The "new" Wentworth

[Niall C]

I've only seen brief highlights of this years PGA and as per normal they have focused on the putting. For those that have seen more TV coverage than me, and perhaps even played the new iteration of the course, would I be right in saying the new greens are more than a little like Augusta with the amount of contour they have ? Not a criticism as such just an observation. Is it accurate ?

Niall

[David_Tepper]

Some comments on the new greens in The Telegraph from James Corrigan:

 "Each of the 18 greens was relaid and a sub-air system, as used at Augusta, was installed under every one as well. The result is startlingly firmer surfaces and a much more consistent roll of the ball. Tyrell Hatton, the young world No 16 from nearby High Wycombe, summed up the elation in the locker room. “The greens are 100 times better,” he said."

[Adam Lawrence]

They've finally bitten the bullet and put creeping bent on the greens -- I frankly have no idea why they didn't do so before, given their priorities it seems a total no brainer to me. That has basically made the pros happy.


Greens are generally a bit less contoured than they were, bunkers not as deep as in previous iterations. I don't like the bunkers but everything has been very well done.

[John Kirk]

Alex Noren came from way behind to win today, with a 10 under 62.  Apparently, he has an idiosyncratic approach to the game, and is having a great year.  I had never heard of him until a couple months ago.

Anyway, this must be considered the best round of the year for the men's professionals.

[David_Tepper]

John K. -

Alex Noren won 4 times in 11 starts on the European Tour last year. I think he may have crept into the Top 10 in the world last fall.

DT

[jeffwarne]

The ultra striped walk mowed approaches were an absolutely horrifying collision of mower lines.
Sensory overload that jumped out at this viewer on TV.

[Lloyd_Cole]

I think the sad truth is that the West Course was never that wonderful. It's just held a lot of pro tournaments, and been on TV a lot, and for a while there, pre Ernie, there were some fun finishes to watch. The way they run the place, I can't imagine who wants to play there, or who would want to be a member when there are so many superior courses nearby. Agreed on the striping.

[BCrosby]

Lloyd makes a good point about Wentworth's location. Other than maybe eastern Long Island, there are few other places in the world with so many great courses bunched together.


Why, with so many other great courses close-by, would you choose to play Wentworth?


Bob

[Keith Phillips]

One answer to the question of 'why Wentworth?'...I moved to London as an expat in 2000 and was there for two years...I moved to Virginia Water and was able to become a full member at Wentworth within 30 days, at what was by English standards a steep entry fee but by US standards was a pittance...it would have taken me years (if ever) to get into Sunningdale, The Berkshire, Swinley Forest, St. George's Hill, etc....so I happily joined Wentworth and loved the place.  Three 18 hole courses including the charming East + a nine hole par 3...plus a great tennis/health club...altogether a great experience and I would happily rejoin if I could afford to move back to Surrey!

[David_Tepper]

Keith P. -


Thanks for the dose of reality.


DT

[Andy Stamm]

Lloyd makes a good point about Wentworth's location. Other than maybe eastern Long Island, there are few other places in the world with so many great courses bunched together.


Why, with so many other great courses close-by, would you choose to play Wentworth?


Bob

I'd say that Fife and East Lothian compare quite favorably. I understand that the Edinburgh is neither New York or London as far as commerce. But for golf? It stacks up with anything. And you wouldn't have much trouble joining as well, never mind the expense.

[Josh Stevens]

I examined the option when I moved to London in 2007.  I think from memory it was about equiv to US$20,000 joining fee and you could be playing the next day.

It was about $19000 more than I had so it didn't happen, but yes I can imagine for someone from NY it must seem like spare change

[Adam Lawrence]

Lloyd makes a good point about Wentworth's location. Other than maybe eastern Long Island, there are few other places in the world with so many great courses bunched together.


Why, with so many other great courses close-by, would you choose to play Wentworth?


Bob

I'd say that Fife and East Lothian compare quite favorably. I understand that the Edinburgh is neither New York or London as far as commerce. But for golf? It stacks up with anything. And you wouldn't have much trouble joining as well, never mind the expense.

You wouldn't have much trouble joining? Can't see just wandering up to HCEG, plonking down a few thou and playing the next day. North Berwick had a five year waiting list last time I checked too.

[Mark Pearce]

Elie also has a decent waiting list.

[Ronald Montesano]

So this thread about Wentworth ...

