17th at Cabo Del Sol Ocean - Gone?

[Emile Bonfiglio]

Heard from someone playing down there that this hole in no longer part of the routing and that there has been a new inland par 3 added (now called #12).


If that is true, I think this degrades this course out of the world top 100. It was part of 3 amazing finishing holes and 1 of 3 oceanfront par 3's. Any details would be appreciated.

[Tom_Doak]

This seems unlikely.


Not that the resort owners wouldn't love to find a way to cash in that land for real estate, but there were already houses all along the left side of the hole overlooking the ocean . . . putting a new home site where the green is would make them VERY unhappy.  And you've got to get from 16 to 18 somehow, so you can't block the path with real estate.


If the report is true, it would be a giant blot on the course, but it will take a couple more sources for me to believe it.  There are all kinds of crazy rumors in the golf business, and a lot of them are just pure b.s.

[Emile Bonfiglio]

This seems unlikely.


Not that the resort owners wouldn't love to find a way to cash in that land for real estate, but there were already houses all along the left side of the hole overlooking the ocean . . . putting a new home site where the green is would make them VERY unhappy.  And you've got to get from 16 to 18 somehow, so you can't block the path with real estate.


If the report is true, it would be a giant blot on the course, but it will take a couple more sources for me to believe it.  There are all kinds of crazy rumors in the golf business, and a lot of them are just pure b.s.

Roll over the course routing on their site, https://www.cabodelsol.com/golf/the-ocean-course/ Hole 12 says "new hole par 3" with no drawings and the old 16 is now listed as the 17th. I just messaged with a person that played there today. There is a soccer field south of the first hole on the mountain course that would be the assumed location of the this new hole as it works perfect with the new routing.

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Confirmed!!!! Called their 866#.  Happened in November.  New 12th hole.  16th is now 17th.  Housing more likely than a Beach Club.  Other golf renovations planned.  Nothing on Internet. Decided to call. Amazing!! 

[Tom_Doak]

Wow.  Congrats on being a news breaker, Emile.


I guess we can cross Cabo del Sol off the list of places to go. 


Curious:  I don't follow the rankings that closely anymore; had their course been pushed out of the World Top 100 lists recently?  If so, I'd guess it was easier for the owners to say, screw it, we are taking the money.  If not . . . I guess that's still their POV.

[Emile Bonfiglio]

Wow.  Congrats on being a news breaker, Emile.


I guess we can cross Cabo del Sol off the list of places to go. 


Curious:  I don't follow the rankings that closely anymore; had their course been pushed out of the World Top 100 lists recently?  If so, I'd guess it was easier for the owners to say, screw it, we are taking the money.  If not . . . I guess that's still their POV.

GD had it at 70 (non US courses), 138 overall. Not the first time a course in Cabo has sacrificed an oceanfront hole for the sake of the Gringo (I'm looking at you El Dorado). That will however, make one heck of a sweet place to build a modest casita.

[Tom_Doak]

I just checked - the course had also disappeared from the GOLF Magazine World Top 100, which used to be what they hung their hat on.  I don't know if that happened in 2017 or earlier, but it wasn't even listed as one of the courses that "came close" [the next 15] so they probably figured they were done with that.

[Jake Marvin]

Looking past the loss of #17 (which is sad, as far as losing a hole goes), that sure looks like an awkward arrangement for the new stretch of 11-13. Wonder if there's any changes coming for new #13 to make the routing flow better?


That said, trading in such a great hole for 160 yards of what appears to be relatively featureless land is a shame, at least for the golfer.

[Tim Leahy]

Anybody in contact with Greg Tallman here? He was the pro there who hosted our King's Putter(Tequilla Cup) and might have all the details. He was a frequent poster here also.

[Greg Tallman]

The elimination of 17 a couple of months ago is but one of many changes happening to The Ocean Course. Eventually 8 holes will be eliminated or altered as development plans are implemented.


Tough to watch but as Glen Frey once sang... the lure of easy money has a very strong appeal.

[Tom_Doak]

Tough to watch but as Glen Frey once sang... the lure of easy money has a very strong appeal.

You should have used an alias.
(In case somebody squeals.)


Sorry to hear about the master plan.  That’s the first time I can think of where somebody just took down a top 100 course, to sell the real estate.

[Jeff Schley]

Say it ain't so.   

[Greg Tallman]

Tough to watch but as Glen Frey once sang... the lure of easy money has a very strong appeal.

You should have used an alias.
(In case somebody squeals.)


Sorry to hear about the master plan.  That’s the first time I can think of where somebody just took down a top 100 course, to sell the real estate.

Tom, I have been gone from CDS for a little more than a year and a half when the plans were first floated. The resulted will be more of a El Dorado/Discovery experience versus great golf as the anchor... gotta give them what they want and down here the experience stuff far outweighs pure golf.


The course will still be pretty good and not nearly as disjointed as El Dorado post renovation.


New careers are fun at 50!!!

[Simon Holt]

I played a couple of weeks ago but was told when booking in December that it was no longer there.  They are building a beach club on the beach.


A couple of the ocean holes on the front 9 are changing too, and don't hold your breath about the 18th either.


