Rakes In Or Outside of Bunkers?

[Craig Disher]

Kyle's right. Middle of the bunker aligned along the line of play. On average it will be the least distance from balls that are in the hazard and therefore be ready for use when the player exits. There is also a fork-like attachment that can be placed on the end of the handle that props it up so that a ball will pass under it. But overall, Rye's solution is the best although it looks so strange that many object. The rake is always in the same place and seldom creates a problem for player or maintenance staff.

[Carl Rogers]

Dormie is the only course I have played with no rakes.


I vote for locating the rakes in the bunker on the low side.

[Charles Lund]

Creatuve options from Saunton Golf Club and Fasterbo Golfklubb.


https://photos.app.goo.gl/DuMwAJWfE38gUCQJ2

One thing to remember about rake placement is that you can replace the ball if it moves when you pick up the rake.  But if the ball is on a slope in the bunker and can't stay in place when you place it back, my understanding is there is a rules issue and it becomes an unplayable lie. 



Charles Lund

[Rick Shefchik]

Creatuve options from Saunton Golf Club and Fasterbo Golfklubb.


https://photos.app.goo.gl/DuMwAJWfE38gUCQJ2

One thing to remember about rake placement is that you can replace the ball if it moves when you pick up the rake.  But if the ball is on a slope in the bunker and can't stay in place when you place it back, my understanding is there is a rules issue and it becomes an unplayable lie. 



Charles Lund

I couldn't remember how to procede, but I found this on Golf Monthly: "You’re not allowed to press it into the ground as that would be a breach of the Rules. Rather you should make two attempts to place it, and if it still rolls away, then place it at the closest spot possible – not nearer the hole – where it will remain at rest. The ball is then in play."

Read more at http://www.golf-monthly.co.uk/videos/rules/rules-of-golf-ball-resting-against-a-rake#P7yr0AOXreUPEP76.99

[Charles Lund]

I  read the link.


It looks like the complicating circumstance would be if the downslope of the front edge of the bunker caused the ball to move closer to the hole when the ball was placed and there was no other spot not nearer the hole to place the ball.


Sounds like an unplayable lie to me.  Return to spot where previous shot was played with penalty of one stroke.  Perhaps recent rule revisions have or would permit dropping back outside of bunker or within two club lengths or future rule revisions might make this an option.


Captains Report I read discussed the importance of placing rake according to club policy, low spot in bunker facing direction of play.  Besides consistency and courtesy, the discussion of this club policy mentioned it would avoid a rake being the cause of an unplayable lie.


Charles Lund

[MClutterbuck]

How expensive are the in ground rake holders? 


Perhaps a little spendy but "solves" the problem... 

Ugly, and the most unfair, if you happen to hit it.

[Lou_Duran]

Kyle's right. Middle of the bunker aligned along the line of play.

And how do you get the rake to the middle of the bunker and properly aligned?  Practice tossing?

Rick- you have the procedure right.  One of the reasons I don't like rakes in bunkers is because they do trap some balls, often on the slope which then presents problems in placing when the rake is lifted and the ball moves. It is very rare that relief under the unplayable ball rule is necessary.

[Mike_Clayton]

There should be no hard and fast rule. Sometimes 'in' is better and sometimes 'out'. Of course, asking golfers to use discretion and common sense if fraught with problems.
It's funny in Melbourne where many bunkers are big and sprawling and they ask you to put the rake in the middle of the bunker - and the only way is to toss it back - where it almost always bounces, leaving a long groove mark.
Just don't leave it on the slopes of the bunker.

[Jon Wiggett]

It seems to me we are discussing a case of whining golfers becoming more and more petty. It used to be that players accepted and indeed appreciated the sporting challenge of diverse lies in hazards. But as the playing surfaces have become more and more conditioned so the tolerance of 'rub of the green' out comes has shrunk. With bunkers that has meant going from finding the sand as it is through asking players to smooth out the sand with feet and clubs. Then it became the norm to have rakes in the bunkers which in turn led to complaints about the rakes affecting outcomes in the pristinely smooth sand so now some misguided individuals are saying lets bury the rakes in the ground but others then note what about if the plastic cap affects my shot. Hey guys, what about when the rake becomes wet because that is what happens with anything stored below ground maybe we need an automatic drying system to ensure my pinkies don't get damp. But won't that be noisy and affect my concentration...... Just where will it all end, with irrigated bunkers and some plonker following each group to rake the bunkers for the players? Oh, wait that already happens.


