News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0


Following the lead of the posters from the fine, but mostly average  ;)  states of Michigan and Ohio, a group of Minnesota GCAers have compiled a list of their favorite 30 courses in The Great State of Minnesota. Or perhaps as our friends in the Super Bowl Marketing Department will be calling it in two months: "Bold North"  :P

As many posters here have learned in recent years, Minnesota is a terrific place for golf. Despite being the 2nd most northern state (to Alaska) and featuring a climate that limits our golf seasons sometimes to seven months, the state contains work from many of the greatest architects of all time. Donald Ross, William Watson, Jeffrey Brauer, AW Tillinghast, Seth Raynor, Willie Park, Jr. and Stanley Thompson have all built courses in the State.

While most of the courses on the list (and nearly 60% of the population) are located in the Twin Cities, we thought it would be fun to structure the list as more of a tour of the State. The plan will be to release the first 15 courses (#15 - #30) shortly, then for our top 15, we would feature short introductions from posters that have strong ties to a particular course(s) that might function as a guide to folks looking to visit with their golf clubs.

The criteria of the list is simple. These are our favorite courses to play in the State. We asked local posters to rank each course on a personal "Doak" scale of 1-10, and we picked the top 30.

We hope you enjoy the list and tour, and that everyone will come visit us soon in the land where all the women are strong, all the men are good-looking, and all the children are above average.  :)
« Last Edit: January 29, 2018, 04:09:34 PM by PCCraig »
H.P.S.

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15-#30
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2017, 03:01:43 PM »
#30 - Giants Ridge Resort (Legends Course), Biwabak


The tour begins an hour and a half minute drive north from Duluth in the town of Biwabik, Minnesota at the Legends Course at Giants Ridge. Giants Ridge was designed by GCA's own Jeff Brauer. The course sits at the base of the resorts ski hill next to Sabin Lake and is largely cut from the northern Minnesota woods.

#29 - Stillwater Country Club, Stillwater


Stillwater CC is the home club of Rick Shefchik and is widely known as a terrific club, as evidenced by the epic long waiting list to become a member. Founded in 1924 and designed by Tom Vardon (brother of Harry), who was an active golf course architect in the Twin Cities in the 1920's as well as head professional at White Bear YC. The course was recently renovated with new bunkers.

#28 - Wayzata Country Club, Wayzata


Situated in the swanky town of Wayzata just west of Minneapolis, Wayzata Country Club was originally designed by Robert Bruce Harris and renovated in 2008 by John Fought. Wayzata is also well known as the home club of Tim Herron.

#27 - Edina Country Club, Edina


Edina Country Club is similar to Wayzata CC in that it is also located in a "swanky" suburb of Minneapolis and is also home to a famous golfer, in this case former US Amateur Champion John Harris. Tom Lehman completed an extensive renovation of the golf course in 2011.

T#26 - Olympic Hills, Eden Prarie


Olympic Hills is a completely rebuilt golf course designed by Ron Prichard, who took a tired suburban layout and gave it a classic aesthetic and injected considerable strategic interest. The renovated greens are well known in town as having a ton of internal contour.

T#26 - Minnesota Valley - Bloomington


Founded as the Bloomington Country Club, Minnesota Valley is considered by most to be the lesser of the three Seth Raynor designs in Minnesota. The course is currently undergoing a renovation which is intended to bring back more of the Raynor look.

#24 - Keller Golf Course - Saint Paul


Keller Golf Course has an impressive tournament pedigree. It is a two-time host of the PGA Championship, Western Open, and for years was host to the PGA Tour's St. Paul Open as well as co-host of the 2014 Midwest Mashie. It was renovated in 2013 by our own Richard Mandell.

#23 - Troy Burne, Hudson, Wisconsin


Just across the river in Wisconsin is the public Troy Burne, designed by Tom Lehman. A modern design routed through a prairie on the front nine, with a back nine that features more hardwood and water.

#22 - Somerby Country Club, Rochester


Somerby is located outside Rochester, home of the world renowned Mayo Clinic. A Tom Lehman design which is located within a larger housing community.

T#21 - Deacon's Lodge, Brainerd


Deacon's Lodge is a fairly dramatic Arnold Palmer design located in the resort town of Brainerd. A benefit of the course is that it is not surrounded by any homes or hotels, although is sits on a very severe site that makes a cart essential.

