No Mas!

[Rich Goodale]

The Old Course, must feel like they were Roberto Duran fighting a whole field of Sugar Ray Leonard's.  I've never seen birdie putts drop so often at any golf tournament, much less The Major......

[Cliff Hamm]

I hope the suits from the USGA are watching it.  The leaderboard is tremendous filled with the best current golfers. The USGA needs to get beyond "protecting par". Yes, it is a Birdie fest.


One does not need 8000 yard courses to identify the best golfer.  There are only two choices. Implement a tournament ball – ain't going to happen. Or recognize that the game at the highest level has fundamentally changed  and embrace it.  Accept  scores will be low and give up on silly set ups and overly long courses.

[Phil McDade]

I hope the suits from the USGA are watching it.  The leaderboard is tremendous filled with the best current golfers. The USGA needs to get beyond "protecting car". Yes, it is a Birdie fest.

Cliff:


While I agree the leaderboard today is tremendous -- and tremendously diverse (2 amateurs! Some 40+ guys!) -- it's not clear to me a tough set-up with scores around par necessarily produces a poor leader board. One of the all-time great leaderboards came in the 1986 U.S. Open, when Shinnecock played extremely tough (and was set up that way), and one player finished under par. But it was a great board with the likes of Floyd, Crenshaw, Trevino, Sutton, Wadkins, Payne Stewart, Langer, Norman, and Tway.

[cary lichtenstein]

Thrilling

[Cliff Hamm]

Phil.   No argument I was actually at that US Open. My point is not that tough set ups do not produce quality leader boards. I do believe that when you narrow fairways with thick rough it takes away the architecture.


 My real point is that a quality golf course can produce a great leaderboard without fundamentally changing the course.

[Dean Stokes]

What a great Open. This has had everything! 30 players with 4 shots of the lead-anyone can win-Spieth going for his third of the year....taking the day off tomorrow😄

[Brent Carlson]

We finally had a chance to watch the elements challenge the players yesterday, and they cancelled play.  Now we are watching a boring pitch and putt with virtually no penalty for bad shots.  Where is the gorse, the heather or the challenge?

[Randy Thompson]

Interesting year, various 21 year old stirring up the golf world, the brownest Us Open in history and one of the greenest Bristish Opens I can remember!

[Dean Stokes]

We finally had a chance to watch the elements challenge the players yesterday, and they cancelled play.  Now we are watching a boring pitch and putt with virtually no penalty for bad shots.  Where is the gorse, the heather or the challenge?

low score wins and there are 20-30 possible winners. I think it's fun even due to the lack of rough.

[noonan]

We finally had a chance to watch the elements challenge the players yesterday, and they cancelled play.  Now we are watching a boring pitch and putt with virtually no penalty for bad shots.  Where is the gorse, the heather or the challenge?

Balls moved by the wind is not challenging. it is absurd. They should have never pegged a ball yesterday.

[Brent Carlson]

We finally had a chance to watch the elements challenge the players yesterday, and they cancelled play.  Now we are watching a boring pitch and putt with virtually no penalty for bad shots.  Where is the gorse, the heather or the challenge?

Balls moved by the wind is not challenging. it is absurd. They should have never pegged a ball yesterday.

The Open has been played in those winds many times.  The greens are now too fast for the original slopes.

[Jon Wiggett]

The Old Course, must feel like they were Roberto Duran fighting a whole field of Sugar Ray Leonard's.  I've never seen birdie putts drop so often at any golf tournament, much less The Major......

Augusta with several eagles thrown in for good measure maybe? 12 under after 3 rounds is nothing exceptional and I suspect Faldo's winning score of 1990 will not be surpassed.

Jon

[Patrick_Mucci]

Cliff, et. al.,
 
There is merit to defending par in terms of the interfacing of the architectural features with the play of the golfer.
 
When we mortals play a course/hole, we have to be cognizant of the architectural features that might thwart us from our quest for birdie/par.
 
Shouldn't a world class Pro/Amateur be confronted by similar architectural features, features intended to thwart their quest ?
 
The problem is that many, if not most, courses remained static, or limited in their ability to adjust, while hi-tech was rapidly changing and arming the best players with I&B that rendered many architectural features ...... obsolete.
 
Do you want to see your majors turned into desert scoring fests ?
 
