News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


Michael Wolf

  • Karma: +0/-0
A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« on: August 28, 2019, 01:24:18 PM »
Looking for some advice from our friends in Australia. Myself +2 will be making our first trip to Australia in late February 2020. We are all experienced travelers. So far we have lined up the following via hosts or online bookings:


Sunday - Yarra Yarra if work is completed, otherwise Commonwealth
Monday - Victoria
Tuesday - RM East and West
Wednesday - ???
Thursday - Kingston Heath and Metro
Friday - ???
Saturday - Cape Wickham
Sunday - Ocean Dunes
Monday - Lost Farm
Tuesday - Barn Dunes
Wednesday - ???
Thursday - New South Wales
Friday - R Adelaide and ???


Open questions I'd welcome your opinions on:


- We have two open days in Melbourne right now. We were thinking some combination of Barwon Head, Gunnamatta, St Andrews Beach and the two Kingswood courses. Should we attempt Barwon and St Andrews Beach for the same day? then both at Kingswood? or some other combination that gets us to Gunnamatta? Or are we missing something else?


- We only have two days in the general Sydney area. Besides NSW, should we go with Newcastle or Ellerston. Also factoring in that this might be a once in a lifetime opportunity to play Ellerston?


- We have one day in Adelaide. Should we play RA twice or is there a 2nd Adelaide course that we should consider instead of a 2nd go around RA?


- What else have we overlooked?


Thanks for you feedback.


Michael

Sean Walsh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2019, 02:08:13 PM »
Michael,


I’m guessing that you’re staying either in the CBD of Melbourne or in the inner south east somewhere. If so that makes getting to Barwon Heads more of a task and both involve a long drive. I love Barwon Heads and would never advocate against it but I would say it’s probably a bridge too far on this itinerary especially when courses like St Andrews Beach are available. Barwon Heads & St Andrews Beach on the same day would be a logistical trial, I’m sure it’s able to be done but others will be more familiar with the ferry arrangements down there than me


To my mind St Andrews Beach is a must and would fit into your first Wednesday perfectly


Woodlands is one other that could be added for consideration. I haven’t played it so others can probably offer more on its merits vs PK & The National courses






Jeff Schley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2019, 03:13:46 PM »
In Melbourne some really enjoyed Metropolitan, although I thought it was average course as I didn't enjoy the bunkering.  Great edges and cuts hugely into the greens, but sand inconsistent. I'd play Kingston Heath twice that day.
Also your open day after RM, I'd play RM again if given the chance the following day. I only played the composite and would really enjoy spending a week there and getting to know each course.

You have to play Ellerston if you have the chance.  I have not and would jump at that for sure.
I hope you have travel days in there for at least half the day and maybe more to get to King Island and then back to Sydney it looks like.  Weather is unpredictable and you can be delayed for hours depending on the clouds and visibility.
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Robert Mercer Deruntz

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2019, 03:22:12 PM »
Peninsula might be worth considering, because it really has a lot of quality shot values. 

Thomas Dai

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2019, 03:50:01 PM »
This interests me as I have thoughts for sometime down the line.
However, there must be a bunch of lessor known courses and under the usual radar gems in the areas surrounding the big Aussie name courses where playing would give the visitor the real feel of Aussie golf?
Now if you’ve travelled a long, long way I can understand the desire to play some big names but a bit like focusing on just the usual suspects during a GB&I trip you’ll likely miss out on the feel and flavour and atmosphere of the golf in the country your visiting.
Hence, which Aussie “lessor lights” located not that far from the usual big name suspects would the locals advise playing?
Atb

Joe Zucker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2019, 04:06:42 PM »
I did a similar trip from the states without the Adelaide part a few years ago and drove down the Mornington Peninsula one day to play St. Andrews Beach and Portsea.  Both were very good courses and well worth the hour drive from the other Sandbelt courses.  As an American, I've played a handful of Doak courses (Pacific Dunes, Old Mac, Streamsong, Rawls, Tumble Creek, Barnbougle) and I think St. Andrews Beach is my favorite.  I definitely would not skip it.   


The other course in that area that I'm sure will be recommended by more knowledgable posters is the Dunes course, but I didn't get a chance to play it.

Lou_Duran

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2019, 04:19:31 PM »
Is March a good time to visit Melbourne for golf?  How about the Great Barrier Reef (not for golf)?