[Jon Wiggett]

Wentworth West was a very good course in its early format as a true heathland style course. As recently as the mid 80's it still possible to see the bones of its greatness but even then poor maintenance practices and even worse tree planting had robbed the course of much of its challenge and character. This latest iteration is horrendous and the should now plough it under to plant potatoes.


Jon

[Adam Lawrence]

I think it is interesting to compare Wentworth to St George's Hill, given that they were built by the same developer (Tarrant) and same architect (Colt obviously, although John Morrison did a lot of the work at Wentworth).


The most obvious difference is in the masterplan/routing. Compare the West to the main course at SGH and it is night and day -- Wentworth is, apart from the small loop at the far end of the course, wholly linear, with houses on both sides of the holes, and a much more 'parkland' feel, even before the recent work. It's no coincidence that the nicest part of the West is the run from 7-13 (apart from the horrors that have been inflicted on number eight), where you are not surrounded by houses and there's still a heath feel. The houses feel closer to the golf at Wentworth than at SGH, where you know you are playing through a housing estate, but it only occasionally impinges on the golf.


It is also important to note that Wentworth had 36 holes from day one, whereas at SGH the second course was an afterthought.

[Clyde Johnson]

It is also important to note that Wentworth had 36 holes from day one, whereas at SGH the second course was an afterthought.

I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that the West came after the East, in construction (1924 vs 1926) and planning/design?


The routing plan/layout for the estate that they have hanging in the clubhouse shows no sign of additional golf!?


Accordingly: the East's first became the West's first; the second then drove across valley, taking today's East #1 straight on; (at some point) the original eight and ninth were replaced by the current sixth and seventh (which head out and back from the eighth of the West); the loss of the first was made up by playing towards and over the first section of the long eighth, with the remainder of that hole becoming the ninth.


Doesn't seem the most logical of moves if 36 holes were planned from the outset?


Either way, lets hope they try to preserve/restore the Colt heritage they have left!

[Adam Lawrence]

Yes, but only by a year or two, rather than 15 years at SGH. I think they always had 36 in mind at Wentworth, at SGH the new course was clearly an afterthought.

[Marc Haring]

The ultra striped walk mowed approaches were an absolutely horrifying collision of mower lines.
Sensory overload that jumped out at this viewer on TV.

Agreed. An utter abomination. Bunkering looked sterile too. A case of the more they try, the worse it gets.

[Mark Chaplin]

My mate got into the HCEG in 11 years but his father was a member so that saved him a few years.


I'm 17 years in to the process of becoming a full member of the Marylebone Cricket Club, only 7 years to go.




Wentworth was probably the UK's first proper country club and whilst always very corporate there was a very good club atmosphere in the Burma Road bar. Lloyd is right the course was always good, never great it just had enormous exposure, including 8 days a year of full coverage on the BBC. The Els re do changed it to a pure competition course.

[Adam Lawrence]

After the first Els/Caring go around, I wrote a piece for Golf World headed 'Why Wentworth has Got it Wrong' -- they changed the headline to 'Why I Believe Wentworth Has Got It Wrong', which disappointed me, but there you go.


In that article, I described Wentworth as 'Britain's Augusta National'. OK, it's not as exclusive as Augusta in that you could pay a green fee, but that green fee was always sufficiently steep that for the overwhelming majority of UK golfers, it might as well have been Augusta. And, like Augusta, it was on TV _every_ year, twice in fact, for the PGA and the World Matchplay. The latter in particular had pretty legendary status in British golf, because it was one of only a few times each year we'd see the top Americans. And then Seve would beat them

[Tim Martin]

After the first Els/Caring go around, I wrote a piece for Golf World headed 'Why Wentworth has Got it Wrong' -- they changed the headline to 'Why I Believe Wentworth Has Got It Wrong', which disappointed me, but there you go.


In that article, I described Wentworth as 'Britain's Augusta National'. OK, it's not as exclusive as Augusta in that you could pay a green fee, but that green fee was always sufficiently steep that for the overwhelming majority of UK golfers, it might as well have been Augusta. And, like Augusta, it was on TV _every_ year, twice in fact, for the PGA and the World Matchplay. The latter in particular had pretty legendary status in British golf, because it was one of only a few times each year we'd see the top Americans. And then Seve would beat them

What's the dog situation there? I know how you like to measure the club's quality by the amount and breed of dogs tethered outside the clubhouse.

[Matt Dawson]

What's the dog situation there? I know how you like to measure the club's quality by the amount and breed of dogs tethered outside the clubhouse.

Rare I would say, Tim. I've certainly never seen any when I have played there - it's not really that sort of club