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Eric LeFante

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Re: Where do the Green Jackets go from here
« Reply #25 on: April 21, 2019, 10:19:06 PM »

It would be nice to see guys hit 6 or 7 iron into 16. We all remember Jack’s 5 iron in 1986, which is equivalent to a 6 or 7 iron today.



Part of the reason for my comment is because the hole today is listed as 170 and it was 179 on Sunday. In old broadcasts you hear the announcers say the hole is 190 yards so I was wondering if they moved the tee box up a little over time for better spectator flow.

I read a while back that they moved the back tee up to build grandstands for the fans. 

Is today's 7 iron really the same as a 1986 5 iron?


For some equipment manufacturers and iron models, yes. Pitching wedges used to be 50 degrees and today some are as low as 44 degrees. Some 7 irons are 31 degrees today vs I believe around 30 degrees for old 5 irons.


Taylor Made just started selling Tiger’s irons and they show stock lofts for the blades (which are weaker than other models they sell) and the lofts Tiger uses. Tiger is close to the old school lofts which makes him longer than most believe since he has some of the weakest irons on tour.



MClutterbuck

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Re: Where do the Green Jackets go from here
« Reply #26 on: April 22, 2019, 11:45:21 AM »
If there is room I think 16 should be lengthened. Now three of the four par 3s require an 8 iron or less so not ideal in terms of variety. It would be nice to see guys hit 6 or 7 iron into 16. We all remember Jack’s 5 iron in 1986, which is equivalent to a 6 or 7 iron today.


DELETED, HAD NOT SEEN SIMILAR COMMENT
« Last Edit: April 22, 2019, 11:50:49 AM by MClutterbuck »

Thomas Dai

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Re: Where do the Green Jackets go from here
« Reply #27 on: April 22, 2019, 01:42:37 PM »

Pitching wedges used to be 50 degrees and today some are as low as 44 degrees.



Iron lofts have certainly got way stronger, that’s for sure. And set composition has changed too, especially at initial purchase.


My recollection is that from the 1970’s onwards, PW’s were more like 52* although in comparison to 50* that’s splitting hairs a bit.


But some things are different though with clubs of this sort of loft, the role they play and that PW and SW’s usually came as part of a ‘set’, normally 3-PW or 3-SW or 2-PW. Sometimes woods, sometimes 1-2-3-4 or 1-3-4-5 or 1-3-5, came with the ‘set’ as well.


Worth pointing out that yee olde 52*-ish blade type PW’s usually had almost no bounce and often had a very narrow width flange, ideal for nipping shots of very tight lies, which back in yonder days were much more common than nowadays - they were thus quite different to a modern day more utilitarian gap wedge of the same loft.


As to SW’s back in yonder days they were usually 56* or thereabouts, generally had big, wide flanges with lots of bounce, so they were fine for bunkers and longer rough - skilled folks could of course do more with them.


As to 60*/LW’s, I don’t recall seeing any available until about 1986 (Ram-TWatson and Ping Eye2) although there may have been others before that or maybe just ones with more loft but without the loft being written on them.


As an aside, Seve apparently never used a 60*/LW, sticking with a 56*.


Good point about Tiger using relatively ‘weak’ lofts in his irons.


Atb

Jeff Evagues

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Re: Where do the Green Jackets go from here
« Reply #28 on: April 22, 2019, 03:30:38 PM »
I have the AP3 irons and the PW loft is 43.
Be the ball

Pete Lavallee

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Re: Where do the Green Jackets go from here
« Reply #29 on: April 22, 2019, 04:01:02 PM »
Don’t forget that the older irons had zero offset. Manufacturers realized that adding offset allowed the player to  strike the ball with a more hands ahead position. This however effectively added loft to the club; this is probably what started the eventual creep in descending loft on irons. The gap wedge is the modern day pitching wedge and the modern modern 3 iron performs just like the old 2 iron.
"...one inoculated with the virus must swing a golf-club or perish."  Robert Hunter

Jim Nugent

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Re: Where do the Green Jackets go from here
« Reply #30 on: April 22, 2019, 05:16:41 PM »

It would be nice to see guys hit 6 or 7 iron into 16. We all remember Jack’s 5 iron in 1986, which is equivalent to a 6 or 7 iron today.



Part of the reason for my comment is because the hole today is listed as 170 and it was 179 on Sunday. In old broadcasts you hear the announcers say the hole is 190 yards so I was wondering if they moved the tee box up a little over time for better spectator flow.

I read a while back that they moved the back tee up to build grandstands for the fans. 

Is today's 7 iron really the same as a 1986 5 iron?


For some equipment manufacturers and iron models, yes. Pitching wedges used to be 50 degrees and today some are as low as 44 degrees. Some 7 irons are 31 degrees today vs I believe around 30 degrees for old 5 irons.

What about length of shaft/grip?  Is today's 7 iron the same length, top to bottom, as the earlier-generation 5 iron?

Joe Leenheer

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Re: Where do the Green Jackets go from here
« Reply #31 on: April 23, 2019, 09:48:33 AM »
Technology will continue to move forward as it should. 


Players today, as a whole, are evolving just as fast as equipment.  Should we restrict training to control distance?


Do we better understand golf physics because of trackman technology and can use old tech to create new results?


Irons don't go further...they just have different numbers on them...and the argument that they "launch higher" isn't strong as that is a product of superior ball striking.  Most tour players aren't playing huge cavity back irons with low CG's.  I have new tech and still can't get a 5 iron above my head.


...but back to the Green Jackets....


Tiger hitting 8 iron into a bunch of greens on Sunday is a result of course management on his part, weather conditions, and ball striking....not technology.  I don't believe they "need" to add distance....but ANGC doesn't have any "needs".  Adding a couple yards here or there doesn't get me any less or more excited (which "more" isn't really possible) about the Masters.   


I did like the "more difficult" #5.  Berckman's place is irrelevant to me....to each their own if you wanna spend time there instead of on the course. Adding infrastructure, tunnels, or whatever doesn't matter much either.  My experience as a patron last year was unparalleled to any other spectating experience I've had.


My only request would be to restrict my access to the merchandise shop....THE most dangerous place on property. [size=78%] [/size]
Never let the quality of your game determine the quality of your time spent playing it.

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