[Tommy Williamsen]

<div>The real quote from Ken Moum is: "Most Americans think of golf as a test of skill and most Scotts see it as a test of character." It just didn't fit on the subject line. This thought merits its own thread.</div><div><br></div><div>I guess I have always thought of golf both ways. I remember when my son hit it into the woods one day. I told him, "this is an opportunity to be exceptional." It was not only a chance to show his skill but an opportunity to test his mettle. What say you? Do you fall on one side of the equation?</div>

[Niall C]

Tommy
 
When it comes to sports it occurs to me that Americans are more stat driven than Brits (I don’t see any difference between Scots and the rest of the UK in this). I suspect being more stat driven leads to set standards and the pursuit of fairness, whereas in the UK I suspect we are more inclined to accept what is in front of us and just play it as it lies.
 
Niall

[Kalen Braley]

Niall,


We certainly wouldn't want to expand this to all Europeans because Sergio and Jon Rahm would certainly fail this litmus test... 

[Niall C]

Kalen


As we know professionals are a breed apart...........which is not an argument for bifurcation BTW


Niall

[Rich Goodale]

In my 35+ years of golfing in both countries, the primary difference between the two is that we Americans play every round as if it is life or death, whilst the Scots (and all other parts of GB&I) distinctly separate competitive golf from non-competitive golf (aka "bounce games").


The vast majority of American golfers have never played proper competitive golf (i.e. strictly by the USGA/R&A Rules).  All reasonably serious golfers in GB&I play at least 3 proper competitive golf games every year, as it is a requirement for the establishment/maintenance of a proper handicap.


As Bobby Jones famously said "There is golf and then there is competitive golf."  Most Scots understand this, even if they have never heard what Bob was saying above.  Few Americans understand what Jones was saying, even if they know the quotation.


Rich

[Kalen Braley]

Niall,


Audible yuks!!




In thinking more about the subject line, perhaps its just me, or perhaps I'm just a typical Yank, but I can scarcely think of a time on the course when I viewed golfing as a test of my character...other than a few times where I called a penalty on myself for something I did that no one else saw.


So maybe its just me, but its just golf man!! 

[Mark_Fine]

Anyone who has played true links golf knows it is a test of character as much or more than a test of skill! 

[Rick Lane]

Might depend on whether "character" means ethics or fortitude?   Golf can for sure be a test of ethics, its part of its beauty.   A test of fortitude is for sure what they do in GB&I handicap rounds and as we Yanks do every time we play a serious medal tournament.   The quote is right, Golf (bounce golf, I guess) and Tournament golf are totally different.   In "bounce" rounds, I am very likely to try crazy escape shots, a driver off the deck, or some fun cut or hook out of trouble, scooting along with my buddies having a laugh for a $3 Nassau.   In Tournament medal play, the nervous system is fully engaged, the mind is racing and the palms are sweating.....just on the first tee!   

[Matthew Essig]

When you have a 30 mph head wind and driving rain, or an approach that hits a mound and goes 20 yards from where it "should have gone," in comparison to hitting a 6 iron over water to a green that is stimping at a couple feet more than it should, yes, links golf is more about character than skill. That is why I love it so much.

[David_Tepper]

"Anyone who has played true links golf knows it is a test of character as much or more than a test of skill!"

"yes, links golf is more about character than skill"

While I would tend to agree with the above statements (aside from the fact that you have to be very skilled to play links golf well). it is important to remember that the vast majority of golf played in Scotland and elsewhere in GB&I is not links golf.

[Ken Moum]

Tommy to be completely accurate, I think I should have said that really good American golfers think that.


I'm not so sure average golfers here feel that way.


I am almost certain that the majority of good players aren't fans of quirky golf.


FWIW, by test of character, I meant that golf, on linksland or otherwise, presents you with multiple opportunities to show your resilience in the face of adversity.


Embracing that is IMHO how you get the most out of your game.


Like Jack has said, when he heard players grousing about US Open setups and courses, he just that was one more player he didn't have to beat.


K

[Steve Lang]

In my 35+ years of golfing in both countries, the primary difference between the two is that we Americans play every round as if it is life or death, whilst the Scots (and all other parts of GB&I) distinctly separate competitive golf from non-competitive golf (aka "bounce games").


The vast majority of American golfers have never played proper competitive golf (i.e. strictly by the USGA/R&A Rules).  All reasonably serious golfers in GB&I play at least 3 proper competitive golf games every year, as it is a requirement for the establishment/maintenance of a proper handicap.


As Bobby Jones famously said "There is golf and then there is competitive golf."  Most Scots understand this, even if they have never heard what Bob was saying above.  Few Americans understand what Jones was saying, even if they know the quotation.


Rich

What Rich said...


re-phrased..
It would definitely be better in USA if handicaps were derived from tourney play and then used for common play... much better

[A.G._Crockett]

Sweeping generalizations, while convenient and easy, are rarely accurate or helpful.  This thread is a textbook case of all of that.

[astavrides]

Sweeping generalizations, while convenient and easy, are rarely accurate or helpful.  This thread is a textbook case of all of that.

Yours being one of the rare ones, presumably.

