[jeffwarne]

Na does make one interesting comment... I, too, would like to see an event (US Open?) where a committee of past winners set up the course. It would be interesting to see what they would do and how they would justify their setup. They miight be harder on themselves than we might think!

Hogan,Furyk and Hale Irwin might have a bit of impact on that setup

[jeffwarne]

wonder how good he is from the OB at Harbour Town or the railroad tied water at TPC

The difference is, it doesn't take 5 minutes every time to figure out what happened.

no just five minutes for him to stop twitching


I would hate to see this setup error take away from what I think is a fine course for the modern professional (if we're not going to control technology)

[Ally Mcintosh]

I just saw this. That rough looks daft. It's an insult to call it fescue.

[David_Tepper]

Worth reading:

http://www.geoffshackelford.com/homepage/2017/6/12/kevin-nas-rant-the-lush-native-swath-of-erin-hills-rough.html

[BHoover]

I was more troubled by Kevin Na's choice of shirt design than the rough at Erin Hills.

[Jeff Shelman]

I do think that grass seems a bit excessive.


But if you don't want to deal with it, don't hit it there.

[Dan Gallaway]

I remember a few years ago, some pro won The Open and only hit driver once.  He knew he had to hit his targets and take the blow-ups out of play...

[Kalen Braley]

The pros whine, moan, complain, and throw tantrums every US open.


Nothing to see....move along!!

[cary lichtenstein]

I played Baltustrol the Monday after the US Open years ago. I hit my tee shot on 1 about 6" off the fairway. like an idiot, I tried to hit a 4 iron, learned a lesson I will never forget...sandwedge goes 40 years further than a 4 iron

[John Connolly]

When I played there with my cousins last year, whenever someone in the fescue was deciding on club selection, the other guys would yell out "vaseline" to remind him of what a pain in the ass it could be with a foolish attempt at heroics. Sideways was the only play.

[Jon Cavalier]

The pros whine, moan, complain, and throw tantrums every US open.


Nothing to see....move along!!

This was my first reaction too. But then I found myself struck by the nature and tone of his complaint. And even more than that, the fact that he would share this kind of thing publically -- what's the benefit there? Is he teeing up an excuse? Certainly, we'd never hear Tiger Woods say anything of this sort, lest he show weakness, but I can't see anyone who realistically believes they can compete in this tournament lodging such a plaintive and public critique of the course.


As for the architectural merits of that rough - others have said it better than I can.

[Don Mahaffey]

Actually, Geoff S posted the problem is irrigation overspray makes the first five feet of native/fescue overly thick.  A common problem when you don't want to spring for part circle heads around your perimeters.

Interesting comment from an industry expert.
My experience is, whenever I visit a course trimmed out with PC heads that are also used as some kind of marker for the mowing line, you have the problem like that at EH.
But when I see courses with no PC and a Supt with grey matter between his ears (most) that just mows the heavy shit down, no problem. But we are smart aren't we?

[Kalen Braley]

Jon,


The Jack Nicklaus quote comes to mind, (assuming he actually said it), which went something along the lines of, majors were easier to win because your competitors are wilting/falling off all around you at every move.


Perhaps this is Na wilting before its begun...wouldn't be the first time a golfer was mentally done before jamming a peg in the ground.. 

[Frank M]

Why is everyone getting on him for complaining? "Let me show you what we are dealing with this week" and "Why can't we have past US Open winners get together and set up a major one day" are not complaining, they are points being made.

[Jon Cavalier]

Why is everyone getting on him for "complaining"?

"Let me show you what we are dealing with this week" and "Why can't we have past US Open winners get together and set up a major one day" are not complaining, they are points being made.

But of course, in today's social media age, which some here have bemoaned, you aren't allowed to make a point, have an opinion or say anything without getting hammered, made fun of or insulted for it.

That's really the worst part of this all.

Frank. I agree with your sentiment, but disagree that it applies to Na. Shackelford provided an objective illustration and critique of the issue. Na comes across as almost angry in that video. At a minimum, he's upset about it. I find that to be a strange attitude from someone getting ready to compete this week.

