Winged Foot - Hole By Hole - 1929

[Jim_Kennedy]

If you've ever wondered:

http://archive.lib.msu.edu/tic/ngktc/article/1929aug19.pdf

[Jim_Kennedy]

And a 1923 photo of the Biarr 8th hole.

[Tom_Doak]

The Merion-style baskets on top of the flagsticks are interesting.  I know that a bunch of other clubs used them in the early days, but don't remember seeing them in the photos of Winged Foot from the '29 Open.  Perhaps the USGA substituted flags?

[Chris Cupit]

Dang--I was just about to mention the baskets too

[Chris Cupit]

While Merion is the most famous course with baskets, they were not the first or only for sure.  The wicker ballon baskets were "common" enough that they were advertised in Turf Magazines in the 20's.  I have an old Stumpf's catalogue with one of those advertisements.  You could buy the baskets for $7.50 a piece back then.

[Phil Young]

SFGC used baskets at least as early as 1925 and very likely for many years preceding that.

[Jim_Kennedy]

To add to the confusion - caption reads:  "Bobby Jones strokes his putt on the 18th green during the morning round of a playoff against Al Espinosa in the 1929 U.S. Open at Winged Foot Golf Club's West Course in Mamaroneck, New York"



ed: doesn't look like a flag on the stick in the 1923 photo of #8

 

[MCirba]

What's the history of the hole numbers behind greens?   All of our early Cobb's Creek pics show them, as well?

[Neil Regan]

The "Eighth" hole in the 1923 picture is West #4.
On opening day, a composite course was played with that day's hole numbers posted as in the picture.

West #4 is the only green of 36 radically altered since 1923.
In c 1933, the center dip was filled, most likely due to agronomic difficulties.
That corner of the property has always had issues with standing water and stagnant air.
Those issues have been greatly ameliorated in the past few years, via drainage, tree control, fans, and loads of hard work and TLC from the grounds crew.

A recently rediscovered movie highlights from the 1929 US Open (thank you, Shannon Doody at the USGA Museum)
shows, inter alia, several golfers putting through the swale. IIRC, it is Sarazen, Jones, and maybe Hagen or Denny Shute.
The view from behind shows the putt from the back as it goes down, disappears in the swale, and comes up near the pin.

There are some who would like to see that green restored, if there was confidence that the agronomic issues were definitely resolved.


-----
The baskets were used throughout the 1920s, up until the National Open.
I have not noticed them in any photos post-1929.
I'd guess we decided to stay with the flagsticks after the Open.
We have a few Baskets that we occasionally put on the finishing holes for special events.

[Jim_Kennedy]

Wow- thanks Neil!

Any way of posting that video here?
 

[Neil Regan]

This is from the program for this weekend's Tillinghast Cup at Winged Foot, an annual member-member event.

[Neil Regan]

Wow- thanks Neil!

Any way of posting that video here?
 

Jim,

  I will try to do that. Our copy is behind the Club's firewall. I will try to get a copy onto another link.

Neil

[Jim_Kennedy]

Thanks Neil.

What an overall beautiful green/site, with nice 'shoulders'.  

ed: like the basketstick location.

[Jason Topp]

I find it interesting that the assumed driving distance in the article is not that different from where pros hit it in the 70s but the carry distances for the fairway bunkers is quite short.  Does anyone have an idea how far architects assumed the ball would run off the tee for top level players in the 20's.

[Bill Brightly]

Were the two courses built at the same time?

[Sven Nilsen]

Were the two courses built at the same time?

Yes.

[Michael Felton]

It's interesting how in the photo that Jim posted of 18 in 1929, it seems that there are a lot less trees around the fairway than there are now, but all the other pictures have trees aplenty. Often I know that courses become heavily treed over time as they grow, but also often when you look at pictures from this time period, the courses looked very different and much more open. WF looks not dissimilar then to now (at least in the photos from the original link). The tree beside the 2nd green doesn't look a whole lot different from how it looks now, 85 years later. Is it the same tree?