[Peter Pallotta]

I was thinking:

No one has ever had to tell us that flowers smell wonderfully fresh and lovely in the first rays of sunlight after a soft, summer rain.   
No one has ever had to teach us the feeling of exhilaration when we get to the summit and look out across the horizon after a hard, steep climb to the top.
No one has ever needed to read about the satisfying sound of a crisply struck 7 iron in order to recognize it when it happens.
No one ever has ever had to be told that sugar is pleasant to the taste. 
These are all direct experiences; and, while over the decades we might find new ways of expressing those experiences to others, neither we nor they need to have that basic experience explained.

So: why is playing an excellent golf course, one that manifests all the strengths and virtues of great golf course architecture, any different? Is it any different?
If playing a wonderful golf course is an actual and personal experience -- one as distinct and direct and memorable as any of those mentioned above -- do we/did we ever need any one else to explain it to us? 
As I mentioned on another post, I find myself wondering what gca would be like today if everyone with a stake in the game had simply remained silent, i.e. if no architects or writers or experts or discussion boards or tv analysts or magazines had ever talked about anything related to golf course design and maintenance. Now, in light of the barrage of GD Top 100 List threads, I find myself wondering about it even more.

What would the so-called "average golfer" enjoy and appreciate if none of them/us had ever heard about sandy soils, or of how brown is better/worse than green, or about dramatic sites or the importance of contoured greens or of fast and firm conditions? What would the average golfer 'know' (as we do with every other direct experience, i.e. not with words but with feeling and intuition) if no one ever tried to teach us anything about strategy or shot values, or what courses were great and which weren't, or about what golf was supposed to be?

In short:
If no one had ever said/written a word about it, do you think we would recognize top-flight golf course architecture the same way we recognize the lovely smell of fresh flowers after a summer rain?

Peter

[Sean_A]

Pietro


In a word, yes.  I really do think what is considered great would have a much broader definition than what we have become accustomed to.  I think this would be true of the best travelled and read golfers on the planet.


Ciao

[Kalen Braley]

P squared:


Great topic once again.  My only quesiton is, why does course rankings have to be the catalyst to these kinds of discussions?  I think in depth and critical analysis of course conditions and design can take place without ranking lists that are super subjective....


If we really want change, the talking heads and pro golfers on golf telecasts should be the ones bringing this stuff up more often, because it seems the masses take thier cues from them more than anything else...

[Jason Topp]

Often, great architecture reveals itself over time. 


In some cases the experience might be disagreeable the first time around (think the Old Course). 

[Tom_Doak]

Peter:


I've been able to test this out over the years, because my wife does not really play golf, my ex did not play golf before she met me, and my kids don't really play golf at all.


But they all get dragged to golf courses now and again, and they are nearly always more interested when they get out on a really good one.  My son, when he was young, would just have much more fun when he was out rolling down the steep parts of fairways at Crystal Downs, than on a lesser course.  He also loved walking out on The Old Course on a Sunday -- although to be fair I think I prompted him by telling him we were going to see Hell bunker.


And my ex used to ask if a new course we were looking at was designed by the same guy as that course we saw last year in California, just by looking at the shaping and the bunkers. 


Now, I am sure there are some courses built in less beautiful and dramatic spots, which the cognoscenti rave about, but which would be a yawner for a non-golfer or a small child.  But I do believe that a lot of the beauty of great golf courses is sculptural, and that almost everyone can appreciate that if they keep their eyes and minds open.


Of course, if they are too busy with their card and pencil mumbling about making a double bogey, they aren't going to appreciate anything at all.

[Peter Pallotta]

Thanks, gents.
Can anyone imagine comparing the wonderful scent of today's fresh flowers with yesterday's -- and trying to do so by breaking the experience down into its 8 or 10 categories/component parts?
Can anyone imagine telling a child that the thrill he is feeling having gotten to the very top of the mountain doesn't rank in the top 100 of such thrills, world wide -- and that he is only feeling the way he is because he doesn't know any better?
There is something misguided in all this judging and ranking and consesus opinions about greatness fed to us contantly via every media/medium known to man. I can't quite out my finger on it. But look: I mean, even the Ten Commandments were handed down in no particular order!

[JC Jones]

I started playing golf at the age of 7.  Around the age of 13, with maybe a dozen or so courses under my belt, I played High Pointe.  Upon my first playing of the course I immediately became interested in golf course design. 

From Plato to Aristotle to Hegel, Aesthetics always plays a role in the human experience.  No doubt someone playing golf could discern the effect on their senses one playing field might have versus another even without having read anything about the subject.

[Ronald Montesano]

Answers to your questions, in no particular order:


~The Creator/Evolution is not a Capitalist/capitalist;


~Just as you stumbled onto a question that no one had previously posed; so too, would different golfers extract different notions of the golfing experience;


~As a race, we communicate most efficiently and effectively with visual and audible language;


And I'll leave you with this question: In order for this to happen, how limited would our evolution have been? #TruncateDarwin

[Mark_Fine]

Peter,
Not all flowers smell the same and not all mountains afford the same kind of climbs and/or views.  If the highest mountain you climbed with your child is only a 500 foot hill and it looks over a corn field he or she might think it is amazing (and it probably is relative to what that child has experienced). 

If you asked the child to explain why they thought the view from and climb up that 500 foot mountain was great they would explain why and from that would come their "rating criteria".  If you took the child up a different hill they would start to see the differences and build a database of experiences which they could judge against.  This is not rocket science. 

We judge and rank almost everything in life.  It is human nature and we all have different criteria and experiences to make those judgments.  Some people just don't take the time to think about it and/or write their lists down. 

[Peter Pallotta]

Yes, maybe a child, prodded on by adults, will start trying to explain why flowers smell wonderful and why he was thrilled being on the mountain-top, and then further encouraged in this he'll soon start comparing one thrill to another and even telling his little friends that their thrills and flowers are not as good as his -- and so his childhood ends. Of course, like the man said: lest you become again like a little child you'll never enter the kingdom. Maybe we can't help judging and rating and ranking everything in our lives, but do we really need to be so proud about it that we encourage this tendency by every means and at every opportunity and on every thread possible? If that is what is meant by being a grown up, and if that's what a discussion board is meant for, well, you can keep both. If Sean is right with his post above -- and I always listen to Sean in such matters -- then our sense and experience of great golf course architecture has not been broadened and enhanced by all the teaching and talk and rankings and ratings but probably narrowed and diminished instead.
Peter

[Mark_Fine]

Peter,
Do you have any favorite wines you like, any particular foods you really enjoy, certain cities or destinations that you want to go back to, any sports teams that you cheer for,...? 

There is nothing wrong with having opinions or even having favorites. 

I think all the hoopla over the rankings is silly but this site obviously thinks it makes for great discussion or no one would talk about it. 

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