Gents, I think we need to get a life!!!!

[Ben Hollerbach]

It's a hazard, one should not be entitled to a good lie if their shot is struck into it.

Depending on how the rake is placed outside the bunker, balls destine for the bunker will be kept out and other balls will be knocked in.

Because of those two statements the rake should be stored within the hazard and should never have he chance of influencing a ball that is "fair".

[Lynn_Shackelford]

95%/5% rule is the best IMHO.


I will let you figure out what that means.

[archie_struthers]

 




I've changed my opinion over the years . I'm an outie now.  Too many balls hung up by rakes in the bunker , often in unplayable spots ( do I hear penalty ). 


Outside away from the green so you can grab it and go .

[Craig Disher]

Kyle's right. Middle of the bunker aligned along the line of play.

And how do you get the rake to the middle of the bunker and properly aligned?  Practice tossing?

Lou - I'm inept and I get it there nearly every time. If a golfer can't get it within a CEP of 3', they shouldn't be on the course.

[Charles Lund]

The issue for clubs about rake placement probably relates to the culture of the club and the extent to which the majority of play involves rounds in competitions under the rules of golf. 


I have played at a course where staff in the morning leave ranks on the side opposite the green on downslopes perpendicular to the line of play.  At that particular course, no one seemed to mind as most play was social in nature.  When rakes are moved and balls move toward the center of the bunker, replacing the ball will not result in the ball remaining in the same spot and it will roll toward the center of the bunker, closer to the hole.


I think this type of arrangement contributes to situations arising where people attempting to play by the rules may not play according to the appopriate rule, hole out, and complete the round.  Many people would not know how to proceed.


At clubs where the culture is more traditional as far as rules and more competitive rounds are played, the issue is resolved with a standard policy,usually either in facing a specified direction or out in a specific location.  At New South Wales Golf Club. there were spray painted rake outlines in the designated locations next to bunkers.  At the club I play at, the rule is in the middle of the bunker in a low and flat spot, facing the direction of play.


I posted two different options, one seen in Sweden and one from Saunton in the UK.  One option of in bunker rakes is a curved handle so not much of the rake touches the the and.  For Saunton, the out of bunker location is specified by the location of the device on which the rake is positioned.


There is periodic bad luck of all sorts in my rounds of golf, plus occasional good luck.  We play it where it lies and accept it.  I don't mind having to go out sideways or have to take a drop if I have a severe plugged lie with limited visibility of the ball in the bunker.  On the other hand, when rakes are the source of the problem in bunkers near edges, I tend to like consistent policies more.


Charles Lund

[Thomas Dai]

As an aside, ever seen anyone step on the upturned spikes of a rake? Wacko, smacked in face! Nice work for dentists and medical folks. Not so nice for the individual concerned.
atb

[Ian Mackenzie]

Rakes in the middle of a bunker? Really?
So, that means a player must walk through the bunker to get the rake in addition to walking to his/her ball?


No, thanks.


A compromise that we implemented, following Jim Urbina's recommendation, was simple and effective.


Rakes are placed with their head in the bunker perpendicular to the line of play with its "shaft" resting on the bunker edge that slightly elevates it over the grass.

[jeffwarne]

Rakes in the middle of a bunker? Really?
So, that means a player must walk through the bunker to get the rake in addition to walking to his/her ball?


No, thanks.

Still haven't figured out how one gets out of the bunker if he does this?
Someone tell me again why a rake shouldn't be left outside a bunker on the low side?
I can't remember one situation in 44 years of playing where this was a problem or even a rake was involved.....

[Kalen Braley]

Rakes in the middle of a bunker? Really?
So, that means a player must walk through the bunker to get the rake in addition to walking to his/her ball?


No, thanks.

Still haven't figured out how one gets out of the bunker if he does this?
Someone tell me again why a rake shouldn't be left outside a bunker on the low side?
I can't remember one situation in 44 years of playing where this was a problem or even a rake was involved.....

Jeff,


Agreed. 


And given most American courses usually surround their bunkers with rough, even if the rake stops the ball from going in the bunker, I think the task is pretty similar for most players whether your next shot is from rough or sand...