Scioto--US Senior Open

[Chris Cupit]

Well despite Delta's best efforts, I made it to Columbus.  I know I am running into Mac P. this week.  Anyone else here?  Looking forward to seeing Scioto up close--any thoughts?

[BCowan]

Chris,

   #2, #5, #9, and #16 are standout holes.  I'd also check out watching the pro's putt on the #13 green.  Green breaks towards the traffic light, it should give some of them fits.  Have fun!

[Brett Wiesley]

I'd add the 8th, 10th, and 16th are also very strong holes.  I believe #8 had the most changes made by Hurzdan when they renovated the course.

[JLahrman]

I caddied and worked in the bag shop there while I was in college, but that was 20 years ago. I'd have to see the course now because I know there have been plenty of changes since I was there.

#2 and #9 are very good holes.
#8 has definitely been changed a lot, it was the old island-ish green when I was there. It was kind of funky but I wouldn't say I disliked it.
I actually never liked #5; it might have been my least favorite hole on the course.
I also liked #10, #11, and #16.

But who knows how much it has changed since I was there, one can only tell so much from overhead aerials.

[BCowan]

I actually loved the 8th hole even before the last reno/resto.  No better feeling then knocking a tee ball over the tree on the left.  I hope they cut down the trees that were by the 11th tee, for they blocked a very nice ridge that followed the right to left line of the hole off the tee.  Please get photos of #8, I'd love to see the changes. 

[Chris Cupit]

I did my walk thru this morning and the course is terrific.  Phenomenal conditioning and the routing and greens really impressed me.  Lots of good, good par fours.


Anyway, I'll certainly check out the holes mentioned .  #8 is playing as a 495 yard par 4 this week and looks pretty tough.  Lots of balls will be bailing out right for sure.


Thanks and hope to see some folks out there.  I do have a fun group on Friday afternoon--Daly, Woosnam and Jimenez

[Billsteele]

I am going to post a link to a Power Point presentation that Mike Hurdzan did in 2014 which covers some of the changes. Of particular interest are photos of the 8th green from the 1926 U.S. Open, drawings of changes to the 8th hole over the years and "Now and Then" photos of the 8th green pre- and post- the latest revisions. The presentation seems to be geared toward communicating with members concerning renovation/restoration projects. Interestingly enough, it includes the membership votes on two changes (rebuilding the greens and changes to the 8th hole) stated in percentages.

One thing it does confirm is a story that I have long heard about the Wilson work at Scioto. At the time Wilson was doing his changes at Scioto, Jim Rhodes was the Governor of Ohio and a member at Scioto. The story was that when they were looking for fill for the green pads, the club used material that was excavated from beneath the Ohio Statehouse during the construction of an underground garage. I had always been told that when the work on the greens was done, they found rebar, concrete and other debris from the Statehouse garage project. There is photographic evidence of this in Hurdzan's presentation. No wonder there always seemed to be a drainage problem with the greens after Wilson's work! The PowerPoint also indicates that this particular issue had been identified in the 1970's as something that needed to be addressed.

https://www.gcsaa.org/uploadedfiles/Education/Conference-Sessions/2014/The-Renovation-of-Scioto-Country-Club--Communication-Strategies-for-Long-term-Projects.pdf

[Ronald Montesano]

One of my counselors from summer of 1982, Wake Forest golf camp, Bill Stines, is the head pro there. He won't take my calls, so he clearly has made a success of himself and knows which connections to preserve. Top-shelf guy. He made golf camp a blast. We were there for three weeks, all of the top six golfers were off playing the summer amateur tour, so Coach Haddock entrusted us to Stines and a few other guys who cemented my desire to attend Wake. What a blast.


Oh, the golf course? No clue. Enjoy, fellows.

[William_G]

thanks Chris

[Chris Cupit]

One of my counselors from summer of 1982, Wake Forest golf camp, Bill Stines, is the head pro there. He won't take my calls, so he clearly has made a success of himself and knows which connections to preserve. Top-shelf guy. He made golf camp a blast. We were there for three weeks, all of the top six golfers were off playing the summer amateur tour, so Coach Haddock entrusted us to Stines and a few other guys who cemented my desire to attend Wake. What a blast.


Oh, the golf course? No clue. Enjoy, fellows.

Bill Stines is the BEST!  When I first joined The Honors Course he was the pro and he is an absolutely prince of a guy.  I just met him, his brother Chuck and some buddies for dinner a few hours ago. 


I've got to get some sleep now!

[Steve Burrows]

I was out at the course yesterday.  Congratulations to Bob Becker, his staff, and the volunteers for having the course humming.  Hopefully the rain holds off for the weekend, though I’m not holding my breath.


There have been a lot of changes to the golf course since the last time I was there, probably close to 15 years ago.  The alteration to the area surrounding # 8 green is the most talked about, but what really caught my attention was the fairway bunker schemes on a couple of holes.  The oddest examples are on # 7 and # 11, a couple of par 4s that run parallel to each other.  With few opportunities to create new back tees (towards the Sisyphean task of making the golf course tougher), the club and its design consultants instead chose to move the bunkers themselves down the fairway.  The effect of this was that the bunkers are uncomfortably close to the green; it is a very jarring visual presentation.  Also, none of the pros seemed to challenge the bunkers; they just laid up short and had mid-to-short irons into the green.  No idea what impact these changes have on day-to-day play.


I don’t have pictures from the ground because there was a no-camera policy at the event, but I have attached aerial imagery below from both 2004 and 2013 (dates that the website had available that show the greatest differences) to provide a side-by-side comparison.


2004:

[BHoover]

I'm biased, but I very much enjoy Scioto and am looking forward to seeing how the course is presented during the US Senior Open.

I found Scioto to be very similar to Oakland Hills (another course I very much enjoyed).

Does anyone have any photos/aerials of the original Ross layout at Scioto?

[Bret Lawrence]

Brian,


Tufts Archives has an early Ross layout:
http://givenmemoriallibrary.net/vex/vex1/images/0C6780C3-9839-4B50-9C7D-897052519634.jpg


You can also find a layout from 1926 in the Compilation of Routing Maps thread, under reply 301.


Historic aerials.com has aerial imagery from 1957, 1963 and 1971.  The 1957 aerial shows the course prior to Wilsons work.  The 1963 aerial shows the front nine under construction and 1971 shows all 18 holes reconstructed.


Bret

[BCowan]

Bret,

   Nice post, what I can't see is how many greens I bet have been raised up higher then originally built such as 1, 2, 3, 5, 11, and 15.