Thought Experiment: How Many Clubs Do You Need?

[Peter Pallotta]

Tim's post reminded me of how, let's say, multi-faceted this discussion is. One example: as with my fairly modern set of 14 clubs, why wouldn't I drop -- without missing a single thing/scoring opportunity -- the 3 wood and the 5 woods, and replace them with a "4" wood? My Ping G2 so-called "5" wood is 17 degrees (!) and has a stock shaft that's actually longer than my older-model 15 degree 3 wood and a degree stronger than my 18 degree 2 hybrid/5 wood.  Now, sure, it would be nice to have the 2 hybrid for the occasional long Par 3, but if I want I can now have a 3 iron (see chart below) that's 20 degrees, or, if I've got issues with 3 irons, a 4 iron with 23 degrees. Heck, I could play with nothing more than a modern, 30 degree 6 iron and (because of the longer shafts) basically have my traditional 4 iron thrown in there for free.  Manufacturers have obviously squeezed several long irons into one tiny window/gap precisely because it leads to a 46 (or 45 or 43 degree) PW, and thus 'necessitates' a gap wedge and another and another. So if someone suggests that in their half-set they go driver, 4 wood, 4-6-8-PW-SW-putter, they may not actually be crazy (or just effing around not caring about score).

Ah, alas the chart didn't show up as I cut and pasted it, but all scrambled instead. I hope you trust me...

[George Pazin]

However you can not improve a golfer who has zero interest in getting better.

I doubt there are many who have zero interest in getting better. But there are quite a few who aren't willing to pay the cost to make it a priority in their lives.

[John Kavanaugh]

However you can not improve a golfer who has zero interest in getting better.

I doubt there are many who have zero interest in getting better. But there are quite a few who aren't willing to pay the cost to make it a priority in their lives.

I would say that people who switch to hickories and zero interest in playing better. I played them for a while myself. It takes all the pressure off not caring.


The same might be said for anyone who plays less than 14 clubs.

[Tim Martin]

However you can not improve a golfer who has zero interest in getting better.

I doubt there are many who have zero interest in getting better. But there are quite a few who aren't willing to pay the cost to make it a priority in their lives.

I would say that people who switch to hickories and zero interest in playing better. I played them for a while myself. It takes all the pressure off not caring.


The same might be said for anyone who plays less than 14 clubs.

JK-I first tried to go back to 14 with the addition of a 52 wedge which really didn't help me at all and again created more indecision as I already had three wedges. Nothing has helped my scoring quite as much as a 59 degree Ping L that I use exclusively from green side bunkers and almost feels like cheating compared to what I had been using. I have never been a practicer with the exception of chipping and putting which I have always enjoyed but still only do rarely except for 10 minutes before a round. I can't tell you how liberating it is not to be a range guy and for that reason I am sure I have limited my potential. A dozen swings on the range before a round is about the limit of my practice. That said I must be an outlier according to your previous post as I do care about playing better. My son must have inherited this through osmosis who you couldn't pay to hit a range ball while he worked at the municipal course through high school when they were free. He only became interested after he stopped working there and actually had(rather I had to) to pay for balls.

[Garland Bayley]

Garland,


You can buy equipment that makes it easier to control your trajectory and thus lower your score. However you can not improve a golfer who has zero interest in getting better.


Five years ago I took a lesson I went out and shot consecutive rounds of -8 and -6. Scared the shit out of me so I never took a lesson again. I simply am not interested in changing how and why I enjoy the game. Much like you, I suck on my own terms.

I control trajectory by ball position. Why do I need special equipment for that?

Going beyond a standard swing, which I assume you were referring to, I sometimes control trajectory by face angle.

[Kalen Braley]

Given its Super Bowl weekend, perhaps another example of a high handicapper is in order.


 - He graduated high school in 1970 and went unrecruited...by any school.
 - As his grades were poor, he attended Phillips Academy to raise them up.
 - He was eventually accepted into a tiny liberal arts college in Connecticut where he played lacrosse, football, and squash before earning a degree in Economics.


He then took an assistant job with the Baltimore Colts for $25/week and eventually became one of the greatest coaches to ever walk the sidelines...


A "High Handicapper" by nearly every measure with slightly above average athletic ability at best...


Bill Belichick

[Garland Bayley]

Kalen,

You could also mention US Open champs that turned into high handicappers once they stopped practicing, Billy Casper and Jack Fleck.

[John Kavanaugh]

I honestly had no idea Billy Casper was this good. https://www.golfdigest.com/story/7-numbers-billy-casper-great-golfer

[Doug Siebert]

Give me a driver, putter, PW, 7i and 3i and I'd probably only score a shot or two worse than I otherwise would. I never use fairway woods as it is, and I can vary the output of a 7i and 3i enough to fill in the missing irons. On a course with thick rough I'd probably go with SW, 8i, 4i instead.


If they changed the rules to allow only 7 clubs tomorrow I don't think it would make any difference to my game. I carry 14 because that's what the rules say you can have, and I have a full set of irons so why not carry them so I have more options? Maybe when I get older and carrying a full bag becomes difficult I might consider tossing some clubs.

[David_Tepper]

"I honestly had no idea Billy Casper was this good."

And don't forget Billy Casper was competing against the likes of Palmer, Nicklaus & Player when all 4 of them were pretty much in their prime.

[Steve Lang]

   ... and don't forget Billy Casper raised 11 children, 6 were adopted

[Steve Curry]

I am by no means a very good golfer but have typically played better when getting in a 3 club challenge.  My guess is I think less and keep it simple.

[Ben Hollerbach]

I would say that people who switch to hickories and zero interest in playing better. I played them for a while myself. It takes all the pressure off not caring.

John,


I wholeheartedly disagree and frankly find your statement rather ignorant.


My switch to hickory had nothing to do with a concession to progress but rather a return to a desired period of time and style of play. In my pursuit to play the best hickory possible I've invested more time and focus on improving and playing the best I possibly can. Attending one of the large hickory tournaments around the world you'll find quite a number of players in the same mind set.

In your eyes playing hickory may mean providing an excuse for poor play under the umbrella of using historic equipment, but my experience has been rather the exact opposite. By playing hickory I have to be a better player to score well, I have to perform because my equipment can't cover for me.


Ben

[V. Kmetz]

  ... and don't forget Billy Casper raised 11 children, 6 were adopted

And I didn't know he was THIS good!


As to the issue, there was a great thread some months ago that ranged to how different the game and GCA might be if the club number was standardized at many fewer than 14.


When I played 20x+ a year, I really liked playing with 6-7 clubs at the kooky, beguiling 2500 yard 9-holers that thankfully pepper the area...it was a great contest to break 40, and a real zest to get close to 36.


Another thing - personal improvement-wise - that occurred is that my longer iron game got better...a 3-iron became standard in any abridged set, because I got so much function out of it...using it for 200 yard drives...long fairway approaches....low recovery and intermediate running shots...using it 6-8x in 9-holes....all of this reduced the "fright" of calling it on a standard 6300+ course, with all 14.


cheers   vk

[Jeff Schley]

Here is a cool video of Ballesteros & Trevino vs. Aoki & Faldo (weird combination) in a One Club Challenge tourney.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nlh5E9SVxiE