Whatever happened to the Red, White, Blue flags on greens?

[Cal Seifert]

Surprised people think something as simple as this is not 'classy' but having a $300 laser on your bag that tells you the distance within a yard and even slope is convenient and true to the game.

[Pete_Pittock]

It does take a bit more time for greenkeeping staff to change the color. It is best to keep the routine as simple as possible. Whatever the system the golfer will remember the mistake. Our course has them and I seldom use them for information.


The best story I've heard about any system was when a pro came in after his round and said the pin sheet was the "worst he had ever seen, every one was wrong."  He went away, quietly, miserably, when the official in charge asked "What hole did you start on?"

[Thomas Dai]

Not sure about the use of colour coding back in 1927 but note the length of the flagstick!
atb


(The Worcestershire GC, Malvern, UK. Designed by Alister MacKenzie)

[Ally Mcintosh]

Yellow out and Red in.


Call me a luddite

[PCCraig]

My personal opinion is that the red/white/blue flags look tacky at a private club. They might work to move players around a public course, but for members that need to look at a flag color to determine the location on a green despite having played hundreds of rounds there makes no sense to me. It comes down to unnessasary maintenence. Not to mention, if there are any blind shots to greens a flag color doesn't make any difference. A small wooden 150-yard marker in the rough, with a white/red/blue top is a good compromise, but not my ideal either.

[John Kavanaugh]

I hate aiming poles, rocks, skulls and bears for the same reason.

[jeffwarne]

My personal opinion is that the red/white/blue flags look tacky at a private club. They might work to move players around a public course, but for members that need to look at a flag color to determine the location on a green despite having played hundreds of rounds there makes no sense to me. It comes down to unnessasary maintenence. Not to mention, if there are any blind shots to greens a flag color doesn't make any difference. A small wooden 150-yard marker in the rough, with a white/red/blue top is a good compromise, but not my ideal either.

The form over substance police strike again.(look "tacky")
I'm perfectly fine if you don't like it for purists reasons(but then remove ALL distance aids), or extra maintenance-but how "it looks" is an oh so common American club thing.
The same reason pull carts were so long verboten in the US.
OT but Americans taking caddies in the UK/Ireland no doubt look "tacky"(or at least touristy) to locals and other club members.


So many clubs in America worry so much about how things LOOK, rather than how they play.(the clutter police)
I completely buy the extra maintenance argument-if we weren't talking about a club in America(which even if minimal is way more than the typical UK club)
Many clubs use a pin sheet--more time for maintenance-and pulling out the sheet.
a lazer will tell you how far it is, not where it is on a green-two very different things.
One can play "hundreds" of rounds and not know where a pin is on the green due to failing, aging eyesight, deception,architecture or terrain.


We can agree that the 150 post with a pin marker is a great idea/compromise

[Tim Martin]

Pat-I don’t think from a maintenance perspective that the colored flags are that big a deal. It would seem easier than handing out pin sheets or encouraging players to use lasers or GPS devices which to me really only aid the better player which certainly in scope are the minority. At a course with big greens the color coding whether on a fairway 150 post or at the green certainly is helpful to the majority of players not to mention non-member players at private courses.

[PCCraig]

My personal opinion is that the red/white/blue flags look tacky at a private club. They might work to move players around a public course, but for members that need to look at a flag color to determine the location on a green despite having played hundreds of rounds there makes no sense to me. It comes down to unnessasary maintenence. Not to mention, if there are any blind shots to greens a flag color doesn't make any difference. A small wooden 150-yard marker in the rough, with a white/red/blue top is a good compromise, but not my ideal either.

The form over substance police strike again.(look "tacky")
I'm perfectly fine if you don't like it for purists reasons(but then remove ALL distance aids), or extra maintenance-but how "it looks" is an oh so common American club thing.
The same reason pull carts were so long verboten in the US.
OT but Americans taking caddies in the UK/Ireland no doubt look "tacky"(or at least touristy) to locals and other club members.


So many clubs in America worry so much about how things LOOK, rather than how they play.(the clutter police)
I completely buy the extra maintenance argument-if we weren't talking about a club in America(which even if minimal is way more than the typical UK club)
Many clubs use a pin sheet--more time for maintenance-and pulling out the sheet.
a lazer will tell you how far it is, not where it is on a green-two very different things.
One can play "hundreds" of rounds and not know where a pin is on the green due to failing, aging eyesight, deception,architecture or terrain.