T#21 - Stoneridge Golf Club - Woodbury


Stoneridge is a modern Bobby Weed design that many consider the best public golf course in the Twin Cities Metro.

#19 - North Oaks Golf Club, Saint Paul


North Oaks is a Stanley Thompson design that is routed through a high end community of North Oaks. It was renovated a number of years ago by Tom Lehman's design firm.

#18 - Midland Hills, Saint Paul


The home club of GCA's own Dan Kelly, this 1919 Seth Raynor design has benefited from a terrific superintendant whom as removed hundreds of trees in recent years. Word on the street is that a well regarded architect has been retained by the club to help further restore the course.

#17 - Rochester Golf & Country Club, Rochester


AW Tillinghast designed this course in Rochester because his daughter was a member while her husband was a Dr. at the nearby Mayo Clinic. The course has been overrun by evergreens thanks to a past member who planted thousands all over the course. Recently Tom Doak was hired to create a Master Plan.

#16 - Wilderness at Fortune Bay, Lake Vermillion


Back to northern Minnesota and the Iron Range to the Jeff Brauer designed Wilderness at Fortune Bay.
H.P.S.

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
I think 10 of us submitted votes on this list and the results varied fairly significantly from another poll we did 4-5 years ago.  There were three significant differences in methodology. First - we used Doak Scale whole number ratings rather than a simple ranking in a list.  Second, we ranked up to 40 courses rather than simply our top 10.  Finally, for the most part, rankings were submitted anonymously.  It appeared to me that anonymity caused some home courses to yield more variation in scores than were provided when we signed our name to them. 


Our Doak rankings were pretty consistent from person to person.  Most courses yielded a 1 point spread, some had a two point spread and only a few resulted in spreads of three or more. 


It seemed to me that the resulting list was pretty solid, and definitely an improvement over magazine lists I have seen. 

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
The courses ranked 16-30 are all very solid courses - reflecting the depth of courses in the state.  I have always been a much bigger fan of Stoneridge than many other people.  I believe that the course presents an interesting decision from the opening tee shot on a very short par 4 through the long approach to the 18th which offers a potential slingshot using slopes to reach a back left pin.  Almost every shot in between presents a spectrum of choices from the very aggressive to a very safe shot that might preclude reaching the green in regulation. For me 8 of the 18 holes are half shot holes with the half shot falling on the aggressive side on two par 4's (1 and 13) and three par 5s (2, 11 and 17) and on the par/bogie side on three long par 4's (5, 12 and 18).  However, even on holes that do not reflect half pars, there are a number of opportunities to take an aggressive line and reduce the resulting shot by a significant margin. 


If the course was 100 years old, I suspect it would garner even more respect than it does today. 
« Last Edit: December 22, 2017, 05:30:13 PM by Jason Topp »

Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
As a former Minnesota resident, I think you got off to a good start. I can pretty much predict the next fifteen, but am eager to see the order in which you place them. Lesser known courses like Stillwater and Wayzata aare fine designs and anyone would be pleased to play them regularly.
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

BHoover

  • Karma: +0/-0
As a former Minnesota resident myself, and one who contributed to the list, it made me reflect that Minnesota is a pretty great place with excellent golf. It also made me realize that I need to get back every now and then and play some of the courses I didn’t have a chance to play, particularly the ones up north. I’m also kicking myself that I never made the drive over from Maple Grove in the western Minneapolis suburbs to St. Paul to play Stoneridge.


Minnesota also is great in terms of year-round activities, despite the winter and mosquitoes in summer. With winter setting in, I’m going to miss ice fishing with my neighbors (both drinking beers on the ice and, occasionally, actually catching a fish). I’m trying to convince my wife that we should go back to visit friends in January or February so I can go out on the ice. She would rather go in June or July.

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
As a former Minnesota resident myself, and one who contributed to the list, it made me reflect that Minnesota is a pretty great place with excellent golf. It also made me realize that I need to get back every now and then and play some of the courses I didn’t have a chance to play, particularly the ones up north. I’m also kicking myself that I never made the drive over from Maple Grove in the western Minneapolis suburbs to St. Paul to play Stoneridge.


Minnesota also is great in terms of year-round activities, despite the winter and mosquitoes in summer. With winter setting in, I’m going to miss ice fishing with my neighbors (both drinking beers on the ice and, occasionally, actually catching a fish). I’m trying to convince my wife that we should go back to visit friends in January or February so I can go out on the ice. She would rather go in June or July.


