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Peter Flory

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #25 on: June 17, 2019, 01:47:16 AM »
He has nerves of steel based on that nipped 64 degree wedge on 17.  That shot would be a nightmare to play if you weren't at ease.  He mentioned that he routinely practiced chipping off of green surfaces to improve his technique and also practiced hitting out of divots.  The man was prepared. 


The one strange thing about how it played out was that Woodland and Rose were more than a full hole behind.  If I were Koepka, I would have stalled to see what Woodland did on 17 before hitting into 18.  I'd want to know whether I need to make eagle or not. 

Mike Bodo

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #26 on: June 17, 2019, 01:58:52 AM »
The one strange thing about how it played out was that Woodland and Rose were more than a full hole behind.  If I were Koepka, I would have stalled to see what Woodland did on 17 before hitting into 18.  I'd want to know whether I need to make eagle or not.
I was shocked Koepka didn't pull Driver out on 18 tee and hit 3-wood instead, as he could have left himself with a much shorter shot and stoppable shot to the green. Granted, hitting driver presents a greater risk/reward component, but when you're two shots or even a shot down, who cares!? It's the U.S. F#^'ng Open, for crying out loud!! As it was, he overcooked his 3-driving iron, made a poor chip from off the green, missed his birdie putt and the rest is history. Had he at least gotten a birdie to reduce the lead to one it may have changed the way Woodland played his second shot on 17 green. It surely would have made him less comfortable over it.
"90% of all putts left short are missed." - Yogi Berra

Sam Kestin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #27 on: June 17, 2019, 02:03:19 AM »
I certainly wouldn't have minded a firmer golf course.


It's fair to say that there is no controlling for the sun not coming out for four days. Nevertheless, I heard more than a few people mention on-air that the USGA put a lot of water on the golf course in the few days prior to the start of the event. Supposedly, their (understandable) goal was to insure themselves against a repeat where an excess of sunshine/wind catches them off-guard and the players start complaining again. Who knows if this is accurate or not--but if they could have gotten the course faster (and they may well not have been able to) I wish they had.


I say that mostly because the soft conditions felt at times like they led to insufficient penalties for getting out of position. It felt like Justin Rose short-sided himself constantly throughout the first three days and was able to hang in there because the softer turf kept short-side pitch shots closer than they'd otherwise be. Turn some of his 6-8 foot par putts into 12-15 foot par putts and you probably would have seen a 54-hole score that better reflected his ball striking.


On thirteen today--Woodland parks his drive miles right to the right hole location over the corner of the bunker from the rought and has no issue taking on the corner and keeping the ball from going over the back. That drive should take that line out of play and force the cool little run-up shot through the throat of the green but the soft conditions kept that line viable.


Firmer conditions would have made the angles matter a little bit more and I would have enjoyed that--but, still, it was a competitive Open and fun to watch the guys take on Pebble.

Peter Flory

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #28 on: June 17, 2019, 02:45:48 AM »
Wind was really the missing ingredient. 

Matthew Rose

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #29 on: June 17, 2019, 03:22:49 AM »
Tournament enjoyable. Broadcast, not so much.

Buck, Azinger, and Curtis Strange may be the three worst commentators anywhere. All three of them together was nauseating.
American-Australian. Trackman Course Guy. Fatalistic sports fan. Drummer. Bass player. Father. Cat lover.

Kyle Harris

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2019, 05:12:17 AM »
Goodnight Irene, the party’s over. The grinder was a championship Killjoy. Good on him!  I just wish we I were better entertained.

Fixed this for you.


I was fine with the telecast. Players play. Spectators spectate. Try not to do either poorly.
http://kylewharris.com

Constantly blamed by 8-handicaps for their 7 missed 12-footers each round.

Thank you for changing the font of your posts. It makes them easier to scroll past.

Mike Sweeney

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #31 on: June 17, 2019, 05:31:20 AM »

Are we going to get rid of 64 degree wedges that facilitate bomb and gouge?


I appreciate the bomb and gouge reference, but that was an amazing precision shot by Woodson and the 64 degree wedge arguably closed out the tournament with a perfect shot that I have absolutely no chance of hitting. Keep the 64 degree wedge in golf. Adding in all the baggage of previous final day leads lost, losing a child, US Open at Pebble. pregnant wife....that was an amazing shot. It seemed like he mishit his second shot on #18, so it never felt like a win until that birdie putt on 18 went in for the finish. Great tournament.
"One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us."