We can agree that the 150 post with a pin marker is a great idea/compromise

Jeff -


It's just my opinion.


My home course has red/white/blue flags and it's hardly the end of the world. My opinion is that having a singular flag color and no other distance aids is what I would prefer at a private club where members play many rounds. It's just easier for the maintenence and a cleaner more consistent look that doesn't take away from the visual of a hole.

[John Kavanaugh]

As expensive as it is today to maintain memberships at private clubs it doesn't hurt to have a home course advantage when gambling. Every piece of information you have that your opponent does not is an advantage.

[Joe Hancock]

As expensive as it is today to maintain memberships at private clubs it doesn't hurt to have a home course advantage when gambling. Every piece of information you have that your opponent does not is an advantage.

Fantastic strategy to belong to a club beyond your means...only gamble against GCA.com-ers that use you for access while limiting the amount of info they get on the course as you allow them to press each time they go another two down.....everybody is a winner in this scenario.

[V. Kmetz]

I didn't notice it, if offered previously, but still another method of indicating hole location is a smaller red flag that can move up and down the flag pole ...low, the pin is in front... high up, the pin is in the back.  This replaced a similar "wiffle ball" type device that had the same effective purpose.


While unobtrusive to the eye, these still do have that drawback of the greens staff members version of front, middle, back.


It's not the exact same discussion, but I like the novelty of "Wicker basket" flags... though original wicker is too expensive to maintain/replace...I wonder why more clubs (out of ornament/identification novelty) haven't adopted some less costly version of this.


cheers  vk

[John Kavanaugh]

If I made a living as a caddie I would want as little information provided for free as possible. I say as I'm charging my robotic buddy for a round this afternoon.

[Jim_Coleman]

   For those who asked, it was Golfweek that docked points for colored flags in its classic course rankings. We were told we were also docked for having ball washers on tees.  Can’t see how this pertains to architecture.

[V. Kmetz]

If I made a living as a caddie I would want as little information provided for free as possible. I say as I'm charging my robotic buddy for a round this afternoon.

No way to speak of the little woman

[John Kavanaugh]

Robotics has saved our marriage.

[V. Kmetz]

Robotics has saved our marriage.

Nice try Dmitri43IXING; we know Russian troll bots are incapable of human union.


But as malware goes, I'm screening your code on that other thread..can you have your molars any more tonsil deep up (any) pro golfer's bung?  It's always DJ this and Ricky that and "a Masters winner dropped by" and "Bubba touched my cheek"...


Can you be any more of a ищейка жокея?

[PCCraig]

   For those who asked, it was Golfweek that docked points for colored flags in its classic course rankings. We were told we were also docked for having ball washers on tees.  Can’t see how this pertains to architecture.

Say what?!?!?!?!?!

[jeffwarne]

   For those who asked, it was Golfweek that docked points for colored flags in its classic course rankings. We were told we were also docked for having ball washers on tees.  Can’t see how this pertains to architecture.

The clutter police is a real thing....

[Thomas Dai]

As a slight aside, some greens are wide and shallow rather than long from front-to-back and some are severely diagonal and some are blind or semi-blind and you can't see all the flag positions from the fairway.
Nice comment above about playing without any flags at all.


atb

[B.Ross]

i too agree that the color coded flag is sadly going away, especially at private clubs. regardless of how it looks, i think it speeds up play. pretty sure that the move to singular colored flag with a numeric system per hole slows down play, at least i feel like it has at where ive played most frequently.

[Kalen Braley]

i too agree that the color coded flag is sadly going away, especially at private clubs. regardless of how it looks, i think it speeds up play. pretty sure that the move to singular colored flag with a numeric system per hole slows down play, at least i feel like it has at where ive played most frequently.

BRoss,


I agree.  The flag colors were always a simple way for me to figure out if which way to go if I was between clubs.  If the pin was blue and my yardage to middle of green was in between clubs I'd take the longer club.  And one less for a red flag. 


With the single color flags you have to check with the grid map thats usually divided into 6 or 7 sections per green, just added more confusion.