Very good courses not included in the Confidential Guide (volumes 1–3 and 5)

[Carl Rogers]

Biltmore Forest and Ballyhack will both be profiled in Volume 3, though I myself have yet to see either of them.

Tom, has Darius spoken or corresponded with you about his round at Ballyhack?  I am very interested on what the CG vol 3 will say about that course.

[Paul Gray]

Sean,

Your comments about Remedy Oak chime with what I've heard. A pro I used to work with managed to card a 92 there in Open Qualifying a few years ago and still thought it was respectable!

I do sometimes wonder if, desperate to find that someone is doing something really good these days, courses like Remedy get more praise than they deserve. It's been heralded as an inland modern great but, as you say, that bar isn't exactly sky high.

[Adam Lawrence]

I like Remedy Oak, though it is undeniably flawed. It suffers from not having a proper golf architect involved throughout the process -- developer Bill Riddle finished the course himself. But it is a glorious piece of property, and there are some splendid holes there.

[Sean_A]

I won't be chomping at the bit to go back, but without a shadow of a doubt, Remedy Oak is the friendliest club I have encountered.

Ciao

[Criss Titschinger]

In Volume 1, I was hoping to see more of the inland courses in Northern Ireland like Belvoir Park and Malone, but that's mostly selfish reasons because I'm hoping to do a trip there in the distant future.


In Volume 2, I was surprised not to see Wade Hampton mentioned. I'll second the Sara Bay mention.


I can give a pass on not going through Alabama to the Gulf Shores area. I can guess what Kiva Dunes would have received.


Again, I understand all the traveling involved (at cost), so I just appreciate what's given.

[Jim Franklin]

I am sure Wade Hampton will be in the next one. It is not a winter destination. Porcupine Creek would have been an interesting course to see.

[Tom_Doak]

I am sure Wade Hampton will bin the next one. It I not a winter destination. Porcupine Creek would have been an interesting course to see.

I did try to get access to Porcupine Creek when I was in Palm Desert last February; the people at Stone Eagle thought they might be able to arrange it.  But, no dice.  I saw an opportunity to pay $5000 to enter a charity tournament there, but Renaissance Golf Publishing does not have an platinum expense budget!


As to Wade Hampton, yes, like other courses in the NC mountains [Grandfather, Linville, Mountaintop, Roaring Gap, etc.], it will be in Volume 3.

[David Kelly]

In v. 1, Colt's Bath Golf Club in Bath, England.  Probably a 5 or 6 but the 17th is an all-world short par 4.

[Ryan Coles]

Vol 1.

Queenwood.
Remedy Oak
Bearwood Lakes

Ryan,


Queenwood is profiled on page 104.


TK

Noted. My recollection was slightly out. Doak hasn't seen it. Ditto Machrihanish Dunes. The Castle Course getting a lot of noise on release, I was interested in reading his views on some of DMK's others.

[Ryan Coles]

Re: Remedy Oak

Yes, the bar isn't particularly high, but I'm quite interested in the modern, moderns. There is no Renaissance of architecture in the UK and probably never will be now. But the select few courses coming out are high end and its interesting to see if lessons from the 80's have been learned.

Remedy Oak, Bearwood, Grove etc certainly have more merit than the
The Chart Hills, East Sussex, Oxfordshire's.

Remedy specifically is great fun. At least on one or two plays. It's nothing special or unique, but I've played very few English parklands that are better.

[Tom_Doak]

My recollection was slightly out. Doak hasn't seen it. Ditto Machrihanish Dunes. The Castle Course getting a lot of noise on release, I was interested in reading his views on some of DMK's others.

I've been to Queenwood, and wrote the review.  And I also accentuated the positive in the Machrihanish Dunes review; I thought I'd like it more than Darius did.  I haven't been to Nanea, though.


You will get to see a lot more reviews of David's courses in Volume 3, as I stopped through both Huntsman Springs and Gamble Sands this summer.

[Blake Conant]

Would've liked to see Santa Anita GC in Los Angeles get a profile. 

[Derek_Duncan]

Did Aiken GC make it?

Unfortunately not.

I'd also throw out Frederica GC.

I was also looking forward to seeing some commentary on Frederica, especially playing off the Ocean Forest and Seaside scores. For my money Frederica is more interesting than either aside from a few horribly cliched holes (1, 10, 18). The huge green complexes are pushed to the max.


For the ATL area I was also hoping to see an update of The Standard Club, post Mike Riley renovation. The old Art Hills score is not reflective of what's there now.

[Ronald Montesano]

I did try to get access to Porcupine Creek when I was in Palm Desert last February; the people at Stone Eagle thought they might be able to arrange it.  But, no dice. 

This fellow had access. Perhaps he can write a guest review...RM


http://www.desertsun.com/story/sports/golf/2014/06/13/porcupine-creek-golf-course-barack-obama-visit/10410487/

[Rob Collins]

I think Old Toccoa Farm (formerly Blue Ridge) by Dan Proctor & Dave Axland would've been a great addition. Unfortunately, timing wasn't ideal, as I believe the first 9 just opened a little while ago. I got the opportunity to tour the site last winter and loved it. If you're ever anywhere near N. Georgia, I would definitely make an effort to go see it.

