Wolf Point is up for sale!

[Chris Pearson]

http://www.landsofamerica.com/property/475-acres-in-Jackson-County-Texas/4287943


Texans: Let's get a group together and buy this thing!

[Ryan Hillenbrand]

Why just Texans? Heck, set this thing up with a national membership

[Ulrich Mayring]

$7.7 million is a pretty good price, I think. But the main issue are the operating costs. Is there any information how high they were?

Ulrich

[Peter Pallotta]

I've never read a golf-course-for-sale ad that focuses so much on the architecture/quality of the course, including the striking quotes from Adam and Tom and the emphasis on sustainability and ease of maintenance. In other hands (and almost invariably), the 500 acres/private retreat a couple of hours from Austin, Houston and San Antonio would've featured more prominently, with the design itself relegated to some cliche about a 7000 yard championship test. It's good to see the original vision/dream still being honoured.
Peter         

[John Kavanaugh]

As they say on Shark Tank...I'm out.

[Chris Pearson]

But the main issue are the operating costs. Is there any information how high they were?

From the GCA Wolf Point article:

With a crew that ranges from 3 to 5 people and an average annual spend of under $500,000 for the golf course...

Maintenance and taxes on the entire property (not just the course) are probably around $750k-$850k per year.

I think it makes sense to offer international memberships and also to explore some killer stay-n-play opportunities with other small structures elsewhere on the property (pimped out Airstream, anyone?).

And we can't let this go unnoticed:

Where else can ya get an awesome course that isn't marred by cart paths?!?

[John Kavanaugh]

Wouldn't it make more sense to put a full page ad in Golf Digest saying that you have 7.7 million and would like to buy a course. You could play for free at prospects for life...or longer, whichever came first.

[Steve Lang]

  


Quite a cost per acre...  Wasn't this whole thing with infrastructure built for 3-4 mil or something? 


Needs ~100 founders at like $80000 to $100000 stake to get it transitioned... where's Mike Keiser when we need him?
[/size]Lots... any deed restrictions?[size=78%]


Will a gca group need to go check it out?

[Keith Phillips]

Didn't 36-hole Dismal River sell for considerably less?

[Blake Conant]

Didn't 36-hole Dismal River sell for considerably less?

apples and oranges

[Clyde Johnson]

apples and oranges

Prefer bananas myself!


Good luck to Don

[BCowan]

As they say on Shark Tank...I'm out.

All roads lead back to Mr Wonderful.  Who is GCA Mr Wonderful?

[JESII]

Didn't 36-hole Dismal River sell for considerably less?

apples and oranges

Blake,


I'm neither doubting or challenging your statement, just curious why the two are not comparable?

[Blake Conant]

infrastructure, access, overhead, location, proximity to major airport, debt, taxes, climate.  I'm not an expert in real estate valuation, but I see some pretty glaring differences besides one having 36 holes and the other having 18. 


Hopefully people much smarter than me can chime in.

[David Wuthrich]

Dismal open 4 to 5 months a year and in the middle of nowhere.


Wolf Point is 2 hours max from Houston, Austin and San Antonio (2 of the top 10 populated cites in the USA) and open 12 months a year.  Could also have hunting and fishing at Wolf.

[Peter Pallotta]

I know even less about real estate valuations, but I think golden age/silent screen movie star Douglas Fairbanks had it right, when asked if he was worth the enormous sums of money he was making:
"Before God I'm worth a dollar and a half; before Hollywood I'm worth whatever my agent can get me".
That's why the ad's focus on the quality of the course is so striking; they are saying, in short, that the golf is worth the money. I just wish they could've gotten architect Mike Nuzzo's name in there with the reference to it being a top 100 course.
   

[JLahrman]

Dismal open 4 to 5 months a year and in the middle of nowhere.


Wolf Point is 2 hours max from Houston, Austin and San Antonio (2 of the top 10 populated cites in the USA) and open 12 months a year.  Could also have hunting and fishing at Wolf.

I'm in Austin, and it's closer to 3 hours than 2 to Port Lavaca (or anyplace else along the coast), but it's certainly a reasonable distance to any of those three cities.


Ad also says that 200 people have played the course...I feel like all 200 of them are on this website!


Hopefully this does all work out though; it would be great to keep this completely unique piece of the golf world intact.

[mike_beene]

It's a pretty easy reach from Hobby airport with the beltway. Hard to believe it is a 12 month open. July and August are not golf months down here

[Ulrich Mayring]

If you can stay under $1 million in operating costs, then you could run it with local membership. Not sure how populated the area is within a driving distance of, say, 30-45 minutes. Victoria Country Club, which is about an hour away, has $2000 Initiation Fee,  $384/month & $40 Food and Beverage. With that sort of price range you'd need about 250 local members.

Ulrich

[David Davis]

I'd say the biggest question is whether or not that includes Don's eternal commitment to stay on and take care of the place. Let's not fool ourselves, he's a magician and replacing him could be just like shutting the place down.


Just saying...

[Ronald Montesano]

Dunes Club South

[John Kavanaugh]

The course was built for a one owner situation and should remain that way. Not so long ago my son was studying petroleum engineering at a Houston feeder school known as LSU. The price of oil had an oopsie that should recover in another decade or so. If you want to have a bit of fun discussing valuation go through the chart I linked. When the course was grassed in July of 2007 WTI was in the $70's.... a year later $140's. Now it is mid $40. Got to make a change in attitude.


https://www.up.com/cs/groups/public/@uprr/@customers/documents/up_pdf_nativedocs/pdf_up_cust_wti-archiv_2002-14.pdf

[Mike Sweeney]

Interesting historical perspective here of the Guggenheim 9 holer:


http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,29041.0.html

[Ben Sims]

No doubt I'm a homer, but I think there's a market for Wolf Point. Kessler Canyon is a hunting ranch on the western slope of Colorado that serves as the model. Granted, Marriott released their stake in Kessler and the owner now has it up for sale. But golf is a whole different animal than big game hunting. Additionally, Kessler doesn't have three major metro areas within three hours (Dallas is 4.5hrs away too), or an on-site runway that the current owner would probably allow for use.


I think a wealthy indidvual that would use Wolf as a private estate for themself, and when not on property, a getaway for the not-quite-as-wealthy is a potential way forward.

[Adam Lawrence]

I hope you're right Ben. My big concern is that Port Lavaca seems an unlikely place for someone in the market for a $7.7m holiday home to call a base. But it only needs one person...