Mark_F

Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2019, 05:53:17 PM »
Is March a good time to visit Melbourne for golf?  How about the Great Barrier Reef (not for golf)?
March is the best time to visit Melbourne, Lou.  Not sure about far north Queensland, but I imagine it will be somewhat hot and humid (which it is all the time, I think).

Michael,

That's a lot of golf, and you still want to play more?

St Andrews Beach is a must play.  Ferries leave Sorrento (about 30 mins drive from StAB) at 7.00,8.00,9.00,10.00,11.00 am and 12 noon daily.  It takes 40 minutes to across the bay, and maybe another 30 mins to drive to Barwon Heads.

It would then take about two hours to drive back to Melbourne after that.

I can take you to Peninsula on the Friday if you aren't knackered. They are better courses than all bar one or two you are playing, but of course I would say that.

They have accommodation there too, which would be handy if you are flying to Tas from Moorabbin airport.

If you want another game in Adelaide, play Grange West.  It's an understated, but interesting course with some really good holes -it's a better course than Metro, NSW and Yarra, with the added bonus they value flavoured milk very highly.

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2019, 01:36:12 AM »
Hi Michael,


From my perspective 1,000km north, by playing RMx2, the Heath, Vic & Metro, you're essentially seeing the best of each style/variety of sandbelt golf. The one sandbelt course that offers an altogether different style to those courses is Woodlands, with its tiny greens. I would recommend playing it before the other 2nd and 3rd tier sandbelt tracks (Comm, Yarra, Peninsula, Spring Valley), because it's going to give you something you haven't already seen a better version of elsewhere.


Which is not to say the other sandbelt courses aren't interesting, fun courses that you'd happily play, but I always think that on a trip away from the familiar styles of golf at home, the attraction that reigns supreme is variety.


For that reason, I think the Wednesday and Friday you have free, and perhaps the Sunday that's currently slated for Yarra or Comm, would be well-spent playing some or all of National (Moonah), St Andrews Beach, Barwon Heads and Thirteenth Beach (Beach) -- prioritised in that order IMO. They are all terrific courses that are going to give you something very different to what you're already playing on the trip. You could also consider Healesville in the Yarra Valley --  an awesome 5000-yard course on hilly land that Mike Clayton's firm designed and built.


In terms of the day between Barnbougle and NSWGC, if you flew from Tasmania to Newcastle rather than Sydney, I could meet you at Newcastle on the Wednesday, play up there and then drive you guys back to Sydney for our game at NSWGC the next day. If you got onto Ellerston, this would obviously change your plans, but I would still think there's logistical merit in flying to Newcastle and getting a hire car one-way to drop off in Sydney. You'll save at least two hours of highway time that way.


If you can get on to Ellerston, I'd recommend playing it. It's a pretty singular, unique piece of design borne of a loaded client with a pretty dramatic site who told one of the best golfers to ever have lived, "build me the hardest golf course you possibly can". The result isn't everyone's cup of tea, but it's absolutely worth seeing and a handful of holes will hang in your mind. In different ways, it is both very much like Sand Hills and also the furthest thing imaginable from Sand Hills!


Depending on what time you need to get away to get to Adelaide (Nigel may have told me this already, but if he did I forgot!), we can play 36 at NSW or get a twilight round in at Bonnie Doon if you wanted to do that. Whatever appeals to you.

Mike_Clayton

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2019, 04:49:08 AM »
I'd play Peninsula North - it's way more than a second tier sandbelt course now - and if you want to see something different play Healesville - it's short but fun and a bunch of good holes and there are some nice places for lunch in the town.


When you play Barnbougle and Lost Farm the best time to tee off is four hours (5 if you bring Bryson) before the sun goes down. The light is perfect late in the day.


Mark_F

Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2019, 05:01:57 AM »
... by playing RMx2, the Heath, Vic & Metro, you're essentially seeing the best of each style/variety of sandbelt golf.
This I have to know.  In what possible world are Peninsula North and especially South, the same style/variety as those five courses?

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2019, 07:30:00 AM »
Michael:


As others have said, it would be a shame to go all that way and play just one round at each of these courses.  Places like Royal Melbourne, Barnbougle and Cape Wickham deserve a bit more time than that, especially if you're not positive that you will go back again.  Of course, since you are playing 36 holes on some days, maybe you will play a second round at some of the others once inspired.


St Andrews Beach and The National are not much more than an hour from Melbourne, and even less if you are staying somewhere down in the sandbelt.  So your open dates on Wednesday and Friday could be devoted to those, which would free you up to stay longer in Tasmania, or to get up to Sydney sooner.  But don't bother with the latter if you're only interested in golf!