[Tom_Doak]

I think Old Toccoa Farm (formerly Blue Ridge) by Dan Proctor & Dave Axland would've been a great addition. Unfortunately, timing wasn't ideal, as I believe the first 9 just opened a little while ago. I got the opportunity to tour the site last winter and loved it. If you're ever anywhere near N. Georgia, I would definitely make an effort to go see it.

I haven't heard about that project in ages.  Where is it, roughly?

[Rob Collins]

It's in the far northeast corner of Georgia near the intersection of TN, GA, & NC - a beautiful spot.
Some cool pics here:
http://www.oldtoccoafarm.com
As you noted, Tom, that project lay dormant for a while. Dan relayed to me that there were 6'+ tall trees growing on some of the fairways that had been planted. Interestingly, most of the zoysia that was originally planted survived, trees & all! Cool place, for sure!

[Bruce Wellmon]

It's in the far northeast corner of Georgia near the intersection of TN, GA, & NC - a beautiful spot.
Some cool pics here:
http://www.oldtoccoafarm.com
As you noted, Tom, that project lay dormant for a while. Dan relayed to me that there were 6'+ tall trees growing on some of the fairways that had been planted. Interestingly, most of the zoysia that was originally planted survived, trees & all! Cool place, for sure!

Some intresting pictures there. When does the full 18 (re)open?

[Chris DeToro]

Another course I wondered about was the Currahee Club in northern GA as well.  I totally understand the limitations with all of the travel and it would likely be a 5-6 at best, but I would've been interested in reading the other opinions as that was probably the most pleasant surprise of the courses I played in Georgia a couple of years ago

[PCCraig]

I just noticed this while typing a post this morning about Kiawah/Charleston.


Given the love of Audubon GC in New Orleans, I am a little surprised that The Muni in Charleston wasn't included. They are somewhat similar in that they are both low-lying low-profile courses, but I think there are significantly more interesting holes at Charleston (the par-4 12th along the marsh is a flat out awesome hole) plus the vibe of the clubhouse and course is along the same lines as the Audubon.


Anyway, I would of thought it would of been included in the 2nd edition of the guide.

[Tom_Doak]

Given the love of Audubon GC in New Orleans, I am a little surprised that The Muni in Charleston wasn't included. They are somewhat similar in that they are both low-lying low-profile courses, but I think there are significantly more interesting holes at Charleston (the par-4 12th along the marsh is a flat out awesome hole) plus the vibe of the clubhouse and course is along the same lines as the Audubon.


Anyway, I would of thought it would of been included in the 2nd edition of the guide.

It sounds lovely.  But this is the first I've ever heard of it, which is one major reason it's not in the book.

[Rees Milikin]

Would have loved to see these make the cut and overall a tad disappointed with the lack "new" courses included from the Southeast:

Aiken Golf Club
The Country Club - Morristown, TN
Deltona Club
Victoria Hills Golf Club
Mission Inn - El Campeon
West Palm Beach Municipal
Palatka Golf Club
Ocala Golf Club
Country Club of Orlando
Timuquana Country Club

Never played the Charleston Municipal course, but have heard good things.

[Josh Tarble]

Rees,

With the exception of Aiken (maybe including Aiken, I don't know) do you think any of those would have registered more than a 5?  I'm just wondering if a lot of what they left out was just omitted to keep the amount of 3-5s down.

[Rees Milikin]

Rees,

With the exception of Aiken (maybe including Aiken, I don't know) do you think any of those would have registered more than a 5?  I'm just wondering if a lot of what they left out was just omitted to keep the amount of 3-5s down.

I would definitely put most of the ones I listed in the 4-5 range, with an occasional 6.  If those atrocious Disney courses, Harder Hall, & Golden Ocala can show up on the list, then most certainly those I listed should show up. 

[PCCraig]

Given the love of Audubon GC in New Orleans, I am a little surprised that The Muni in Charleston wasn't included. They are somewhat similar in that they are both low-lying low-profile courses, but I think there are significantly more interesting holes at Charleston (the par-4 12th along the marsh is a flat out awesome hole) plus the vibe of the clubhouse and course is along the same lines as the Audubon.

Anyway, I would of thought it would of been included in the 2nd edition of the guide.

It sounds lovely.  But this is the first I've ever heard of it, which is one major reason it's not in the book.

Understood. You drive right through the golf course on the way out to Kiawah Island on Maybank Highway. It's also right down the street from the CC of Charleston. Perhaps it's something worth checking out the next time you're in Charleston. The course is in need of some TLC (green/fairway expansions, etc.) but it is likely up your alley.

Apparently it's so under the radar that there aren't really any pictures of the course online. The best I could do is get a couple of screenshots from the Google Maps with the views being from the road that bisects the course.

Here is the tee shot on the par-4 12th:



A couple of the holes on the front nine, as seen from a neighborhood road through someone's backyard:





And here is the green on the par-4 17th: