[Tom_Doak]

The effectiveness of this feature depends almost entirely on soil types and grass types.  The beautiful wispy rough in New England or the UK becomes lost ball gunch in more fertile Midwestern settings.

Tom Doak,


What is the soil and grass make up of Crystal Downs? A couple of the photos I posted are of CD, which was the most "midwestern" of the examples I could find.

Crystal Downs' soils are a mottled mix ... sandy in some places, heavier in others.  About fifteen years ago they started to get much more aggressive about managing "weeds" and different grasses in the roughs, to selectively eliminate the ones that are more likely to result in unplayable lies and lost balls [at some expense].  However there are still quite a few places, such as to the right of #8, where you'd better have sharp eyes if your ball is headed toward the native.

[PCCraig]

Richard,

I don't think the wispy grass hides distance as well as a subtle roll of ground. It just sort of hides whatever might be viewed behind it and tends to anger some folks.  I know we have to consider grass height and elevate tees a bit more just to be sure.

There are several flat holes at Garden City Golf Club where the native grasses get so high by mid-summer that the tee shots are completely blind!

Such as this?









I don't have any first hand experience with Garden City. Looking through the photos, why is the "technique" of using no-mow in front of every tee so widely used? Or has it just always been that way?

[Tom_Doak]

Garden City has always been that way, as far as I know.  To be fair, the grass only gets to the point where you can't see over it well for a couple of months in late summer, not all year round.  But I'm guessing it's thicker than it used to be, because the soils have gotten more fertile over 100+ years of growing grass [and in some places, irrigation overspray].

[Jeff_Brauer]

Pat,


The funny thing is, they exist so long at old courses they seem to be part of the charm. If I did it on a new course, it would probably get a lot more criticism.  I have heard many good players complain about 6-8" grass right in front of the tee.  Apparently, they play like Arnie, with those low, low starting ball flights, rising up later in the shot, and don't want a tee shot to get knocked down. 


With new drivers, even 9 degree or less, I wonder if that is really an issue, or just psychological? I recall playing in pro ams, and pro will never let a caddie leave a bag forward of the tee to shorten their carry, even if topping a tee shot and hitting said bag is about a 0.00001% chance of incurring a penalty stroke.

[Lyndell Young]

I think the contrast of native to the fairway grass can give some character to holes that may be bland in a monochrome green.One thing that dont like is letting broadleafs getting overly populated in these areas.These areas still require a good amt of handwork and or spraying.

[Joe Hellrung]

Snakes notwithstanding, I wish my course would do this in more spots.  There is a lot of "dead space" that could be improved greatly from a maintenance and environmental standpoint if a meadow or wildflowers were permitted to take hold. 

For all its faults, I think the Honors Course is an example that has done this quite well.  I can think of several holes (such as #1) that are enhanced visually by the wild areas, and create a greater (but fair) challenge with the forced carry. 

Allowing the rough to grow up or naturalize between the tee and the start of the fairway is a practice that seems to be popular among courses in New England at places like Myopia, The Country Club, and Kittansett. It's a practice that I don't think has gained much popularity at courses here in Minnesota or in Chicago. Why is that? What are your thoughts on this? Do you like the look? Does it add to the aesthetic of a hole? Is it too penal on tight properties? How about the ladies...can you put this type of terrain in front of the "front" tees?

Here are a few examples of what I'm talking about:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Could you or would you add a natural area in front of this otherwise straightforward tee shot?

 

Or how about this one (on the left side of the path and closer to the green)?

[Lyndell Young]

Mark Hoban's native grass implementation at Rivermont has inspired me.

[PCCraig]

Mark Hoban's native grass implementation at Rivermont has inspired me.

Was this a recent change? What was the impetus for it?

[Joe Hellrung]

+1.  I loved the native areas when I played Rivermont.

Mark Hoban's native grass implementation at Rivermont has inspired me.

[Lyndell Young]

What I mean is there is a right way to create these areas.If you just quit mowing your "native areas" as I call them will not be very attractive and will lack the color contrast that is desirable. A good bit of research into types of grasses to plant and method to create these areas for your specific region is needed.Mark  improved the overall look and design of his course by doing it the right way. I am putting these areas on my course after visiting some Boston area Classics ,I for one like the look.JMO

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