GCA 1915 ?

[Neil Regan]

GCA 1915 ?

From a review in 1915  of Darwin and Rountree’s book:

Mention of Woking reminds us of a pleasant passage in Mr. Darwin's book. It seems that a Mr. Stuart Paton had persuaded the rulers of the club to place a small but formidable bunker at the range of a good tee-shot at the fourth hole in the very center of the fair-way. If we played to the left you had a pitching shot to play, if to the right a running up shot. As might be expected there was much discussion as to the merits of this bit of architecture, and the discussion, says Mr. Darwin, usually took this form:
A. "You can't persuade me that it is right to have a bunker bang on the line to the hole, exactly where a good drive should be."
B. "If there is a bunker there, then that cannot be the line to the hole. Your drive was not a very good one, but a very bad one."
A. "It was not a bad one. It was a perfect shot—hit in the very middle of the club."
B. "You should use your own head as well as the club head."

After this the conversation becomes unfit for publication.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

nregan,
Sounds an awful like two particpants I know of in this forum.

I would wonder if this was being done via an old typewriter or something!

[Andy Levett]

This is the hole, from the course profile on this site:



 I'd be interested to see an old picture of the hole as the 'safer' left-hand option, for a harder shot to the green, doesn't seem very attractive. Perhaps the trees and rough have encroached on the left side of the fairway?
I suppose modern players either blast away over the top of the bunker or lay up short and still have plenty of club to get home. Either way not as strategic as it was in Darwin's day.

(Disclaimer: I have never been to Woking so these observations are based solely on the picture).

Incidentally it was a real eye-opener to me when I read MacKenzie's view that there is no such thing as an unfair hazard. I had assumed that was quite a radical thought but clearly Darwin and Paton at least already thought the same way.

[T_MacWood]

There is Simpson drawing of the hole. At that time the right side was clear of trees, there is a railroad line that forms the right border of the hole (OB). And according to the drawing the distance between the bunkers and RR is much narrower than the left option. There were trees on the left, but I suspect they were much further to the left. The bunker to the left off the tee also isn't in the sketch.

[BCrosby]

nregan -

Do you have a cite to that review? I would love to see the whole piece.  Thanks.

Bob

[Neil Regan]

Bob,
 The review of the book, Golf Courses of the British Isles, is in Golf illustrated April 1915. The Ralph Miller Library at the AAFLA has some issues available for viewing on-line. (Thanks for showing me that, Tommy.)
Try this address to search the library:

http://www.aafla.org/search/search.htm

The author is R. Stanley Weir, the magazine's book reviewer. Search for him as author, or for Darwin in the text, and a list of articles will appear. The address of the article itself seems to change, but I think you'll find it. This might be it:

http://209.204.62.73/SportsLibrary/GolfIllustrated/1915/gi31t.pdf

Make sure you have lots of free time when you do this. You might get lost in the stacks reading all those old magazines.

Neil

[BCrosby]

Thanks.

[Robert Kimball]

I have just been perusing this great site, and here is a great article on Lido.  Great stuff.

http://209.204.62.73/SportsLibrary/GolfIllustrated/1915/gi34k.pdf

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Rob,
I'll also have you know, that it is just an inkling of what they have there. It is all the former Ralph Miller Library collection.

I'm sad that it isn't 10 minutes away from me anymore. Real sad. And it isn't neccessarily displyed the same way as it used to be. But a visit to the AFF of Los Angeles will put to rest any bad feelings of just how good of a place the collection now has as a home. It could have been much, much worse. The collection could have been split-up, and that would have been a travesty for golf.

[Ben Cowan-Dewar]

The picture is a little deceiving, mainly because of the shadows. There is a lot of room to the left of that bunker, even with the trees.

Secondly, the green is one of wilder ones at Woking, I cannot find my picture of it, but will keep looking.

The railway has since moved (apparently), but I think there is still OB.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

But Ben, How one this Mother Earth would a wide fairway be strategic? ? ? ? Surely you jest?

[Marty Bonnar]

The railway has since moved (apparently), but I think there is still OB.

Ben
The Railway was there last Summer. (Trust me, with my 'power fade' (ahem!) I was only too aware of it!).
Great golf hole to play tho and a really nice course generally. Just gotta love those heather-fronted bunkers!!!!

Martin.

[TEPaul]

That bunker, that exchange and articles dealing with both are very significant in the evolution of golf architecture and are dealt with well in an architectural way in the context of architectural evolution in Cornish & Whitten's book. The moral of it all is probably that the controversial can be and has been extremely significant in the history of golf architecture. The "Woking bunker" is one of the best examples of that in golf architectural history!