Dr. Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #32 on: June 17, 2019, 07:12:55 AM »
I thought the camera work by Fox was excellent and really showed off the golf course. I don’t know what the answer to the on air broadcast team is but it’s not Azinger, Strange, Buck and Faxon. As much as I enjoyed the Prime Time viewing from the East Coast, waiting all day for the leaders to tee off felt odd. I can say that although I have not played Pebble Beach my takeaway from the tournament is that I would sure like to.

Greg Smith

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #33 on: June 17, 2019, 07:42:19 AM »
There's nothing to blame!   This was a fine US Open.  I didn't watch Buck and Zinger.  I refuse to pay ANY media outlets for ANYTHING, don't pay the cable guys either, and get all my TV sports by artful cyber-piracy.  Therefore I watched the Sky Sports British telecast, which was fine.

The setup was more appropriate than one might expect from the USGA in recent years.   I didn't like the narrow fairways on 4 and 8, but I did like the narrowing/lines on 14 and 15.  And I really did like the changes to 14 green.  Before they roughed that left hand side and enlarged some other areas, that green complex was totally impossible.  Now it's simply difficult, which is the right calibration.  I give Mike Davis an 8.5 out of 10 on this one, which is a good improvement.
O fools!  who drudge from morn til night
And dream your way of life is wise,
Come hither!  prove a happier plight,
The golfer lives in Paradise!                      

John Somerville, The Ballade of the Links at Rye (1898)

Jerry Kluger

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #34 on: June 17, 2019, 07:57:02 AM »
I enjoyed watching although I have to agree that the broadcasters added nothing to the experience - give me Peter Kostis anytime to really give some insight into how the competitors are really playing.  What disappointed me is what we have been harping on for years now, they are hitting the ball too far. Not hitting driver on par 5s and still reaching the green in two is just not what the game is all about. And often reaching the green with an iron after less than driver off the tee.


Still have my pet peeve that they should ban tobacco usage as it is awful seeing Koepka and DJ spitting that awful yellow slime all over the golf course.

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #35 on: June 17, 2019, 08:12:08 AM »
  I didn't watch Buck and Zinger.  I refuse to pay ANY media outlets for ANYTHING, don't pay the cable guys either, and get all my TV sports by artful cyber-piracy.  Therefore I watched the Sky Sports British telecast, which was fine.




Seriously?
Guess we can just assume you don't contribute financially to Ran's website either...
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Erik J. Barzeski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #36 on: June 17, 2019, 08:20:13 AM »
Still have my pet peeve that they should ban tobacco usage as it is awful seeing Koepka and DJ spitting that awful yellow slime all over the golf course.
Two of the biggest health nuts on Tour both chew? Or do they just spit a lot (like other athletes)?
Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, Garland, and Chris.

JESII

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #37 on: June 17, 2019, 08:44:27 AM »
I had the great fortune of playing Pebble Beach in the '99 US Amateur...and didn't feel the need to ever go back for a regular trip. The course was pretty cool but did not meet my exceptionally high expectations. Checked the box and on to the rest.


The 2000 and 2010 US Opens, and every Clambake since did nothing to change my opinion.


This week made me look forward to a time to go back. Could have been as simple as the fairway cut to the cliffs all the way from 4 - 10...not sure. Could have been realizing better that the angles into 13 and 15 really do make a big difference.


As far as the telecast...jeez, those two guys are really good, but boring as could be. Buck should be replaced. Azinger I'm ok with...can't make out the other voices well enough other than Strange...who's always had an annoying voice/manner of speaking in my opinion.


Who made the decision that Woodland's chip on the 17th green would look better from the blimp? If ever a shot called for the worm cam, this was it but we got the Google Earth view..WTF???

Jim Franklin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who’s to Blame?
« Reply #38 on: June 17, 2019, 08:55:43 AM »
I suppose that's why movie stars have always commanded top dollar, ie because a drama is only as good as the characters who enact it, and characters are only as interesting as the men & women who bring them to life. I don't want to see just any alcoholic washed-up lawyer winning the verdict and finding his redemption, I want to see an aging *Paul Newman* winning the verdict and finding his redemption -- and that while up against not just any quality B-level character actors but against the experienced mastery of James Mason and the stunning, haunting beauty of Charlotte Rampling.
This time the USGA got it right by not insisting on the 'director's cut' and instead letting the stars shine; it isn't their fault that, while we had the Clint Eastwood gunslinger, there was no Lee Van Cleef to be found, or even an Eli Wallace, and the Bond character from the British secret service was more a Roger Moore than a Sean Connery.


