National Club Golfer GB&I magazine - top 100 links plus the next 50 listed

[Mark Bourgeois]

A top 100 GB&I links ranking truly is hilarious. They would have done better to come up with a Top 50 ranking of unranked links. 

[Niall C]

"Skibo at 16 - Ha!"

Martin -

It is surprising to see Skibo ranked so highly, especially since so few people are actually able to play it. It could be the least played course on the entire list.

That being said, the course has been changed a bit (for the better I am told) over the past 3-4 years. Skibo was ranked #24 in the GolfWorld(UK) GB&I ranking list earlier this year.

DT

Martin

I'd echo David's comments. When I was up visiting Dornoch a couple of years ago I stopped off at Skibo, jumped the fence and went and had a look at some of the new holes and quite frankly they are stunning. Both in terms of aesthetics and also in terms of being so inviting that I really wish I had been able to play rather than just having a sneak peek. One day when I win the lottery......

Niall

[Niall C]

As someone else pointed out, no Fraserburgh. From my one visit there, I'm mildly surprised that it didn't make the bottom half of the 100 but then again I suspect that has everything to do with the demographics of the panel. As for the Kintyre, I'm surprised some think it worthy of a top 100 spot. Personally I'm not sure I'd find a place for it in the next 50, not that I've played enough links to judge.

I'd certainly play Gullane 3 or Carnoustie Burnside before the Kintyre.

Niall

[Duncan Cheslett]

West Lancs is sneaky good...nobody talks about it.  I think it holds its own in an area of tough competition.  The course is in a less than salubrious area so perhaps that is why it is overlooked.  If I go back to the area and had time to play something other than Formby, West Lancs would be my first choice.  I am not sure its top 50 for mine, but perhaps not far off...I would need to see it again.   

Ciao

West Lancs is high on my hit list. There are a few 4-balls available for £160 on Mon 29th Dec if anyone fancies it.  IM me.

[Thomas Dai]

West Lancs is sneaky good...nobody talks about it.  I think it holds its own in an area of tough competition.  The course is in a less than salubrious area so perhaps that is why it is overlooked.  If I go back to the area and had time to play something other than Formby, West Lancs would be my first choice.  I am not sure its top 50 for mine, but perhaps not far off...I would need to see it again.   
Ciao

West Lancs is high on my hit list. There are a few 4-balls available for £160 on Mon 29th Dec if anyone fancies it.  IM me.

I know someone who played in final qualifying for The Open at West Lancs. Toughest course in Lancashire was his answer when asked what it was like.
Atb

[Sean_A]

Niall

I too would pick Burnside over Kintyre...not so sure about G #3.  I really like the course, but it doesn't take a lot of length to negate the strategy of the holes...this is definitely a course which has suffered for technology.  

Duncan - I would like to play West Lancs again, but the 29th doesn't work.  Maybe we can shoot for a Sunday sometime?  

I have only played the course coming/going to Scotland...its actually not far from the M6 because the M58 drops you nearby.  I have stayed away in recent years because of the high green fees.  The course is fairly flat and it does use trees for a few holes.  The few times I have seen the course it was flying fast...toast for fairways...very fine.

ATB - Yes, West Lancs is pretty tough.

Ciao

[Niall C]

Sean

That's an interesting comment about Gullane 3. Having played there literally dozens of times over the years, I've come to the conclusion that one of the beauties of No. 3 (apart from the turf and the simplicity of the design) is that it can turn round and bite you if you try to over power it. With a lot of the short par 4's easier to get out of position the closer you get, which can lead to some awkward chips over bunkers etc.

Niall

[Sean_A]

Niall

I know what you mean.  But man, so many of those greens are beautifully sited...no question for me #3 is the best designed course at Gullane.  Its seems a real shame to be approaching from well beyond the intended locations.  Gullane 3 is a rare course for me to say that.  I usually don't care at all about the tech effect and to be honest I think a lot of courses are more fun as shorter tests. 

Ciao

[Thomas Dai]

National Club Golfer has now just published it's listing of the 50 links courses that "narrowly missed out on a place in our Top 100".

Cunningly the 50 are listed in alphabetical order

Archerfield (Dirleton)
Borth & Ynyslas
Bude & N Cornwall
Carnoustie Budden
Castlerock
Cleveland
Connemara
Craigielaw
Cullen
Dingle
Dunaverty
Felixstowe Ferry
Fleetwood
Fortrose & Rosemarkie
Fraserburgh
Great Yarmouth & Caister
Gullane No 3
Hayling
Kilmarnock Barassie
Kilspindie
Laytown & Bettystown
Littlehampton
Monifieth
Moray (New)
Musselburgh Old
Nairn Dunbar
Narin & Portnoo
Newburgh-on-Ythan
North Wales
North West
Perranporth
Porthmadog
Prestatyn
Prestwick St Nicholas
Pwllheli
Reay
RCD-Annesley
Royal Portrush Valley
Royal Troon Portland
Saunton West
Seascale
Seaton Carew
Shiskine
St Andrews Eden
Strandhill
Tain
Traigh
Turnberry Kintyre
West Cornwall
West Kilbride

atb

[Paul Gray]

To be fair, if Littlehampton made it they were running out of names! I'm not really sure it can tecnhically be classed as links. At least half of the holes aren't. It's far from bad but........

[Jud_T]

Turnberry above TOC, Lahinch, Ballybunion and Prestwick?  Honestly I played the course in the biggest gale force winds of my life, but focusing strictly on the golf and ignoring the photo ops, would anyone here have it ranked above these courses?

