GCA Superbowl Matchup

[Jason Way]

Ok, low blow Pete. I admit.  

To get this back on the GCA rails though, instead of just being homers (which I am not because I live in Chicago), let's look at this matchup statistically.  Until Tom's updated Confidential Guide for N. America is available, we can use the recent GD Top 200 to dig in.  I realize that that list has its detractors and dismissers, but it is about as objective as it gets.

From the list, Team New England (as I have defined it), has the following courses:
19. TCC
75. Boston GC
79. Old Sandwich
84. Kittansett
126. Newport CC
135. Wannamoisett
152. Eastward Ho!

Team Seattle has:
18. Pac Dunes
37. Bandon Dunes
55. Old Mac
74. Bandon Trails
108. Sahalee
129. Eugene CC
130. Chambers Bay
144. Pronghorn (Fazio)
156. Pronghorn (Nicklaus)
172. Aldarra

Team New England has 3 in the Top 100, and 7 in the Top 200.  Team Seattle has 4 in the Top 100, and 10 in the Top 200.  And it is safe to say that the next time they do the rankings, Gamble Sands is nearly guaranteed to be on there somewhere.  Not sure if the same can be said for any new or renovated classic course in New England.

I agree, that in terms of overall depth, Team New England wins, but in terms of "best" courses, it isn't so clear.

Further, in terms of architectural significance RIGHT NOW, a solid argument could be made that what is happening in WA and OR is more influential than New England.  The resort at Bandon, especially when combined with Bandon Muni (if/when that happens) and the other surrounding public courses, have changed paradigms across the country of what golf can be.  That effect is going to be compounded when the US Open goes to Chambers Bay.  New England does not have the same influence on golf and golf architecture in America right now because of limited access and visibility.

Full disclosure, I am taking an annual buddies golf trip this year and we are going to...Boston.  But that is only because we can get on private courses like TCC and Eastward Ho!  If I were the average avid golfer in America right now, it would be completely reasonable of me to conclude, based on access, that the seat of the best GCA in America now resides in the Pacific Northwest.

[Matthew Essig]

Thanks for that last post Jason. Quite intriguing. But how is Wine Valley not in the top 200, which would add another modern golf architecture focused course to "Team Seattle"?? Either there haven't been enough GD reviewers, or I have lost my last ounce of faith in the GD rankings.

[Tim Leahy]

I haven't seen a response from the NE guys to the public vs public matchup. NW kills NE, even though I hope the Hawks get killed by the Pats.

[Jason Way]

No comment on the GD rankings Matt(hew).  There is another thread for venting angst over relative ranking injustices.

You did get me thinking though.  GD isn't the only list.  What do the other lists say?

Golfweek 100 Best Modern

Team Seattle has:
2. Pac Dunes
6. Old Mac
8. Bandon Dunes
22. Bandon Trails
24. Chambers Bay
48. Pronghorn (Fazio)
79. Eugene CC
89. Wine Valley

Team New England has:
15. Old Sandwich
19. Boston GC
46. Shelter Harbor

8-3 victory, Seattle.

Golfweek 100 Best Classic

Team New England has:
24. TCC
30. Myopia HC
32. Wannamoisett
45. Newport CC
48. Kittansett
54. Essex County
58. Eastward Ho!
60. Salem CC
82. Sankaty Head GC
91. Whitinsville
92. Taconic
97. Ekwanok

Team Seattle has:
Nuttin, nada, zippo, zilch.

12-0 rout, New England.

Golf Magazine Top 100

Team Seattle has:
12. Pacific Dunes
34. Bandon Dunes
45. Old Mac
49. Bandon Trails
64. Chambers Bay

Team New England has:
24. TCC
57. Newport CC
76. Kittansett
78. Eastward Ho!
81. Boston GC
90. Myopia HC

6-5, New England wins. 

Put all of these list mentions together and Team New England comes out on top 28-23.  Far from a blowout.  If we were to take all of the CG grades for the two teams and average them out (and I would love to), I suspect that we would find a similar outcome.  New England stronger, but not by as much as the purists on this site might think, and with a gap that is closing every year.

[V. Kmetz]

,,,,Seahawks 28, Patriots 24...

Well, as Agent 86 used to say; "You got everything right, except the ___________."

cheers

vk

[Mark Bourgeois]

,,,,Seahawks 28, Patriots 24...

Well, as Agent 86 used to say; "You got everything right, except the ___________."

cheers

vk

In Madden '15 we trust.

[Jason Way]

,,,,Seahawks 28, Patriots 24...

Well, as Agent 86 used to say; "You got everything right, except the ___________."

cheers

vk

Actually, my newly invented GCA-BestofList-Matchup-Predictometer was only off by a point.  I might be on to something here...

Everything in life truly does come back to golf.

[RJ_Daley]

Seattle's goal line play call and thought process as explained by Pete Carroll was equivalent to Jean Vandevelde's thought process and play on the 18 at Carnoustie.

[Pete Blaisdell]

Patriots   28

Seahawks 24

What can I say? Lunch and libations at Abe & Louis on Boylston  AND a parade.

Jason, sounds like you guys have some contacts in Boston for your buddy trip. But , if you need some help getting onto some of the tough plays, contact me and I'd be happy to help.

I know the thread was a bit O/T but it was in good fun.

AND, we do have a good number of PUBLIC tracks up here. Nothing to match the Bandon complex which is one of a kind on the planet.

RJ , loved your analogy.

In Brady, we trust!!

[Mark Steffey]

Wannamoisett, being the pound-for-pound best fighter out there, would easily tilt any contest to new england.

[Matthew Essig]

Seattle's goal line play call and thought process as explained by Pete Carroll was equivalent to Jean Vandevelde's thought process and play on the 18 at Carnoustie.

Perfect analogy. Too bad both happened...