Good copy here, my friend. You incorporated The Verdict and Regarding Henry in scribbling about championship golf. Well did.

Wasn't Harrison Ford in Regarding Henry?
Mr Hurricane

BHoover

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who’s to Blame?
« Reply #39 on: June 17, 2019, 09:04:49 AM »
I suppose that's why movie stars have always commanded top dollar, ie because a drama is only as good as the characters who enact it, and characters are only as interesting as the men & women who bring them to life. I don't want to see just any alcoholic washed-up lawyer winning the verdict and finding his redemption, I want to see an aging *Paul Newman* winning the verdict and finding his redemption -- and that while up against not just any quality B-level character actors but against the experienced mastery of James Mason and the stunning, haunting beauty of Charlotte Rampling.
This time the USGA got it right by not insisting on the 'director's cut' and instead letting the stars shine; it isn't their fault that, while we had the Clint Eastwood gunslinger, there was no Lee Van Cleef to be found, or even an Eli Wallace, and the Bond character from the British secret service was more a Roger Moore than a Sean Connery.


Good copy here, my friend. You incorporated The Verdict and Regarding Henry in scribbling about championship golf. Well did.

Wasn't Harrison Ford in Regarding Henry?


Correct

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #40 on: June 17, 2019, 09:20:41 AM »
My wife, who kept her back to the tv, became so bothered by what seemed to be the same guy yelling over each shot that she asked me to leave the room. We compromised, she left. It would be as simple as not showing streakers to edit out the yelling with high speed computers and such. Another thing that specifically bothered me. I believe I could hear the drone flying around in the background of some shots. And while we are at it, I wish a toe fungus upon the yacht guy that I was forced to watch for four days straight.

Terry Lavin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who’s to Blame?
« Reply #41 on: June 17, 2019, 09:36:27 AM »


Wasn't Harrison Ford in Regarding Henry?



Yep. He played one of my favorite characters: a medical malpractice trial lawyer who had to get shot in the head to grow a conscience. Classic.
Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people.  H.L. Mencken

Mike Hendren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #42 on: June 17, 2019, 10:06:21 AM »
I enjoyed it immensely and rarely, if ever, even notice who's broadcasting.  This was a game played at the highest level on a course that is both visually and actually stunning with the highest demand on approaches and short game.  Nearly every hole has a nice dispersion of scoring.  The shot tracker enhances the drama as well. 

I look forward to your collective critiques of tonight's WWE Monday Night Raw telecast.   

Bogey
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #43 on: June 17, 2019, 10:10:35 AM »
My wife, who kept her back to the tv, became so bothered by what seemed to be the same guy yelling over each shot that she asked me to leave the room. We compromised, she left. It would be as simple as not showing streakers to edit out the yelling with high speed computers and such. Another thing that specifically bothered me. I believe I could hear the drone flying around in the background of some shots. And while we are at it, I wish a toe fungus upon the yacht guy that I was forced to watch for four days straight.


agreed about the yelling .
Don't edit it out-eliminate it
My goodness when did it become a thing to yell absurd shit just before a players settles..
ANGC has this right-pretty simple-toss a few(though ANGC never needs to) and it ends
win-win
« Last Edit: June 17, 2019, 10:30:32 AM by jeffwarne »
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Ben Sims

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #44 on: June 17, 2019, 10:25:08 AM »
I’m sure this will blow someone’s gasket, but the most entertaining final round of a US Open in quite some time was in 2015. You know, that place they never show in any Fox promo.

William_G

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #45 on: June 17, 2019, 10:29:10 AM »
i get blamed for everything, i'm good with that, but I also get the credit


BK could have birdied 6, parred 8/12 and birdied 14/18, incredible par @ 2 from the barranca,  :o


GW had it all day all week, well done


unfortunately Pebble was the same everyday, and that is unusual for west coast weather


too many folks standing around in red jackets or otherwise attired inside the ropes


not a lot of car crashes, so many were not entertained


https://www.golfchannel.com/video/live-us-open-2019-jaime-diaz-usga-setup


cheers
It's all about the golf!