Ice Fishing is very popular in Northwest Connecticut. I know plenty of guys that partake and love it. It's all about hanging out with your friends and the actual catching of fish seems incidental.

Jim Nugent

  • Karma: +0/-0
For those of you who have not experienced ice fishing: they build huts with floors out on the ice and put wood-burning stoves in them.  You can almost turn those babies into a sauna if you like, even if it's -40 outside. 

The ice might be 2 or more feet thick.  They use chain saws to cut it.  Spear fishing is illegal, but I've heard not everyone respects the law. 

On Mille Lacs Lake -- the miniature inland sea about 100 miles north of Mpls -- there were so many ice huts, it was like a small village.  Cars drove out there from the shore. 

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
For those of you who have not experienced ice fishing: they build huts with floors out on the ice and put wood-burning stoves in them.  You can almost turn those babies into a sauna if you like, even if it's -40 outside. 

The ice might be 2 or more feet thick.  They use chain saws to cut it.  Spear fishing is illegal, but I've heard not everyone respects the law. 

On Mille Lacs Lake -- the miniature inland sea about 100 miles north of Mpls -- there were so many ice huts, it was like a small village.  Cars drove out there from the shore.


Jim-Besides chainsaws there are all manner of augers to cut through the ice. It seems that brandy is one of the most important items necessary for successful ice fishing and believe it or not I have heard some of the participants feel their chances are even better if MaryJane is on hand as well. If I didn’t know better I would say it’s just an excuse to let loose a little in the doldrums of Winter. ;)

Laz Versalles

  • Karma: +0/-0
Brilliant. I played Olympic Hills and the redo has vastly improved the course. It's a blast. Going to be a lot of great golf course left off the list! Can't wait to see the next 15.

Jeff Shelman

  • Karma: +0/-0
We do have a good collection of courses/clubs here in Minnesota.

While there are a few courses on this list I'd like to see a bit higher or a bit lower, I think the overall product is pretty good. We certainly have the right courses listed.

We might not have as much high level golf as some other towns, there's no shortage of very good golf.

Jeff_Brauer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Assuming the old version of Superior National did not make the top 15, having 18 holes (river and canyon nines) re-open last September should definitely put this on the list somewhere, at least IMHO. 
Jeff Brauer, ASGCA Director of Outreach

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0


My personal opinions on #15-30:


- I was really surprised by how high a couple of courses were ranked, specifically Rochester (bonus points for being the "old" private in Rochester?) and North Oaks (other than a few holes such as the 7th, 9th and 10th, bores the heck out of me). I think both are fine courses overall, but I think there are courses below them that are more interesting and fun to play such as Keller or Olympic Hills.


- Rochester could be far, far better if Tom Doak is allowed to fully restore the course. I have heard conflicting reports on if the Master Plan Doak's firm put forth was accepted or not. The club received a massive settlement related to the Dupont herbicide that killed a bunch of evergreen trees on the property. That's a bit ironic as the club should be taking down hundreds of evergreens irregardless. But all I've seen out of the club has been pictures of a few random tree removals and the reconstruction of the club pool...so who knows where the club's priorities are.   


- I think the "new" Olympic Hills is very strong. I never played the "old" version but I thought Ron Prichard and his team created a very bold recreation of the course. There is plenty to like there now...wild greens, strategic bunkering, and a lot of width. It's a difficult golf course from the back tees, but it feels like the type of course that you would figure out how to play more efficiently after a number of plays.


- I will be interested to see how the course at Minnesota Valley turns out. According to one article I found online (http://archive.lib.msu.edu/tic/holen/article/1998feb11.pdf) Doak and Urbina had consulted at the club in the past regarding the Raynor design and some work was completed. When I played the course a few years back, I found it to be a bit of a jumbled mess...too many trees and holes that never seemed to live up to the Raynor school.  There clearly is a movement at the club to bring back a number of the Raynor features and play-ability. At first, when I saw the plans for the course (http://www.mvccgolf.com/documents/10180/443987/2017+Project+Plan+Document+Drawings+and+Narrative.pdf) I was not impressed with what their consulting architect, Bill Bergin, put forth and wondered why they didn't hire someone with more extensive experience renovating/restoring Raynor designs. However, some of the photos I have seen (just as the one shown above of #11) differ from the plans and look interesting.


