Olympia Fields hires Keith Foster for master plan

[Howard Riefs]

http://www.friedegg.co/golf-courses/olympia-fields-hires-foster

[Ian Mackenzie]

This is certainly cool, but didnt BOTH courses at OFCC recently get full "restovations"?

[SL_Solow]

Before Olympia Fields got the US Open, Mark Mungeam did the work on the North Course with some "suggestions" from the USGA.  The work was well received (and well done) but the course was criticized for some early round low scoring due in large measure to a USGA decision to cut the rough anticipating growth that came later than expected.  As the tourney went on the North proved to be a fine test.  The USGA had a number of logistical problems with  Cook County officials, due in part to its insistence on handling the issues on its own without help from those who "understood" the system, which may account for OFCC's failure to obtain a repeat.  I note it held a successful US AM and LPGA Championship.


The South work was more recent and done by Steve Smyers. Our own Jeff Goldman was the club chair on the project. I submit that the critique posted is a bit unfair.  The course is much improved for the work and has been well received by members.  Participants at the recent US Am also responded favorably.


As for OFCC being the sternest test in the area from the back tees (altered or otherwise) I suspect many who have played Butler might disagree.  Medinah 3 from the tips is also a candidate and Rich Harvest, if one is considering difficulty alone, is in the team picture.  None of these are necessarily better, just harder.

[Andrew Buck]

I'd point out the article simply states "execute a master plan". 

[Paul Carey]

I thought the shot at the south renovation was unwarranted.  I’ve only played after Smyers work but the south has some great greens with fun slopes and a bunch of interesting approach shots.  A couple holes that are around an irrigation pond is awkward but it’s a fun challenging golf course.

[J_ Crisham]

I played the North course this past Saturday and the course looked outstanding. Other than some tree removal and recapturing some green pad space I did not see much necessary work. As an aside the clubhouse is going thru some very large renovation projects on the rear side.

[Terry Lavin]

Even the best can be made better. Foster is a solid choice.

[SL_Solow]

Terry,  Nothing negative about Foster.  I admire the work he has done.  My comments were directed against what I thought were some inaccurate comments in the republished report.  Again, no knock on Foster, but sometimes the best can be made worse, witness all of the restoration work undertaken to undo prior renovations.  I have confidence in the folks at OFCC and in Foster's track record that this won't be one of those cases but I am always wary of those who take an excellent work and decide they will do better.

[Wayne Wiggins, Jr.]

I thought the shot at the south renovation was unwarranted.  I’ve only played after Smyers work but the south has some great greens with fun slopes and a bunch of interesting approach shots.  A couple holes that are around an irrigation pond is awkward but it’s a fun challenging golf course.

I'm certainly no expert, and hadn't played the South prior to Smyers work, but I think it is outstanding, especially the front nine. I like the North a lot as well, and agree with J_Crisham regarding with the weeds, I mean trees.


Also, as a witness to sometimes the best can be made worse[/size], Foster seems an excellent choice for whatever the club intends to do based on his recent work.
[/size]
[/size]I also made the comment [on Twitter], that Olympia Fields joins Oak Hill and now Congressional in following the path of Inverness (recently), LACC, Aronimink, Winged Foot, and Phila. Cricket of "championship" courses undoing years of modernization and going back to their roots. Who's next? Oakland Hills (didn't the membership vote against a redo recently)? Baltusrol? Scioto? Riviera? The Olympic Club?

[Terry Lavin]

Terry,  Nothing negative about Foster.  I admire the work he has done.  My comments were directed against what I thought were some inaccurate comments in the republished report.  Again, no knock on Foster, but sometimes the best can be made worse, witness all of the restoration work undertaken to undo prior renovations.  I have confidence in the folks at OFCC and in Foster's track record that this won't be one of those cases but I am always wary of those who take an excellent work and decide they will do better.

I didn’t read anything negative in your remarks at all.

