[Sean_A]

Does it matter in the slightest what the pros do?


Ciao

Well, this was a course that was built for the pros to play on, so I presume if there is any course in the world where it does matter what the pros do then I guess it would be this one.

The fact of the matter is that this course plays not as Dye originally intended; both in terms of length and presentation. I thought this group was all about preserving the designers original intent? If the 9th was meant to be unreachable in 2 shots then that is what was intended.

This site may be about preserving designer original intent, but I ain't gonna be painted with such a limited brush.  Besides...how long can we keep extending courses to preserve intent?  Courses would be approaching 8000 yards if we really tried to do this.

Besides II, we had a nice chap explain how he layed up on many holes...back in the 90s. 

I also question how many rounds the pros play at Sawgrass compared to hacks.  There is a tournament there every year, but does it pay the bills?

Ciao 

[Jon Wiggett]

Sean,


the pros matter no less but no more than you do. So either you accept their input is valid and need to take it into consideration or you make yourself irrelevant and should stop posting


Jon

[David_Tepper]

Well, driver in or out of his hands, Jason Day handled the course pretty well yesterday.

http://www.pgatour.com/news/2016/05/12/day-ties-course-record-at-players.html

[jeffwarne]

Does it matter in the slightest what the pros do?


Ciao

Well, this was a course that was built for the pros to play on, so I presume if there is any course in the world where it does matter what the pros do then I guess it would be this one.

The fact of the matter is that this course plays not as Dye originally intended; both in terms of length and presentation. I thought this group was all about preserving the designers original intent? If the 9th was meant to be unreachable in 2 shots then that is what was intended.

This site may be about preserving designer original intent, but I ain't gonna be painted with such a limited brush.  Besides...how long can we keep extending courses to preserve intent?  Courses would be approaching 8000 yards if we really tried to do this.

Besides II, we had a nice chap explain how he layed up on many holes...back in the 90s. 

I also question how many rounds the pros play at Sawgrass compared to hacks.  There is a tournament there every year, but does it pay the bills?

Ciao

Sean,
In the case oF TPC Sawgrass, the course was BUILT to host the TPC, and much like The Masters, hosts a pro event every year which is the driving force behind its cache.


Hosting the TPC is their best marketing device-without the event it would soon fade as a destination course-like many others before it. So the pros do "matter in the slightest" in this instance.


The bills are paid by the tourists who flock to play a course made famous and relevent by the TPC event-that pros play in.


How relevant/profitable is the old Sawgrass course now that they no longer play it?


I will say it's an interesting event, regardless of layups-when hitting a 3 iron 280 it still has to be well and accurately struck as it is still going 280


While I often beat the rollback drumbeat, this course isn't really the poster child for it-It's really not my cup of tea anyway as far as playing golf-though it does have some interesting individual features.

[JESII]

And they are absolutely decimating it this week...I haven't seen any but 6, 7 and 8 under par rounds are flying around like crazy...assuming the greens are soft and true.



Wouldn't it be better to see 5 or 6 guys in the low 20's Sunday afternoon with someone potentially shooting 9 under par to get in the mix than the alternatives?


The alternatives being;


1) the course undergoes a massive transition tonight and tomorrow in speed, firmness and setup so that even par is a good round come Sunday...or
2) the guys on TV have to play equipment that only lets them hit the ball 80% of current distances and the leading scores in each round are 4 or 5 under with 11 under par as a potential winner...boring
3) the Tour spends $13M to toughen up the course that will still be destroyed when it's soft

[Amol Yajnik]

And they are absolutely decimating it this week...I haven't seen any but 6, 7 and 8 under par rounds are flying around like crazy...assuming the greens are soft and true.



Wouldn't it be better to see 5 or 6 guys in the low 20's Sunday afternoon with someone potentially shooting 9 under par to get in the mix than the alternatives?


The alternatives being;


1) the course undergoes a massive transition tonight and tomorrow in speed, firmness and setup so that even par is a good round come Sunday...or
2) the guys on TV have to play equipment that only lets them hit the ball 80% of current distances and the leading scores in each round are 4 or 5 under with 11 under par as a potential winner...boring
3) the Tour spends $13M to toughen up the course that will still be destroyed when it's soft

Option 3 is already going to happen after this year's event.  Greens will be changed to Tifeagle Bermuda from Miniverde Bermuda, and they are going to shorten #12 so it can play as a drivable par 4.


Links: http://jacksonville.com/sports/golf/2015-02-07/story/tpc-sawgrass-players-stadium-course-greens-be-renovated-2016
http://jacksonville.com/sports/golf/2015-12-21/story/pga-tour-make-12th-hole-tpc-sawgrass-stadium-course-reachable-par-4

[Thomas Dai]

......
The bills are paid by the tourists who flock to play a course made famous and relevent by the TPC event-that pros play in.

I wonder what proportion just want to play.........and have their photo taken by.......the 17th and would, given the chance, prefer several goes .....and photos.......at the 17th to playing holes 1-16 and 18th? 😊


I guess a bit like only wanting to play the 1st and 18th at TOC and having a photo taken on the Swilken Bridge? 😊


Atb

[Matt Kardash]

And they are absolutely decimating it this week...I haven't seen any but 6, 7 and 8 under par rounds are flying around like crazy...assuming the greens are soft and true.



Wouldn't it be better to see 5 or 6 guys in the low 20's Sunday afternoon with someone potentially shooting 9 under par to get in the mix than the alternatives?


The alternatives being;


1) the course undergoes a massive transition tonight and tomorrow in speed, firmness and setup so that even par is a good round come Sunday...or
2) the guys on TV have to play equipment that only lets them hit the ball 80% of current distances and the leading scores in each round are 4 or 5 under with 11 under par as a potential winner...boring
3) the Tour spends $13M to toughen up the course that will still be destroyed when it's soft

I can't imagine adding a dozen new back tees costing 13 million. I think a dozen new back tees will bring back some of the intended shots into greens. I think it would actually make the course play more interesting. 17 has become so easy now that the pros only hit wedge and sand wedge. The back right pin used to be a 7 or 8 iron! No one hits it in the water anymore.
I think a new back tee on 2, 5, 7, 9, 11, 12, 13, 14, 16, 17, 18.
Obviously, I would rather it not come to that, but since this is a course designed for pros to play I want to see them tested. The TPC is not the course it once was. No one is afraid of it anymore.

[JESII]

You're right about that...

[Steve Lang]

......
The bills are paid by the tourists who flock to play a course made famous and relevent by the TPC event-that pros play in.

I wonder what proportion just want to play.........and have their photo taken by.......the 17th and would, given the chance, prefer several goes .....and photos.......at the 17th to playing holes 1-16 and 18th? 😊


I guess a bit like only wanting to play the 1st and 18th at TOC and having a photo taken on the Swilken Bridge? 😊

Atb

Thomas, you don't want to play the 17th at TOC??? [size=78%]  [/size][size=78%]All one has to do is look at the Tour 18 courses to see [/size][size=78%][/size]that folks like to fantasy their way around the holes they see on TV[size=78%][/size].  Its fun, and I have a buddy that got a hole in one at the TPC 17th knock off and he prizes it highly!

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