[Paul Gray]

Amongst the GCA experts the drop shot par 3 is often regarded with some disdain, regarded it seems as a somewhat lightweight concept which impresses the uninitiated more than the aficiando. It seems the view is that any fool can put a tee at the top of a hill and a green at the bottom but any such hole is of limited architectural merit.

Personally I seem to have an ever changing opinion of the drop shot par 3 and I think I've realised why: I far prefer such a hole when greens are none too receptive, meaning that the drop shot hole, where the ball won't run upon landing simply because of the elevation change, comes as a genuine change up. When the course is lush and anyone can stop a ball on 18 out of 18 greens, the drop shot hole just becomes more of the same.

Below is a picture of the 6th at Hindhead. Anyone who knows the course will know how variable the receptiveness of the greens can be. Last time I played there was in May or June and it was a big disappointment as it was green and dull and a guy was wandering around with a giant hose spraying water everywhere. Safe to say then that I didn't get too excited about the long walk to the 6th. On other, drier occasions however that walk can be an interlude filled with anticipation.

Over to y'all.
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[Josh Stevens]

Is the merit of such a hole not determined by the dangers of missing?

A short drop shot par 3 is all about distance control rather than direction, so I'm guessing it is necessary to have some serious trouble, generally over the back, and then some interesting little contours at the front that make it more than just a soggy dart board.

the drop kick short par 3 at my club is the most intricate and interesting par 3 on the course.

[Malcolm Mckinnon]

Au contraire! we love drop shot par 3's!!


Of which GCA experts do you speak?


Merion West has two terrific ones, one long and one short for balance also Merion East 9th and 17th. I could go on and on with other great examples. Pine Valley 3rd and 14th anyone?


One of the most exciting of par 3 shots and loved by most golfers.

[Andrew Simpson]

Drop shot?!, why give it such a name tag and not a downhill par 3 as it is!
You Yanks are crazy dudes!
Royal Aberdeen 3rd hole check it out, to die for! (that's Royal Aberdeen, Scotland. Not a C+C course in some backwater state in the US) Not even going to mention the 12th at Hopeman, without naming a dozen more that are sheer quality.

[James Brown]

Drop shot?!, why give it such a name tag and not a downhill par 3 as it is!
You Yanks are crazy dudes!
Royal Aberdeen 3rd hole check it out, to die for! (that's Royal Aberdeen, Scotland. Not a C+C course in some backwater state in the US) Not even going to mention the 12th at Hopeman, without naming a dozen more that are sheer quality.

No kidding.  Aberdeen #3 is 250 yards of pure joy downwind and pure hell the other way.

[Sean_A]

Andrew


A drop shot par 3 is more like the name implies.  In most cases the ball drops from the sky practically straight down.  So there must be a considerable elevation change as the photo indicates. 


I am not a huge fan of the type, but there are always exceptions.  I seem to recall the 15th at Gullane 3 being an interesting version.  Practically any shot or club in the bag would do except a shot whcih landed directly on the green...and it is a long way down to the green.


Ciao

[Malcolm Mckinnon]

Andrew,


I think that the drop shot example from "Hindhead" is SW of London, therefore, not a "yank" issue.


Please advise if you can get a burger "rare" there or not.

[Tim_Weiman]

Don't mind drop shot par 3s and the challenge of distance control. One I recall enjoying was at the Virginia Country Club in Long Beach, CA (#10, I think) that our friend Tommy Naccarato mentioned he enjoyed as well.


Ditto for a hole up in San Franciso at the California Golf Club.

[jeffwarne]

Drop shot?!, why give it such a name tag and not a downhill par 3 as it is!
You Yanks are crazy dudes!
Royal Aberdeen 3rd hole check it out, to die for! (that's Royal Aberdeen, Scotland. Not a C+C course in some backwater state in the US) Not even going to mention the 12th at Hopeman, without naming a dozen more that are sheer quality.

Andrew,
I'm not sure if Paul Gray (not a yank)
Hindhead (not in a backwater us yank state)
or "yanks" should be offended.
Pretty sure the original dead guys who coined the phrase "drop shot" weren't yanks(at least not by birth) either.


Back on topic
I'm only bothered by a drop shot par 3 where the drop shot green is HIGHER than the previous green (think about that)

[Paul Gray]

Andrew,

No need now for me to explain that I'm English! Since our American cousins who frequent this board are generally good sorts, I'll not take offence at your racial slur! 

But there is a worthwhile distinction to be made between the downhill par 3 and the drop shot hole, the latter involving little ball movement upon reaching the deck.

[Thomas Dai]

Ever notice how, especially with irrigation and the love of 'green is best', drop-shot par-3's often seem to have poor putting surfaces, pitchmarks galore etc. Gradual and longer downhillers, like the excellent 3rd at RAGC mentioned above, suffer perhaps less.


Are there any drop-shot par-3's where the whole green contours such that the rear edge is lower than the front? If so a photo would be appreciated.



Nice line about height of the drop-shot green in relation to previous green Jeff


Atb

[Duncan Cheslett]

I can understand the intellectual snobbery against such an obvious form as the drop shot hole, but the truth is that most golfers love 'em. They are often spectacular, and nearly always fun; no more than the 6th hole at my own Reddish Vale which is a full 240 yards from the back tees to a green 150 feet below your feet.



The slightest pull or hook will find the river, and I would estimate that fewer than 10% of tee shots hit the green. Indeed, on charity days the Pro takes bets on the tee on players making the green. The charity always wins...