[PCCraig]

While there have been numerous accolades for Foster's recent work. I think you could make the case these days that Foster's work is all starting to look too familiar from course to course, in my opinion. Perhaps it's my untrained eye, but bunkering tends to look similar, trees are taken out to an extreme effect, and the mowing lines are almost always presented in the same way.


It's good stuff, but I would be curious to hear if others see the same.


I have a hard time imagining Olympia Fields' courses renovated in Foster's style, and it's curious that Smyer's extensive work is being erased just ten years later, but I'm neither an expert or a member. 

[SL_Solow]

Pat, Let's not get carried away.  No one has seen the plan so it's premature to say that anyone's plans are being erased.  One point of particular interest is that Smyers left most of the greens alone on the South and they are very good.  I'll be interested to see what the new plan does to those greens.

[Tim Gallant]

While there have been numerous accolades for Foster's recent work. I think you could make the case these days that Foster's work is all starting to look too familiar from course to course, in my opinion. Perhaps it's my untrained eye, but bunkering tends to look similar, trees are taken out to an extreme effect, and the mowing lines are almost always presented in the same way.


It's good stuff, but I would be curious to hear if others see the same.


I have a hard time imagining Olympia Fields' courses renovated in Foster's style, and it's curious that Smyer's extensive work is being erased just ten years later, but I'm neither an expert or a member. 

Pat,


I have played two courses that Foster has restored: Eastward Ho! and Moraine. They didn't feel like the same style to me other than they are pretty wide open, and play along similar wild ground. I attach a few photos below - Eastward Ho! the bunker styles appear to be much different and near the greens, they aren't cut vertically into the pads like at Moraine. Also, the mowing lines don't appear to be very similar, but I could be missing something.


Looking at his website, there are sites that have 'flashed' up bunkers and more trees. I think Foster really just looks at what was on the ground, or what the intent was when the course was at it's best and tries to restore that. He did a great podcast where he talks about this in more detail.


Moraine CC











Eastward Ho!

[Ian Mackenzie]

While there have been numerous accolades for Foster's recent work. I think you could make the case these days that Foster's work is all starting to look too familiar from course to course, in my opinion. Perhaps it's my untrained eye, but bunkering tends to look similar, trees are taken out to an extreme effect, and the mowing lines are almost always presented in the same way.


It's good stuff, but I would be curious to hear if others see the same.


I have a hard time imagining Olympia Fields' courses renovated in Foster's style, and it's curious that Smyer's extensive work is being erased just ten years later, but I'm neither an expert or a member. 

I think there's some truth in what you say, Pat.
From my own playing experience, and perhaps since they both share similar GCA heritage, I found CC of Detroit and Knollwood to be VERY similar - especially the bunkering.


Also need to mention that, when we embarked on our course work in 2012/13, I contacted Keith Foster on his cell. While he readily (and politely) conveyed that he was busy and had no additional capacity, he spent an hour on the phone with me and answered a ton of questions. VERY helpful as we were gathering info before retaining an archie.


I still have his number...;-) Should I post it...?...

[Ken Fry]

I like Andy's work with the Fried Egg but I agree, saying Smyers work on the South course was "uninspiring" is not how I viewed my last visit to Olympia Fields.


I played the South course back in 1995 and then last summer.  The course was vastly improved from my first visit and I thought a much more enjoyable course to play vs the North course.  Smyers work dealt with areas that caused issues during heavy rains and really shined up some great green complexes.  I'll be curious what Keith Foster has in mind.


I'll be more interested in what Keith has in mind for the North course.  My complaint about the redo in preparation for the 2003 US Open is the bunkers.  They just seemed out of character.  Reminded me of the work done at Cog Hill.  Beyond a couple of back tees that were added that make for very awkward walk backs, the North course is underappreciated in the Chicago scene in my opinion.  The Willie Park routing, especially on holes 12-16, is flat out fun to play.


Ken