- I agree with others about Stoneridge. It is a very strong design that I think Bobby Weed did a nice job on. It is my favorite modern public option in the area (Keller is my favorite classic), but I think it gets knocked a bit by most because they can't look past it's location next to I-94. Stoneridge is constantly rumored as a potential redevelopment site as it has traded owners recently.
H.P.S.

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Assuming the old version of Superior National did not make the top 15, having 18 holes (river and canyon nines) re-open last September should definitely put this on the list somewhere, at least IMHO.


Jeff


Look forward to seeing it sometime. 

Jeff Shelman

  • Karma: +0/-0


My personal opinions on #15-30:


- I was really surprised by how high a couple of courses were ranked, specifically Rochester (bonus points for being the "old" private in Rochester?) and North Oaks (other than a few holes such as the 7th, 9th and 10th, bores the heck out of me). I think both are fine courses overall, but I think there are courses below them that are more interesting and fun to play such as Keller or Olympic Hills.


- Rochester could be far, far better if Tom Doak is allowed to fully restore the course. I have heard conflicting reports on if the Master Plan Doak's firm put forth was accepted or not. The club received a massive settlement related to the Dupont herbicide that killed a bunch of evergreen trees on the property. That's a bit ironic as the club should be taking down hundreds of evergreens irregardless. But all I've seen out of the club has been pictures of a few random tree removals and the reconstruction of the club pool...so who knows where the club's priorities are.   


- I think the "new" Olympic Hills is very strong. I never played the "old" version but I thought Ron Prichard and his team created a very bold recreation of the course. There is plenty to like there now...wild greens, strategic bunkering, and a lot of width. It's a difficult golf course from the back tees, but it feels like the type of course that you would figure out how to play more efficiently after a number of plays.


- I will be interested to see how the course at Minnesota Valley turns out. According to one article I found online (http://archive.lib.msu.edu/tic/holen/article/1998feb11.pdf) Doak and Urbina had consulted at the club in the past regarding the Raynor design and some work was completed. When I played the course a few years back, I found it to be a bit of a jumbled mess...too many trees and holes that never seemed to live up to the Raynor school.  There clearly is a movement at the club to bring back a number of the Raynor features and play-ability. At first, when I saw the plans for the course (http://www.mvccgolf.com/documents/10180/443987/2017+Project+Plan+Document+Drawings+and+Narrative.pdf) I was not impressed with what their consulting architect, Bill Bergin, put forth and wondered why they didn't hire someone with more extensive experience renovating/restoring Raynor designs. However, some of the photos I have seen (just as the one shown above of #11) differ from the plans and look interesting.


- I agree with others about Stoneridge. It is a very strong design that I think Bobby Weed did a nice job on. It is my favorite modern public option in the area (Keller is my favorite classic), but I think it gets knocked a bit by most because they can't look past it's location next to I-94. Stoneridge is constantly rumored as a potential redevelopment site as it has traded owners recently.

Pat,

A couple of thoughts on your thoughts:

- I played Minnesota Valley late this past summer while some holes were under construction and I think some of the stuff looks cool. It's certainly going to be better than the current version. I don't know where the final version will settle in in my personal rankings in town, but it definitely is going to be a must play for me in '18.

- I don't totally know what to think about Olympic Hills. I would have really liked to have seen Ron and his team come up with a routing in which all of the holes on the north side of the road were on the same nine. Having to go over there on both nines is clunky at best. I'm also interested in seeing what happens with the native/fescue. The first time I played out there, I thought it was thin and kind of a 1/2 shot penalty. The second time it was much more dense and more difficult to even find golf balls hit there.

Bill Seitz

  • Karma: +0/-0
Seems weird that the only course I've played in the Minnesota top 30 is not in Minnesota.  I know Troy Burne is close the metro, but still seems weird to have it in the MN top 30.

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Seems weird that the only course I've played in the Minnesota top 30 is not in Minnesota.  I know Troy Burne is close the metro, but still seems weird to have it in the MN top 30.


Bill,


Much like when we are referring to golf courses, I prefer 'quirky' to 'weird'  :)
H.P.S.

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15 Now Posted
« Reply #17 on: December 27, 2017, 11:31:48 AM »
#15 - Spring Hill Golf Club, Wayzata

Number 15 on our list might be considered by some controversial. Golf Digest listed Spring Hill 69th on their most recent list of Top 100 Golf Courses in America and Golfweek ranks it #71 on their modern list.

