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Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Hagen Hoof
« on: November 21, 2023, 02:38:54 PM »
Rather lovely No Laying Up video about the Hagen Hoof, the annual match between Prince's, Royal St George's and Royal Cinque Ports that sees participants play all three courses in a day.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRzxumDxQ_k
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

David Wuthrich

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2023, 03:57:45 PM »
How much fun would that be!!!

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2023, 08:22:27 PM »
Adam:


That's cool, thanks for sharing.


One of my favorite things about Traverse City is that Walter Hagen retired here, at a summer home out on Long Lake west of town.  There is an autographed photo of him in every bar in town that's old enough to have served him!


He also held the official course record at Crystal Downs for many years, according to Fred Muller.  I think the official record was 70 -- even par!

Joe_Tucholski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2023, 08:54:51 PM »
Deal by far had the biggest home course advantage (and the best team, not losing during a round).  Is that expected by folks who know all three?


Score on Princes  -  RSG-179, Princes 194, Deal 194


Score on Deal  -  RSG 155, Princes 144, Deal 172


Score on St. Georges -  RSG 135, Princes 137, Deal 138


Total  -  RSG 469, Princes 475, Deal 504

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2023, 07:18:06 AM »
Good to see GCA highlighting Deal once agian.  If it ever had any influence then Deal and North Berwick have always had their fans here.


Joe, Deal had a Ringer! The RCP Member doing the most talking to camera is Andrew Reynolds who has just retired after 45 years as Professional. Many visitors will have been greeted by him.


 Here he's playing an informal match for the Club and next year he will be Club Captain.  He's now playing in Club Competitions as a plus golfer.


Its only taken 100 years for Golf Professionals to be recognised as humans.  Point two below.
Legend has it he had the car parked by the flagpole right outside the front door!
I'm sure the story has been 'polished' over the years but print the legend.


https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/10/old-tom-to-spieths-renewal-18-golden-and-grim-moments-from-150-years-of-open-drama

Result?  I think its down to the players on the, very difficult, day.

And for those yet to visit, you can't just hop ovver the fence at the end of Deal to RSG, theres a walk of a few hundred yards.  (But the distance from RSG's 13th grren to the old Clubhouse at Princes is short). Once again the legend is better than the facts.




Liked the film and the way the creators told the story without wanting to become part of it.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2023, 08:23:51 AM by Tony_Muldoon »
Let's make GCA grate again!

Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #5 on: November 22, 2023, 07:52:22 AM »
About the only thing that disappointed me about the film was that they didn't jump the fences between courses, but clearly went by car/minibus (I assume that with lunch at Deal and dinner at Sandwich not many would be driving themselves -- I would still like to do the ranking of the Booziest Golf Clubs in the World that I have been talking about for many years, and I'm pretty certain that RCP would score highly, I have less experience of RSG).
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2023, 08:51:10 AM »
About the only thing that disappointed me about the film was that they didn't jump the fences between courses, but clearly went by car/minibus (I assume that with lunch at Deal and dinner at Sandwich not many would be driving themselves -- I would still like to do the ranking of the Booziest Golf Clubs in the World that I have been talking about for many years, and I'm pretty certain that RCP would score highly, I have less experience of RSG).


Can folks walk down the beach from Deal to Sandwich and access (I spose the 5th tee?) just by hopping a fence?


Ciao



New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2023, 09:42:11 AM »
About the only thing that disappointed me about the film was that they didn't jump the fences between courses, but clearly went by car/minibus (I assume that with lunch at Deal and dinner at Sandwich not many would be driving themselves -- I would still like to do the ranking of the Booziest Golf Clubs in the World that I have been talking about for many years, and I'm pretty certain that RCP would score highly, I have less experience of RSG).

Can folks walk down the beach from Deal to Sandwich and access (I spose the 5th tee?) just by hopping a fence?

Ciao

So far as I can tell, you could walk up the foreshore -- there is a pathway along the seafront, it's part of the Saxon Shore Way long distance path, and if I remember correctly, it runs along the seawall dune. By the sailing and waterski club, it becomes a proper road, Prince's Drive, and there is a low post and rail fence along the left of Prince's Drive once you pass the end of King's Avenue and the RSG course starts. Alternatively you could walk up the Sandwich Bay Estate road and into RSG up the entrance drive, but obviously that is longer.