I was pleasantly surprised how much I liked the course.  It has more eye candy than Diamante if that's your thing but I couldn't help feel that the course everyone has known will be far from the course you'll see in the next couple of years.


Still free tacos with at the turn with the $400 green fee though...fill your boots!

[Lou_Duran]

I am sure glad that my wife talked me out of buying a fractional share of a condo there.  The natural beauty of the course with the arid landscapes and the ocean is what attracted me the most.  I suspect that existing owners aren't very happy with what's going on.  It reinforces the idea that investing in a golf property without zoning/use guarantees via deed restrictions is not a good idea.

[MClutterbuck]

The elimination of 17 a couple of months ago is but one of many changes happening to The Ocean Course. Eventually 8 holes will be eliminated or altered as development plans are implemented.


Tough to watch but as Glen Frey once sang... the lure of easy money has a very strong appeal.

You have just convinced me never to buy property in Mexico. How is this even legal?

[Greg Tallman]

Not sure how this example prompted the Mexico comment. Heck, there are thousands of homes in the US built around courses that NLE mas have been transitioned to parks and such.


The changes to the golf have been relatively well received considering the overall plans for the project. Most of us on here get WAY more wrapped up in the quality to the course design than the masses. Just give them solid golf in great condition and all the other amenities and they are over the moon.

[Tom_Doak]

Most of us on here get WAY more wrapped up in the quality to the course design than the masses. Just give them solid golf in great condition and all the other amenities and they are over the moon.

Maybe, but it seems to me your owners are putting at risk the very thing that made golfers want to go to Cabo in the first place (desert meets ocean!).


Maybe it’s such an established destination now that it doesn’t need that, but maybe people will stop bringing their clubs.

[Greg Tallman]

Most of us on here get WAY more wrapped up in the quality to the course design than the masses. Just give them solid golf in great condition and all the other amenities and they are over the moon.

Maybe, but it seems to me your owners are putting at risk the very thing that made golfers want to go to Cabo in the first place (desert meets ocean!).


Maybe it’s such an established destination now that it doesn’t need that, but maybe people will stop bringing their clubs.

Tom, i am fearful that the accessible golf options here may no longer attract a high level of golfer but the reality is the when winter hits it is still about the most certain option for perfect weather and solid golf. That said losing an “anchor facility” is not great.

[Joel_Stewart]

Hasn't Diamante  done the same thing?

[Mike_Trenham]

Sorry to hear about the master plan.  That’s the first time I can think of where somebody just took down a top 100 course, to sell the real estate.

Tom would Lido not be a good comparison?  Didn't the hotel become the priority and when money got tight they sold off the holes along the ocean?

[Yannick Pilon]

This whole thing is unbelievable to me.

There are only a handful of homes along the back nine of the Ocean course, and most of them are on the 17th hole. I really don't understand the logic of eliminating one of the most spectacular holes on the property in order to build what would be a small Beach Club. If they plan on seeing many more homes being built in that area in the near future to justify the need for a beach club, why not use the lands just south of the 16th hole, which have homes that are mostly abandonned right along the beach??

So many areas around the course appear to have been abandonned many years ago (the huge area right of 5 and 6, the big house pad built on the right side and encroaching on the right of 16, and the huge expanse of land on the left of 18 and beyond the 18th green, right along the ocean...). The whole place seemed as if the whole developpment of the resort was stopped decades ago. While the course itself was good, the whole surroundings of it seemed very odd to me, as if it was incomplete, or just simply frozen in time.

This being said, the scary/spectacular tee shot on 17 was the highlight of my golf round at Cabo del Sol, AND the highlight of my whole "Cabo del Sol experience". I don't think I would spend 300+US$ again to play there if that's how they plan on changing that "experience". What's next, the 7th??

Just sad....

YP

[Tom_Doak]

Sorry to hear about the master plan.  That’s the first time I can think of where somebody just took down a top 100 course, to sell the real estate.

Tom would Lido not be a good comparison?  Didn't the hotel become the priority and when money got tight they sold off the holes along the ocean?

I'm pretty sure the original owners of Lido went bankrupt.  The 1930's weren't the right time to cash in an extra $100 mil worth of real estate.

[MClutterbuck]

Not sure how this example prompted the Mexico comment. Heck, there are thousands of homes in the US built around courses that NLE mas have been transitioned to parks and such.


The changes to the golf have been relatively well received considering the overall plans for the project. Most of us on here get WAY more wrapped up in the quality to the course design than the masses. Just give them solid golf in great condition and all the other amenities and they are over the moon.

Greg, I was in Cabo in 2003 and played and got pitched to acquire property at Cabo del Sol. I remember well the marketing pitch. I am pretty sure having 17th and then 7 other holes changed pretty much violates all the representations made. Since Cabo del Sol is in Mexico and was so well regarded at that time, it does scare me to buy property elsewhere in Mexico. That is reality and being Latin American myself, this is not meant to offend any Mexican. I am pretty sure I would have more recourse to the legal system in the US than in Mexico if I feel defrauded.

[Kalen Braley]

I've never been there, but this feels a bit like removing the 16th at Cypress and building a replacement par 3 back near the treeline somewhere...