[Tony_Muldoon]

Tomas

Have only played the following 9

Castlerock
Gullane No 3
Musselburgh Old
Narin & Portnoo
Royal Portrush Valley
Saunton West
Seascale
St Andrews Eden
West Cornwall

Would be happy to be a member at any of these courses and play them weekly.  I could easily see them in the lower half of the top 100. Not having played all the courses it would be hard to identify the 9 they replace but for starters….

6 Royal Birkdale     
11 Royal Lytham   
12 Waterville         
34 European Club     
61 Jubilee at StA       

93 Pyle & Kenfig




There’s golf and then there’s Links Golf.

[Tony_Muldoon]

Picked up a copy yesterday, Thomas you might have warned us it came with Photo's.  Some the horror ones were a real shock to the system and I've seen them in real life.

Crazy methodology. Editor brackets then in tiers and then considers arguments for moving up or down.  He apparenly had input form Jim Finegan who chooses Pennard as his one course for life and has been quoted it as Top 20 in the World and it remains in the third quartile.  one contributor had seen less than 30 of the courses?  Bit like a Dictator saying he's listened to the voice of the people.

A top 100 GB&I links ranking truly is hilarious. They would have done better to come up with a Top 50 ranking of unranked links.  

Mark why is it so funny?

Firstly having played 60 of the hot hundred and 9 of the next fifity I was strangely reassured that I'm not running out of new quality links experiences. If I've seen 69 in 14 years, and I want to spend part of my time and money revisting pretty much all of those, I figure I'll never get to see all 150. As Sean says theres a lot of quality out there.


Secondly I could no more rank my favourite music 1-100 if thats all the guidance I have.  Separate lists for top 150 Jazz, Rock, Folk and Opera tracks woud be much easier and to me more revealing.  Ranking Heathland, Parkland and Links courses together is not very interesting to me.

[Thomas Dai]

Picked up a copy yesterday, Thomas you might have warned us it came with Photo's.  Some the horror ones were a real shock to the system and I've seen them in real life.

Crazy methodology. Editor brackets then in tiers and then considers arguments for moving up or down.  He apparenly had input form Jim Finegan who chooses Pennard as his one course for life and has been quoted it as Top 20 in the World and it remains in the third quartile.  one contributor had seen less than 30 of the courses?  Bit like a Dictator saying he's listened to the voice of

Tony,

It was the methodology and the fact that posters herein participated in the process that caused me to highlight this magazines ranking, to try to understand ranking processes a bit more. Sean has kindly posted above, be interesting to hear from others involved.

Atb

[Jim McCann]

From a Scottish perspective, I'm a little surprised that Peterhead (Old) didn't make the also ran list of 50.

Then again, with so many golfers in the know now rushing past the town to play the Corbie Hill course at Fraserburgh, it's perhaps not that much of a shock to discover the delightful old Craigewan Links is being overlooked...

The underrated Struie course at Royal Dornoch is another very decent track that might have made the cut, as could the old Ben Sayers layout at Spey Bay.

And if Traigh and Musselburgh (Old) can make the "honourable mention chart" then a couple of other 9-hole courses across the Irish Sea are certainly worthy of inclusion in future links listings.

The Bann course at Castlerock in County Londonderry is a wonderful wee layout that's not short of admirers whilst the new 9-hole Kilmore course at Carne is, quite simply, destined for great things in years to come.

[Niall C]

National Club Golfer is a parochial rag at best, so let's cut them some slack.
However, some minor observations...
Skibo at 16 - Ha!
Nice to see Leven in there!
Despite being a decent enough golf course (albeit with some beyond ridiculous shaping and features), Archerfield Fidra is in no way, shape or form, a Links.
F.

Martin

Happy New Year to you and all that. A bit late I know but better late than never.

Now with regards National Golfer being a local mag, whats wrong with that ? After all, a lot of these lists, particularly the international lists are compiled by overseas visitors with limited experience of links, while the guys compiling this list presumably play a lot of links golf such that there default setting is for the ground game.

As for the Fidra, if Renaissance and Muirfield are links then surely Fidra is too ?

Niall

[Jon Wiggett]

National Club Golfer is a parochial rag at best, so let's cut them some slack.
However, some minor observations...
Skibo at 16 - Ha!
Nice to see Leven in there!
Despite being a decent enough golf course (albeit with some beyond ridiculous shaping and features), Archerfield Fidra is in no way, shape or form, a Links.
F.

Martin

Happy New Year to you and all that. A bit late I know but better late than never.

Now with regards National Golfer being a local mag, whats wrong with that ? After all, a lot of these lists, particularly the international lists are compiled by overseas visitors with limited experience of links, while the guys compiling this list presumably play a lot of links golf such that there default setting is for the ground game.

As for the Fidra, if Renaissance and Muirfield are links then surely Fidra is too ?

Niall

Niall,

not much doubt about Muirfield being a links but I very much doubt you could say that more than 4 or 5 holes at Renaissance are links so not a links course for me rather a course with a few links holes. Fidra, a links!!! your having a laugh surely

Jon

[Marty Bonnar]

Niall, glad to see you're feeling better! Have you seen or played Fidra or Dirleton? For starters, you can barely see/hear the sea from either. I'll post some photos for your elucidation!
Best,
F.
Oh and PS I didn't say local mag, I said parochial rag. World of difference!

[Mark Chaplin]

I hear through the grapevine West Lancs is in a poor state and has agronomical issues. Anyone played there recently?