[Tommy Williamsen]

When i watch the leaders come down the stretch at a golf tournament character, tenacity, and confidence play an important part in the player's arsenal of weapons. They all have the skill to perform. Seventeen at Sawgrass is a good example. When Fowler won he went at the flag three times. It was a test of his skill to be sure, but it was also a test of his character. I think what I like about the game is it's character building nature. You can tell an awful lot about a person on the golf course. I know it helped me grow up and learn a bit how to deal with adversity.

[A.G._Crockett]

Sweeping generalizations, while convenient and easy, are rarely accurate or helpful.  This thread is a textbook case of all of that.

Yours being one of the rare ones, presumably.

A quick story for your consideration, Astravides.  (And I take your point about the irony of my post.)

A number of years ago, I was a high school golf coach.  Most of my players were members at a club nearby, which let us practice and play there.  The club had entered into a yearly Ryder Cup style competition with a well-known club in Scotland (which I shall decline to name here); the first year it was played in Scotland, and the second year it was to be played in Georgia.

The pro at our local club "asked" me to get my players to serve as forecaddies for the Scottish players for the two days, and I of course agreed; I gave my players no choice in the matter.  So Sunday afternoon, I decided to ride over to the club to watch a bit, and to thank my players for cooperating.

When I walked out on the course to where the first group was playing, to my surprise I saw my player riding on the back of a golf cart and the two Scotsmen riding in the cart.  Same thing with the second group, and then the third.  Finally, I asked one of my kids what was going on, and he said that NOT ONE of the Scottish golfers had walked either day.  (FWIW, the Americans were approximately equally split between riders and walkers, and the course is one that is easily walked.)

Of course, on GCA, the purity and sanctity of walking in the UK is gospel, and the demand by US golfers to ride is almost the same in reverse.  Those threads always make me laugh, and so does one in which generalizations are made about how Americans view golf versus how Scots view golf.

I suspect that Scottish golfers come in all varieties, just as do American golfers.  I have seen American golfers exhibit remarkable character on the golf course, and I've seen American golfers exhibit a complete lack of character as well.  And I suspect that there are Scots who view golf as a test of their skill, rather than their character; I have one Scottish professional in mind as I write that, btw.

I admit freely that generalizations become such by virtue of grains of truth, tendencies, trends, and the like, and perhaps this is one of those instances.  But I rather doubt it.

[Marty Bonnar]

Were the Carts F.O.C?

“There are few more impressive sights than a Scotsman on the make”
J.M.Barrie

 
F.

[Ian Mackenzie]

A test?
Don't think so on either count.


It's a game. 99.99% of us do it for recreation - a get away from life's travails and daily grind.
Sure, you can get all metaphysical about as you can with just about everything. Yes, I can quote Michael Murphy here, but my point is to NOT overthink golf.


Culturally, it's a different sport on different continents in the same way that eating dinner in Spain is culturally different than slamming dinner in the US.


The vast majority of people lack the cognizance to recognize why they play and what they seek from the game.
Some play for score, some play for companionship, some play for ego, some play for "exercise" and some play just to hit a ball.


Deep down, for me, it's about control. There are many, many things in my life that I cannot control and must adapt to conditions that dictate decorum and appropriate reactions.


However, when I'm on the golf course, and I am facing any shot, it's a single - sometimes trivial - event that I get to envision, imagine, execute, observe, analyze and repeat to give me a fleeting sense that there is, in fact, a small amount of order (and control) in my life.


When that tuning fork strikes that perfect chord, it resonates from my toes to my ears.


Skill and character? If that's why you play then I hope it gives you satisfaction.


Cheers.

[Mike Hendren]

A test of character?  Really?  Golf?

In the past year I have read works by C. S. Lewis, Dietrich Bonhoeffer, N. T. Wright, Richard Rohr, Thomas a Kempis, Henri Nouwen, Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., Oswald Chambers and A. W. Tozer.  Not to mention a 36 weeks Bible study.   No mention of golf I’m afraid.  And I’m still a heathen, by the way.

Stepping into the voting booth last November in the U. S. – now that was a test of character. 

Mike

[Thomas Dai]

Strength of character, mental fortitude, resilience to pressure -


A story I've highlighted herein before - The great Australian cricketer Keith 'Nugget' Miller had been a night-fighter pilot during WWII. When asked later on during his cricketing career how he dealt with the pressure of coming in to bat for his country when they had already lost a considerable number of keys wickets he replied "That's not pressure mate. Pressure's when you got a Messerschmitt up your arse!"


atb

[A.G._Crockett]

Were the Carts F.O.C?

“There are few more impressive sights than a Scotsman on the make”
J.M.Barrie

 
F.

What does "F.O.C." stand for?  I'm stumped.

[Marty Bonnar]

Free Of Charge!


F.

[A.G._Crockett]

Free Of Charge!


F.

I would assume so, though I never thought about it at the time.

Of course, I wouldn't want to make a generalization about Scotsmen and being tight with money...

[George Pazin]

Stepping into the voting booth last November in the U. S. – now that was a test of character. 

I thought it was a test of what your vomit level was.


Excellent post, Ian Mackenzie. And AG and alex as well.

[Steve Wilson]

A terser and slightly profane version of A. G.'s comment on generalizations came from Oliver Wendell Holmes.  "No generalization is worth a damn--including that one."

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