tom fall into a southern drawl and answer "Well, sir, ah build these here golf courses -- right in America and I reckon jus' about all over God's green earth too".

Freddie loved it...I don't remember TD really saying anything...

[Mike Hendren]

Mike, two comments that don't warrant my surprise face:  1) your friend is a redneck; and 2) Doak didn't say anything.

I can't disagree with you that the rating  panels serve no purpose.  But then again, if I walk by a $5 bill on the sidewalk in downtown Nashville today I'm damn sure I'm going to pick it up and put it in my pocket. 

Hope you're well.

Mike

Oh, one other practice I utilized as a rater - I always put my credit card on the counter with my rater card when introducing myself.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Those of us in the "C List" category almost never get recognized.  I did have a guy (a banker who did corporate client outings) hear my conversation and realized I had designed Giant's Ridge.  He praises it endlessly, and I start puffing up a bit.  Then he says he likes it because, "For $150 bucks I only get golf in Brainerd area.  Here, I can golf 'em, sleep 'em and feed 'em for the same amount!"


Made me realize that (perceived) value is always a thing, probably at any price level.

[John Kavanaugh]

Oh, one other practice I utilized as a rater - I always put my credit card on the counter with my rater card when introducing myself.

I’ve spent my entire life around inspectors and politicians. The ole pull the credit card out trick is nothing more than a reminder that they ain’t paying.


It’s like a contractor with a Jesus fish on his bumper. They just advertising that somebody gonna get crucified.

[Mike_Young]

Jeff,Those of us on the "D list" don't care if we get recognized or not as long as that rater like Michael H above puts his credit card on the counter with his rater card...

[John Kavanaugh]

Jeff,Those of us on the "D list" don't care if we get recognized or not as long as that rater like Michael H above puts his credit card on the counter with his rater card...

Why both at a D listers course?

[Mike_Young]

Oh, one other practice I utilized as a rater - I always put my credit card on the counter with my rater card when introducing myself.

I’ve spent my entire life around inspectors and politicians. The ole pull the credit card out trick is nothing more than a reminder that they ain’t paying.


It’s like a contractor with a Jesus fish on his bumper. They just advertising that somebody gonna get crucified.

When the guy has a Jesus fish, proceeds to tell you to have a blessed day and shakes your hand with two hands you better watch out.  Just last week had that scenario with a guy that wanted to bring his sawmill out to cut some cedar trees at course...the deal was a half and half split of the lumber...nailed me...

[Mike_Young]

Jeff,Those of us on the "D list" don't care if we get recognized or not as long as that rater like Michael H above puts his credit card on the counter with his rater card...

Why both at a D listers course?

I agree...all I wanted was the credit card.....

[Tim Martin]

Oh, one other practice I utilized as a rater - I always put my credit card on the counter with my rater card when introducing myself.

I’ve spent my entire life around inspectors and politicians. The ole pull the credit card out trick is nothing more than a reminder that they ain’t paying.


It’s like a contractor with a Jesus fish on his bumper. They just advertising that somebody gonna get crucified.

I have a friend who owns a body shop. His business card says “We f- -ked the last guy so we could pass the savings onto you.”

[Mike Hendren]

Barney, like a good fish in a dynamited pond, I just knew you'd jump in the boat.  Sorry I didn't make it up your way last fall.  Be well.

Mike

[Tom_Doak]

Mike, two comments that don't warrant my surprise face:  1) your friend is a redneck; and 2) Doak didn't say anything.

I really don't understand the fascination with this.  For most of my life, most people in golf didn't know who I was, and certainly didn't recognize me, and there was no reason to expect them to.  So, from my perspective, it's only unusual when someone does recognize me, or makes a big fuss.  Why would I be any different now?


The good thing about it is, I am more likely to hear what people think of my work, if they don't know to whom they are talking.  Generally that's worked out favorably, but not always