[Jason Thurman]

Drop shot holes are like any other type of hole - there are good ones and bad ones.


My favorites tend be short iron holes with sharply sloped greens that ask the player to judge how the slope of the green and spin of the ball will affect the release upon landing, and preferably in a windy spot. I enjoy the challenge of controlling trajectory with a short iron, gauging the elevation change and wind effect in conjunction with one another, and judging how the slope of the green will affect the ball upon landing. I also enjoy watching the ball hang in the air with uncertainty before watching it take off when it lands on the slope with spin.


I'm a homer on drop shots - the 16th at Wolf Run is the genre's holy grail for me and gets my blood pumping days before a visit. I'm also a fan of 11 at Black Creek, 7 at Pebble Beach, 7 at The Prairie Club (Dunes), 7 at Pete Dye Golf Club, and 17 at Colorado Golf Club (if it's downhill enough to count).

[Adam Lawrence]

Ever notice how, especially with irrigation and the love of 'green is best', drop-shot par-3's often seem to have poor putting surfaces, pitchmarks galore etc. Gradual and longer downhillers, like the excellent 3rd at RAGC mentioned above, suffer perhaps less.


Are there any drop-shot par-3's where the whole green contours such that the rear edge is lower than the front? If so a photo would be appreciated.

I couldn't absolutely swear to it but I think the ninth at Chambers Bay has a green that is considerably lower at the back than the front. Jay Blasi - are you reading this? Could you confirm?

[Jason Kang]

Josh, assuming I understand your post correctly, I agree overall with making a miss penal, etc.  However, sometimes the green is shaped so that direction and distance control become equally important.  Don't have a photo, but the 7th at Wilshire in Los Angeles is a fine example of this.  Small green oriented somewhat diagonally so that moving the pin 10 yards up or back totally changes shot alignment.  If you're not accurate, you've got some thinking to do on the second shot.  Jason Thurman would love this hole if he hasn't seen it already. 


ETA: also agree with OP that it does add fun variety when a course is really running.       

Is the merit of such a hole not determined by the dangers of missing?

A short drop shot par 3 is all about distance control rather than direction, so I'm guessing it is necessary to have some serious trouble, generally over the back, and then some interesting little contours at the front that make it more than just a soggy dart board.

the drop kick short par 3 at my club is the most intricate and interesting par 3 on the course.

[Jon Wiggett]

Here in the Scottish Highlands we have several very good drop shot. Many will know the one at Kingussie (16th?) which is over the river. Also the 5th at Strathpeffer is a good example. However my all time favourite is a bit further south at Ogden GC (Halifax) which gives us the spectacular 17th. Here the ball seems to take forever to get to the green but after climbing for the best part of 16 holes it is a long way down in just one.

There is also one in Switzerland at Source du Rhone which also give you the option of running the ball down to the green which is great fun though a bit of a lottery.

Jon

[Adam Lawrence]

I think I've mentioned this on here, Jon, but the first time I ever played Ogden as a kid the club selections in our fourball varied from 5 wood to wedge! A very perplexing hole.

[Greg Taylor]

9 at Porthmaddog has quite an elevation change. 17th at Araleun in Australia has a huge drop.


My issue with with them is clubbing them the first time it's played. It's quite a skill appreciating just how much less club you need.


They are fun to play however.

[Jon Wiggett]

I think I've mentioned this on here, Jon, but the first time I ever played Ogden as a kid the club selections in our fourball varied from 5 wood to wedge! A very perplexing hole.

Adam,

I have played Ogden probably 30+ times and have reached the conclusion what ever club you hit it seems to end up either just short, on the green or just long. It is a really weird effect when you second tee shot with a 3 iron (hit for fun) is only 30 longer than you 8 iron you hit first time. It is a bit like the second shot on the 2nd at Dewsbury that always comes up just short no matter what club you hit. Weird but somehow compelling.

Jon

[Mark Sider]

Castle Pines and Caves Valley have a couple nice downhill par 3s... they are pretty dramatic visually, and lead to suspense because its hard to tell when the ball is in the air where they might land.

[Chris Clouser]

For some reason I prefer the version of this that requires a short iron or are the extremely long versions.  Something about a 9-iron dropping from the sky, or seeing that 3 wood in the air forever.  Just don't get the same feeling from hitting a 4 iron on one of these holes.  Others that I cannot stand are the holes that have water next to the green.  So much of this hole depends on the wind impacting the flight of the ball.  Bunkers I'm fine with, water no.

[J_ Crisham]

Shoreacres #12, MPCC Shore #3 are some nice ones

[Adam Lawrence]

I was in Switzerland a couple of months ago and played the hilliest golf course I've ever seen, the nine holer at Realp, above Andermatt in the area of the St Gotthard Pass. It was about 1600-1700 metres above sea level and it's the first course I've ever seen where the tee markers tell you the elevation change on the hole as well as its length. The third is a par four of around 300m that has a 55m climb, while the fourth, which is a bit shorter at around 275m comes straight back down that hill with even more elevation change. Off that tee, my playing partner, the club pro, hit a gentle three wood that carried through the back of the green. Never seen anything like it. It was entertaining, if exhausting. That said, the eighth hole is an excellent split fairway par four and very strategic.

[Jason Thurman]

Adam, that 4th hole sounds a bit like this one from Eagle Ridge in Louisa, KY. 300 yard par 4 with about 200 feet of elevation change.

[Adam Lawrence]

Right, but I bet they have golf carts at Eagle Ridge!

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