Rick Shefchik

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #46 on: June 17, 2019, 10:39:37 AM »
If this is a poll, put me down as entertained, unbothered by the announcers and satisfied with the USGA -- this time. I'd like to have seen at least one day of sun and wind, but I can't think of anyone to blame for the lack of either.
"Golf is 20 percent mechanics and technique. The other 80 percent is philosophy, humor, tragedy, romance, melodrama, companionship, camaraderie, cussedness and conversation." - Grantland Rice

Bernie Bell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #47 on: June 17, 2019, 10:47:41 AM »
What is "entertaining"?  I was quite content watching virtually every shot that Woodland, Rose and Koepka hit for 4+ hours.  The Fox tech is 2 levels above anyone else.  Swap out Zinger and Buck and it's a slam dunk.  I was "entertained" watching Kid Rock resume play at the Pebble Pro-Am after spending a 90-minute weather delay with his partner John Daly.  But it surely wasn't championship sports.

Ted Sturges

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #48 on: June 17, 2019, 11:48:30 AM »
Wow...lots of "get off my lawn" stuff on this topic.  Geez.


Though I agree that Buck and Azinger are not Nantz and Faldo, there was a lot to like about this US Open telecast (for me):


1.  Cudos to the USGA (and I was a USGA Committee person for 13 years) for finally managing to NOT be the story.  They let Pebble Beach take center stage, and that was a beautiful thing to see.


2.  Pebble Beach is one of if not THE most gorgeous properties for golf, and Fox showed us a ton of the property.  I for one loved the drone shots.  We got to see views that no network has ever shown of PB, and for that (focusing on the golf course and property) Fox gets high praise from me.  And for those of you who poo-poo the "Disney cement shores" of Pebble Beach, just realize that if they weren't there, many of those holes would have eroded into the sea.


3.  We got to see way more golf than any network has ever shown in a major (the Saturday and Sunday telecast began 5 full hours before the leaders teed off).  If you love golf, you had to love that part.


4.  I thought Fox did very well presenting the human interest stories along the way (from Woodland's friendship with the Special Olympian to the young lady who dives for golf balls off #18, I enjoyed all of that stuff).


5.  The view they provided for Koepka's second shot on #6 (from the tower) was breathtaking.


6.  Having Jim Nantz (who lives on the course) up to the booth for a few minutes was true class.  And Joe Buck saying directly to him, "You're the best ever", was something I've never seen in sports broadcasting before.  It was a very cool moment.


The telecast wasn't perfect and Joe Buck and Azinger are certainly not my favorite, but (a) Fox has come a very long way from their first US Open and (b) there was a ton of stuff to enjoy.


TS

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #49 on: June 17, 2019, 11:57:53 AM »
Wow...lots of "get off my lawn" stuff on this topic.  Geez.


Though I agree that Buck and Azinger are not Nantz and Faldo, there was a lot to like about this US Open telecast (for me):


1.  Cudos to the USGA (and I was a USGA Committee person for 13 years) for finally managing to NOT be the story.  They let Pebble Beach take center stage, and that was a beautiful thing to see.


2.  Pebble Beach is one of if not THE most gorgeous properties for golf, and Fox showed us a ton of the property.  I for one loved the drone shots.  We got to see views that no network has ever shown of PB, and for that (focusing on the golf course and property) Fox gets high praise from me.  And for those of you who poo-poo the "Disney cement shores" of Pebble Beach, just realize that if they weren't there, many of those holes would have eroded into the sea.


3.  We got to see way more golf than any network has ever shown in a major (the Saturday and Sunday telecast began 5 full hours before the leaders teed off).  If you love golf, you had to love that part.


4.  I thought Fox did very well presenting the human interest stories along the way (from Woodland's friendship with the Special Olympian to the young lady who dives for golf balls off #18, I enjoyed all of that stuff).


5.  The view they provided for Koepka's second shot on #6 (from the tower) was breathtaking.


6.  Having Jim Nantz (who lives on the course) up to the booth for a few minutes was true class.  And Joe Buck saying directly to him, "You're the best ever", was something I've never seen in sports broadcasting before.  It was a very cool moment.


The telecast wasn't perfect and Joe Buck and Azinger are certainly not my favorite, but (a) Fox has come a very long way from their first US Open and (b) there was a ton of stuff to enjoy.


TS


ditto
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

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