Ash Towe

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2019, 08:20:40 AM »
Peninsula North and South are must plays in Melbourne now. Mike did a great job at the club.

Colin Macqueen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2019, 09:05:59 AM »
Michael,


As Ash and mark suggest St.Andrews Beach and Peninsula would be the two to play.  Peninsula is stunning and will be a very highly regarded course once word gets out!


Cheers Colin
"Golf, thou art a gentle sprite, I owe thee much"
The Hielander

Mike_Clayton

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2019, 05:31:09 PM »
Michael,


If you want to see Kangaroos on a golf course best play St Andrews Beach late in the day - or early in the morning. We counted 14 on the 18th last night about an hour before dark. Plenty of Wallabies at Barnbougle - all day.

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #15 on: August 29, 2019, 05:35:41 PM »
Been a long time since I lived in Australia, back when it was year-round open season on Roos.

Looks like its a bit divided now.  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-38964535

Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #16 on: August 29, 2019, 05:56:25 PM »

non golf piggyback question.   Can you buy a wedge shaped pillow in Australia? 


If I make a trip next year it will be to the Barnbougle courses, King Island and the courses on the peninsulas. Fatherest North I'd do would be Woodland and Healsville.

James Bennett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #17 on: August 29, 2019, 06:03:04 PM »
Pete
I used to have wedge-shaped pillows (cuddle-u was the brand) but that was probably 20 years ago.I don't know about today - try google with Australia in the query.
James B
Bob; its impossible to explain some of the clutter that gets recalled from the attic between my ears. .  (SL Solow)

Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #18 on: August 29, 2019, 06:07:07 PM »
Pete
I used to have wedge-shaped pillows (cuddle-u was the brand) but that was probably 20 years ago.I don't know about today - try google with Australia in the query.
James B

Thanks I can find some on-line (Dicksmith for example), but can't find retail stores in Melbourne. Probably need to have my travel agent/concierge team get one delivered to first hotel.

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2019, 06:42:17 PM »
They got em on Amazon if you take a look there Pete

Only thing you need to get when you go Down Under is Vegemite...

David Restrepo

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #20 on: August 29, 2019, 10:07:35 PM »
Agreed to get out to Kingswood North if you get the chance. The recent renovation has put the track in top shape.


Barwon Heads is a fun track, but might not be worth the travel from the Mornington - where you would be able to knock out a few more courses in the vicinity.



Finally, one must take up the opportunity to play Ellerston if given the chance! Might be interesting to compare Norman's design at Ellerston with his design at Cathedral Lodge in Victoria.

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2019, 01:04:33 AM »
I played Woodlands on a whim due to some unexpected free time and loved it.

Mark_F

Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2019, 01:35:49 AM »
Quote from: Scott Warren link=topic=67530.msg1614352#msg1614352

Which is not to say the other sandbelt courses aren't interesting, fun courses that you'd happily play, but I always think that on a trip away from the familiar styles of golf at home, the attraction that reigns supreme is variety.

What this tragically ill-informed post fails to recognise is that Peninsula South has the most interesting set of contoured greens in Melbourne.
The 2nd, 3rd, 4th (!!!), 5th, 9th (!!), 10th, 11th (!!!), 12th, 14th (!!!), 16th and 18th (!!) are among the finest greens in the country.  The rest would be the best greens on most of the other Sandbelt courses, let alone anything in NSW or Adelaide.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2019, 04:05:47 PM by Mark Ferguson »

Colin Macqueen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2019, 07:07:53 AM »
Mark, I've got to agree. A revelation and the future of a lot of my golf when I wash up in Melbourne will be there!


Cheers Colin
"Golf, thou art a gentle sprite, I owe thee much"
The Hielander

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A couple of questions for a trip to Oz
« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2019, 09:14:40 PM »
Mark,


My point was about the value I'd place on maximising variety in the courses chosen, and I stand by that. Some might put Peninsula-Kingswood above other sandbelt courses in the pecking order, but there is a point as you sample the depth of offerings in a region like the Melbourne sandbelt or London heathlands where you stop seeing significant newness or difference in what the courses offer.


For a golfer visiting from afar who might not get back, I think there's more value in playing National (Moonah), St Andrews Beach, Barwon, 13th Beach and Port Fairy (if they'll justify the drive) rather than getting down into the middle of the sandbelt pack and seeing less-good versions of what you've already played.