Or, do you want to see the best players in the world face a variety of architectural features and maintenance practices intended to thwart their efforts.
 
I want to see them challenged.
 
But, how do you defend against 350+ yard drives and 200 yard 8-irons ?
 
While it may be futile, I continue to advocate for a tournament ball.
 
I believe that's the only way to bring sanity back to conpetitive golf.
 
And, I look to ANGC to make the introduction.
 
One can always hope and dream...... yes ?

[RJ_Daley]

Is it correct to say that however the tournament ball would get dialed back,  the top 1-2% of bombers in the tournament field would still hit the ball some 10% further than the field average?

Don't get me wrong.  I would like to see an introduction of a tournament ball.  It would curtail the quest for more yardage of the golf course designs, it seems to me.  That would be worth the test of a tournament ball at say The Masters.  But, the bombers will xtill be the bombers withe distance as its own advantage.  I am not sure that reduced distance balls will bring back a golden age of clever little shot makers against the bomb and gouge crowd.

[noonan]

When you lengthen the course so much or put pins on the tops of mounds you fundamentally bastardize the game.

If the courses are any longer you will lose the Zack Johnsons of the game and you will only see gladiator size players on tour.

[David_Tepper]

"why are low scores such a bad thing?"

http://www.golfdigest.com/blogs/the-loop/2015/07/in-defense-of-st-andrews-why-a.html

[Wade Whitehead]

Can anyone name a player who should have won a major but didn't because of course setup?

WW

[Wade Whitehead]

Or, more appropriately, a player who won a major because of course setup who shouldn't have?

WW

[Rich Goodale]

The Old Course, must feel like they were Roberto Duran fighting a whole field of Sugar Ray Leonard's.  I've never seen birdie putts drop so often at any golf tournament, much less The Major......

Augusta with several eagles thrown in for good measure maybe? 12 under after 3 rounds is nothing exceptional and I suspect Faldo's winning score of 1990 will not be surpassed.

Jon

Jon

The way things are going, there will be 16 players at -16 or better when the day is done!

Rich

[Jonathan Mallard]

Or, more appropriately, a player who won a major because of course setup who shouldn't have?

WW

Orville Moody. 1969 US Open.


For exactly one week, he found a way to make putts go in a regulation size hole.

[Carl Rogers]

Equipment for the elite of the game can also be revised:
-no graphite shafts
-no club longer than 43"
-280cc driver head
-no titanium

[Phil McDade]

If the courses are any longer you will lose the Zack Johnsons of the game and you will only see gladiator size players on tour.

Two of the shorter (by height) players in the game today are in the Open Championship playoff.

[Patrick_Mucci]

"why are low scores such a bad thing?"

Because they're indicative of a failure to challenge the golfer



http://www.golfdigest.com/blogs/the-loop/2015/07/in-defense-of-st-andrews-why-a.html

[jeffwarne]

Is it correct to say that however the tournament ball would get dialed back,  the top 1-2% of bombers in the tournament field would still hit the ball some 10% further than the field average?

Don't get me wrong.  I would like to see an introduction of a tournament ball.  It would curtail the quest for more yardage of the golf course designs, it seems to me.  That would be worth the test of a tournament ball at say The Masters.  But, the bombers will xtill be the bombers withe distance as its own advantage.  I am not sure that reduced distance balls will bring back a golden age of clever little shot makers against the bomb and gouge crowd.

RJ,
Distance should be a large reward-Having the judgement(and ability) of when to use power an even bigger advantage.
As you point out, ironically. a rolled back ball would help the longer players the most-the greatest players have always been longer than their peers-as it should be.
In fact I would argue that the hot equipment today is the reason Watson and older players can still compete by accurately hitting their drivers where longer players are forced to hit irons and hybrids due to fairways running out or bottlenecking. With a rolled back ball, a long hitter having an accurate week could hit driver on such a hole and be 30 yards ahead rather than often sharing the same fairway space as a 65 year old player.

[Malcolm Mckinnon]

Rich,


I watched the Open Championship intently. I miss Scotland intensely as I just sent my daughter back to Edinburgh. Her new flat is in Morningside.


All I could think about is that Leven/Lundin has near equal links land to TOC, and how much I enjoyed playing over those links out and back again to town.


I couldn't help wondering if St. Andrews is the "Edinburgh High Street" tourist trap for golfers.


Your thoughts?