[Garland Bayley]

... But I think the degree to which the older guys "dialed it back" and the degree to which the modern players go at it at 100% are both overstated. I think the gap in speed (as a "percentage") is closer than commonly thought.

And that the gap, though perhaps about the same for the average golfer, aids them more with the ways in which they mis-hit it.
...

Given the degree that the old ball spun more than the current ball, I think "the gap in speed" is significant.
The average golfer has so many flaws in his swing that increasing his clubhead speed is perilous and highly unlikely. The Pope of Slope Wild Willies gain next to nothing from the big headed drivers. I regularly watch average golfers spraying the ball all over the place with their TaylorMade M*s.

[Garland Bayley]

It is interesting to watch an attempt at fixing a complex issue, while looking for a simple solution.  S


Since the late 90s

The ability to design a solid core ball that spins.
...

I believe there always was the ability to design a solid core ball that spins. Simply put a soft cover on a solid core. E.g., I believe it was the 2 piece Bridgestone E5 that regularly scored high on spin off wedge test by having an urethane cover on a solid core.

What was accomplished was the engineering of a ball that both spun low off low lofted clubs and high off high lofted clubs. This was a significant feat, but it creates a ball that has no natural analog to any single substance ball from natural or consistently composed unnatural substance.

A simple solution is to mandate max two piece balls. Compose covers from soft (like balata wound balls) to hard (like topflites) and in between, and let the players choose what they feel suits them.

Wouldn't it be great if they could engineer a ball that would go into the soccer goal more often? Then soccer/football could gain the fans that can't stand the fact that nothing happens of interest for most of the game.

[Pat Burke]

It’s an interesting issue.


I was playing a MacGregor or Cleveland Persimmon my rookie year in 1990.
I did not spin the ball much, and had a hard time adjusting to the new equipment.


When I started trying to play again in 2012 after 10 years of not playing, I was honestly blown away at the changes in equipment.
I had to change everything I believed when it came to driver.  I launched it too low
With too much spin.  I had to learn how to launch the ball significantly higher and my challenge was to do so with far less spin than I was accustomed to.  I felt the ball was out of control when I drove it at proper “numbers”.  I reluctantly moved towards what is correct, giving up my security blanket of spin and being able to work the ball and co trol it better.
I personally find it interesting how often I hear how much easier it is to control the driver, as it has been the opposite for me.  I feel like spin is control, and the low spin while certainly going “hotter” was like a flier for me.  I finally made some swing changes before my injury in 2016,which allowed me to finally launch the ball higher withnenough spin to control it, and I did pick up a5-10 yards.


So, what would I do.  1) I do not believe the 90% of golfers that truly matter have made any great courses obsolete.  The members of Merion, CPC or visitors to the Old Course seem to be plenty challenged from my experiences.
2) the lengthening of golf courses seems to be repeating the absurdity of chasing the conditions we see at Augusta or other tour courses in tv.  Color television probably ruined more courses than pythium
But if I HAD to....
3) I do believe as manufacturers and top players learned more an more about optimization, that the ruling bodies missed a chance to say drivers and balls combinations may not exceed (x mph).  Meaning if a driver launches a prov1 within parameters but the ProV1x goes too far, that driver and ball cannot be used together.


Think about hitting a Pinnacle in a scramble vs a tour ball....that combo is not allowed. Titleist and Bridgestone have an insane number of balls on the approved list.  Some spin more, some less.  Some drivers are zero spin, some a lot.  Pick your combo as long is it doesn’t not exceed (x)


Horse have left the barn maybe though


And as a former player, I do not like the idea of bifurcation.....longer post than intended  sorry

[Peter Pallotta]

Jeff, thanks for asking, and Pat thanks for answering.
Peter

[JMEvensky]

PB,thanks for that.

[Pat Burke]

Happy to   


Thanks!

[jeffwarne]

It’s an interesting issue.


I was playing a MacGregor or Cleveland Persimmon my rookie year in 1990.
I did not spin the ball much, and had a hard time adjusting to the new equipment.


When I started trying to play again in 2012 after 10 years of not playing, I was honestly blown away at the changes in equipment.
I had to change everything I believed when it came to driver.  I launched it too low
With too much spin.  I had to learn how to launch the ball significantly higher and my challenge was to do so with far less spin than I was accustomed to.  I felt the ball was out of control when I drove it at proper “numbers”.  I reluctantly moved towards what is correct, giving up my security blanket of spin and being able to work the ball and co trol it better.
I personally find it interesting how often I hear how much easier it is to control the driver, as it has been the opposite for me.  I feel like spin is control, and the low spin while certainly going “hotter” was like a flier for me.  I finally made some swing changes before my injury in 2016,which allowed me to finally launch the ball higher withnenough spin to control it, and I did pick up a5-10 yards.


So, what would I do.  1) I do not believe the 90% of golfers that truly matter have made any great courses obsolete.  The members of Merion, CPC or visitors to the Old Course seem to be plenty challenged from my experiences.
2) the lengthening of golf courses seems to be repeating the absurdity of chasing the conditions we see at Augusta or other tour courses in tv.  Color television probably ruined more courses than pythium
But if I HAD to....
3) I do believe as manufacturers and top players learned more an more about optimization, that the ruling bodies missed a chance to say drivers and balls combinations may not exceed (x mph).  Meaning if a driver launches a prov1 within parameters but the ProV1x goes too far, that driver and ball cannot be used

Great post Pat.
Ive always needed spin to control the ball and do feel like Im playing a flier with modern equipment-which is why most good players now hit a slight fade as the draw too often hangs out there.
Doglegs and a few vertical hazards can still reward the nonbomber-as well as firm greens with tilt

[John Emerson]

Update:  I received an email from the R&A (I think) to take part in a phone interview about distance in golf.  I guess my tirade was heard haha.  Anyone else get this email that responded to the survey?

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