So far as I can tell, the most efficient way to do it as a single walk, starting at Deal, would be to play RCP 1-10, walk up the coast, hop over the fence and start George's from the sixth, the Maiden, and go as far as the thirteenth. Then you'd jump the fence to Prince's and start on the seventh of the Shore. Obviously you'd play Prince's, presumably the Shore and Dunes (but I suppose you could do the Hims instead of the Dunes if you wanted, or even in addition if you were a true masochist), finishing on Shore sixth. Perhaps break for lunch after Shore ninth, at which point you'd have played twenty-one holes? After finishing at Prince's you'd jump the fence again, play the Canal hole and round to the fifth at RSG. Then back onto the road and down to Deal, finishing the day by playing in from the eleventh.

The run home at RCP would be one hell of a way to finish a day like that!
« Last Edit: November 22, 2023, 11:13:39 AM by Adam Lawrence »
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2023, 10:43:39 AM »
Simply splendid. What a day.
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

James Reader

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2023, 12:01:24 PM »
About the only thing that disappointed me about the film was that they didn't jump the fences between courses, but clearly went by car/minibus (I assume that with lunch at Deal and dinner at Sandwich not many would be driving themselves -- I would still like to do the ranking of the Booziest Golf Clubs in the World that I have been talking about for many years, and I'm pretty certain that RCP would score highly, I have less experience of RSG).


Can folks walk down the beach from Deal to Sandwich and access (I spose the 5th tee?) just by hopping a fence?


Ciao


You don’t even have to hop a fence. There’s a public footpath along the sea wall by Deal which goes right past the 11th tee and another which cuts across from the Princes road to the 6th tee at RSG.

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #10 on: November 22, 2023, 01:39:10 PM »
When the Hoof started it was played the Hagen way starting at Deal and playing as described by Adam. The issue was foursomes matches joining Princes mid way through the round and amongst fourballs. It was decided to start at Princes and the matches are off the course by 8.30’ish so there’s no delays or disruption to other groups.


Princes always field a strong team and have won several editions. Rob McGuirk at Princes and Andrew Reynolds both played off scratch but now Rob has his amateur status back and Reyn has a club handicap they are both + players.



As for drinking John Steinbreder came over a few years ago with the Outpost Club and his assessment was “he couldn’t decide if Royal Cinque Ports was a drinking club for golfers or a golfing club for drinkers” after some thought he decided it was great fun and it didn’t matter.


Reynolds was once introduced at a dinner at an American golf club as the professional from Royal Drunk Ports.



Cave Nil Vino

Michael Felton

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2023, 03:17:30 PM »
When the Hoof started it was played the Hagen way starting at Deal and playing as described by Adam. The issue was foursomes matches joining Princes mid way through the round and amongst fourballs. It was decided to start at Princes and the matches are off the course by 8.30’ish so there’s no delays or disruption to other groups.


Princes always field a strong team and have won several editions. Rob McGuirk at Princes and Andrew Reynolds both played off scratch but now Rob has his amateur status back and Reyn has a club handicap they are both + players.



As for drinking John Steinbreder came over a few years ago with the Outpost Club and his assessment was “he couldn’t decide if Royal Cinque Ports was a drinking club for golfers or a golfing club for drinkers” after some thought he decided it was great fun and it didn’t matter.


Reynolds was once introduced at a dinner at an American golf club as the professional from Royal Drunk Ports.


At the Halford Hewitt one time I watched someone drive it at the 1st, land on the carpark entrance, one bounce onto the balcony, hit the wall above the door, bounced down onto the balcony again and then down onto the road again and back into play. There must have been 60 people standing on the balcony. Not a single one of them registered this golf ball pinging around their ears. They had been keeping the bar staff busy for some time at that point...

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2023, 03:38:15 PM »
I once lost the first in the under/over 40 match when course manager James Bledge sliced his opening tee shot into the windscreen of Cara Banks (golf channel presenter). After smashing the windscreen the ball bounced back into play and they parred the hole.


My favourite wayward opening tee shot story involves the Secretary of the Hewitt who had a rather severe and frankly ugly hook in his armoury. He went for a lesson with Reynolds and the following morning the pro was giving a lesson on the putting green some 40 yards right of the fairway when a ball landed on the green. A few minutes later NDO appeared, picked his ball up and as he walked off said to the pro “the hooks gone Reyn”.
Cave Nil Vino

Richard Fisher

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2023, 04:48:27 AM »
Pleased to see my old friend and magician extraordinaire Paul Craven presenting the trophy! Andrew Reynolds at RCP must have one of the best memories for names and faces of any club professional  ever - and fab that he is becoming Captain upon his retirement.

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hagen Hoof
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2023, 07:49:21 PM »
Richard the Hoof trophy was donated by Richard Craven, Paul’s legend of an uncle.



Cave Nil Vino

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