Spring Hill was founded in 1999 by a number of golfers who only accepted members who were already members of another club in town. A golf club for the men of the family while their families are at their country club near by. When it opened, it was had a reputation of being extremely difficult, and soon after it opened Tom Fazio returned to soften the design. The course sits on an undulating, heavily wooded, property that is bisected by 6th Ave with a number of marshy areas near Long Lake.

A few photos of the course, from the internet credited to Peter Wong:

The 3rd:

The 5th:

The par-3 17th:

The par-5 16th:

The par-3 17th:

The 18th Green:
« Last Edit: December 27, 2017, 09:28:03 PM by PCCraig »
H.P.S.

Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15 Now Posted
« Reply #18 on: December 27, 2017, 11:44:58 AM »
Pat, you're right, it is controversial. I can think of only five MN courses I think are better than Spring Hill. I have played it only once but I thought it was one of Fazio's best designs. If I were to join a MSP course Spring Hill would be on my short list.
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15 Now Posted
« Reply #19 on: December 27, 2017, 11:52:56 AM »
Pat, you're right, it is controversial. I can think of only five MN courses I think are better than Spring Hill. I have played it only once but I thought it was one of Fazio's best designs. If I were to join a MSP course Spring Hill would be on my short list.


Tommy -


Can you elaborate as to why you consider it one of Fazio's best designs?
H.P.S.

Jeff Shelman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15 Now Posted
« Reply #20 on: December 27, 2017, 04:56:43 PM »
I have also only played Spring Hill once. I am also a little surprised to see it at No. 15.


I personally rated it higher than the group, but I do think that the holes on the north side of the road are squeezed a little bit - there is one more hole there than there is really room for. Because of that, it's a little awkward.




Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15 Now Posted
« Reply #21 on: December 27, 2017, 05:46:19 PM »
Pat, you're right, it is controversial. I can think of only five MN courses I think are better than Spring Hill. I have played it only once but I thought it was one of Fazio's best designs. If I were to join a MSP course Spring Hill would be on my short list.


Tommy -


Can you elaborate as to why you consider it one of Fazio's best designs?


Of the Fazio courses I've played I rank Shadow Creek, Estancia, Hudson National, Wade Hampton, and Diamond Creek among his best. When Fazio is on the top of his game he is as good as anyone. What I liked about SH was the way he used the terrain. He sited the greens in extremely interesting places. While it was wide off the tee (I hit all but one fairway) it made a difference where you hit the tee ball to have a good angle to the pin. On many Fazio courses it doesn't make much difference where the tee ball ends up because the greens don't demand a well paced tee ball. I really loved the bunkering around the greens. It had a good mix of short fours and long fours. The par fives varied in length and terrain. To be honest, I don't remember the par threes very well. The only hole I felt awkward on was 18. For me, the only courses I think are better are White Bear Y&GC, Interlachen, and maybe Northland.


I just loved the atmospher of the club. It reminded me of my club, Four Streams, back in DC.
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Buck Wolter

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15 Now Posted
« Reply #22 on: December 27, 2017, 05:50:45 PM »
Bill Schulz 'review' that caused some back and forth with Pat on another thread. The out-of-towners rate it higher than the locals. I'm sure it happens but I can't think of another obvious example.


Spring Hill*-One of Fazio's top 3 works with a relatively tight walkable routing & no cart paths or homes & deserving of its US Top 100 status.  Despite the high slope ratings of 140+ from the blue tee's the course is comfortably wide off the tee with precision required on 2nd shots.  Immaculate conditioning & only 60+ bunkers, the design fits the Minnesota landscape without excessive earth movement. 
*I've now played the Golf Digest United States Top 100 lists for 1995 thru 2017.

Those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience -- CS Lewis

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15 Now Posted
« Reply #23 on: December 27, 2017, 08:20:59 PM »
I think 15th is about correct.  Beautiful property and the course is in pristine condition.  I just do not think the land is good enough to yield great golf.  Not enough land on the North side of the highway and the land on the South is severe enough to require awkward routing choices.   As a result the course yields 4-5 excellent holes and a number of compromises. 

David Wuthrich

Re: The Top 30 Courses in the Great State of Minnesota - #15 Now Posted
« Reply #24 on: December 28, 2017, 10:14:20 AM »

I agree with Bill S.


It is one of the best in the state. 


15 is way too low.

Tags:
Tags:

An Error Has Occurred!

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()
Back