[Jaeger Kovich]

"Why can't we have past US Open winners get together and set up a major one day"

Lets think about that for a moment... Do we really think DJ can handle that? 

[jeffwarne]

I was more troubled by Kevin Na's choice of shirt design than the rough at Erin Hills.

The best part is the grass wig he's wearing at the start of the video...

[jeffwarne]

"Why can't we have past US Open winners get together and set up a major one day"

Lets think about that for a moment... Do we really think DJ can handle that? 

Guessing there wouldn't be any local rules sheets handed out....

[Peter Pallotta]

We all sometimes make a miscalculation. We haven't done anything wrong or unethical, and certainly nothing to merit being hammered in the press. We just didn't anticipate the full range of potential consequences. Kevin's only miscalculation, it seem to me, was in terms of the optics. He may have assumed that all tour pros would be treated equally; but that's simply not the case. If the video had been made by a media darling like Jordan Speith or Rory or Rickie or Phil, the reaction to it would've been very different. 

[Jon Cavalier]

We all sometimes make a miscalculation. We haven't done anything wrong or unethical, and certainly nothing to merit being hammered in the press. We just didn't anticipate the full range of potential consequences. Kevin's only miscalculation, it seem to me, was in terms of the optics. He may have assumed that all tour pros would be treated equally; but that's simply not the case. If the video had been made by a media darling like Jordan Speith or Rory or Rickie or Phil, the reaction to it would've been very different.

That gets precisely to my point: Jordan Speith or Rory or Rickey or Phil would never have made the video to begin with.

[Peter Pallotta]

And that gets to my point too, Jon, ie at worst Kevin has let the pressure/challenge get to him and talked himself out of the tournament. If so, the reasonable and fair minded reaction - if any - is probably pity and/or sympathy, and maybe even a thoughtful interesting essay on how US Open set ups get into the heads of the best golfers in the world. At any rate, I feel sorry for KN - I'm sure this is not the 'story' he wanted to write.

[John Connolly]

I find that to be a strange attitude from someone getting ready to compete this week.




It's not strange - it's just more available for consumption. The only difference between Kevin Na and Nicklaus' competitors is that he has an Instagram account and they didn't.

[Jaeger Kovich]

I'm a little surprised nobody has mentioned nutrient starving yet to go along with less hard-lining and part circles... Dr. Hudrzan did have some pretty interesting things to say on golf channel tonight about the crappy glacial till soils, and some hints of the construction process. Never heard anyone talk about a tiller, seedbed prep, nor methods to preserve natural micro contours on the tv, pretty cool! Good on him there!


Also.. to be fair, based on reports of "lushness" I would assume that the course has been using different than normal maintenance practices trying to get the place ready for their big week. I'm not certain, but I would guess higher than normal rates of many inputs have been up for a while. Especially so far north. It may be hot now, but I bet the growing season up that way is just getting under way. Most clubs back in the Met area are really just a month or so into their real season, Sand Hills is just opening for the season, and I'm sure Crystal and Forest Dunes up in northern Michigan are really just rounding into form too. I have a good friend that is a super at a club in chicago and it wasn't too long ago he was texting in a panic about how nothing was growing yet!




I'm sure most of you know I'm all about control in the construction process being the key to architecture, and I will champion common sense construction approach that lends itself to fast and firm, using bigger and fewer heads, christ I'm literally working at pinehurst right now so you know what I stand for, but I think we also need to remember this is a bizzaro circumstance for a one week thing that they have never had there, and there are likely a ton of other things compounded by the irrigation design that have been going on for a long time to produce that video.

[Matt_Cohn]

But if you don't want to deal with it, don't hit it there.

I don't mean to be patronizing, but the players already know that. Obviously, they are organizing their strategies with the state of the fescue considered.


But the reality is that players are going to hit it in there from time-to-time. I think players might be displeased by a) the possibility of injury and b) the prevalence of lost balls close to fairways vs. easy-to-find balls farther offline. Water and OB present neither of those issues. Those are not unreasonable complaints, whether or not you agree with them.

[Craig Sweet]

So much whining.....pampered bunch of babies wanna hit driver on every hole. 

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