Northern US courses: When do you aerify greens in the fall?

[Ian Mackenzie]

Am always curious when courses choose to aerify in the fall.
I mean "drill and fill" core aeration that can be invasive and comes with HEAVY sand filling and top dressing than can impede play afterwards. (For 7-14 days?)

Our course is in Chicago. We "punch" in mid/late April then again in first week of October.

What do you guys see out there? Is there merit in punching in August? Sure, I get it, the more the better, but it's just not possible. Yes, I imagine there are those courses that do it three times a season. That's great. Most courses simply cannot. Yes, I also know there are other things to do but for the context of this topic, I would like to focus on invasive aerification. Thanks.

Edit: I am also curious to hear when you punch your greens in the spring!

[Jason Topp]

Minnesota - 1st full week in August at our course.  Most are late August/early September. Courses used to punch after Labor Day but dates have moved earlier over the last ten years.  I think they want to make sure there is enough warmth at night to help grow in.

[Chris DeToro]

I'm in Rhode Island and we just aerated this past week.  I think most local courses have a similar schedule

[Brad Tufts]

At Tedesco CC here North of Boston...we aerify (big holes) the first Mon-Wed. in May, and the third Mon-Wed. in August.

The first one has always been standard, but the second one has moved around.  Our biggest Member-Guest is the first weekend in August each year, so it has happened directly after that some years.  We have tried doing it in late October before...but in bad winter years the holes were still visible in April, which is not what we want.

It's never great to have your course aerated when the weather is good and you want to play, but I think it's best when growing conditions are still good, thus providing quick recovery.  Usually both May (especially) and August aeration recovers well by 10 days, and back to perfect by 15.

[Wayne_Kozun]

In Toronto my club normally does the end of Aug or beginning of Sep.  Our super doesn't want to leave it too late as you still want it to be warm enough that you get decent growth.

But we are skipping this year - I think mainly due to not having decent greens until well into July due to ice damage of poa.

[Rob Marshall]

Started ours today

[Robert Emmons]

On Long island, we start ours today and will be closed for the week...RHE

[SL_Solow]

Not the super, as you know, but historically we do it the Tuesday after labor day.  this year a slight delay due to postponed team matches.  Our theory has been that the warm weather typical to early September promotes faster healing so that we have excellent conditions for the bulk of the fall seaon.

[Mark Johnson]

week after labor day (today and tomorrow) for us.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Thanks.
We were fortunate that our greens were not damaged by the brutal winter.

Would love to hear from more. When does your course punch their greens?

Any and all Green Keepers: what about punching in October? Late October? What about the "Graden"? Maximus Dry-Jecting? When is best time?

Thanks.

[PCCraig]

My home course here in St. Paul, MN just aerated the greens today. The course is then closed through noon on Thursday.

[Dan Kelly]

Midland Hills, Roseville, Minnesota:

Last week.

[BHoover]

My home course in central Ohio is aerating its fairways and greens in late September (week of 9/21).  The norm here in Ohio seems to be right after Labor Day, but there are plenty of exceptions to the rule.

[Dan Herrmann]

Was done on August 25 this year.  Major work is done in April with "big holes" and soil amendments brushed in by hand.

Old school, but, boy does it work great!

[Amol Yajnik]

2 of the munis in the Boston area that I played last week (George Wright and Brookline Municipal) had both aerated in the middle of August.  On the other hand, I played the Nicklaus course at Pinehills in Plymouth today and they had not aerated recently.

[Carl Nichols]

Not sure whether Bethesda (MD) counts as "Northern" for the question, but we also did it August 25.  The weather was great last week and the holes have been filling in really quickly.

[Dave McCollum]

We did ours last week (Idaho), using big tines.  We schedule it so that we have plenty of time to recover and to accommodate some fall tournaments.  We can get a fair amount of winter play and don’t want the holes when the grass is not growing.  Strangely, last October I was driving through the Tahoe area in late October when all of the courses were closing for the season.  The last thing they did before closing was punch their greens.  This seemed very strange to me.  I guessed that with no winter play and the risk of winter kill they felt it was better to put their greens to bed that way, leaving the recovery for spring.   Are there other reasons?

[Ian Mackenzie]

We did ours last week (Idaho), using big tines.  We schedule it so that we have plenty of time to recover and to accommodate some fall tournaments.  We can get a fair amount of winter play and don’t want the holes when the grass is not growing.  Strangely, last October I was driving through the Tahoe area in late October when all of the courses were closing for the season.  The last thing they did before closing was punch their greens.  This seemed very strange to me.  I guessed that with no winter play and the risk of winter kill they felt it was better to put their greens to bed that way, leaving the recovery for spring.   Are there other reasons?

Thanks, Dave.
My guess is that Tahoe courses do it that way to allow for some air and ventilation into the greens. It can be quite wet there in the winter and there will not be a full snow pack at those elevations. Very common for a high of 45-50 with rain at the base of the mountains.

You can also get 10' of snow in 3 days!

[Bill Brightly]

All of these people from the Northeast who that say their courses punch after Labor Day are doing it for one reason: their clubs won't let the Super do it when he really wants: mid-August!

Most courses are pulling cores and filling with bent, and mid-August is when bent has the best chance to out-compete the poa, which is under stress in the heat. We've been aerating in mid-August for ten years and have seen a slow and steady improvement each year.

It always bothers me when I play courses in April and can still the old holes from October which never quite recovered... The supers will still punch in October if that's the only time the club allows, but I think it is wrong.

[Dave McCollum]

Thanks Ian,

I was thinking the courses were at around 6,000 ft elevation.  Here in Idaho that's pretty high--high enough to get a boatload of snow.  Every decade or so the mountain courses get blasted by the perfect storm conditions for winter kill:  Snow/rain, warm cycle, cold spell, and the greens are covered in ice.  Then it snows and insulates the ice for longer periods than the fungicides prescribe.  The most effective prevention is to shovel off the snow, sometimes 8 to 10 feet, and break up the ice.  One clever super I know cleared the snow and used the aerator to break up the ice.  He came out of winter far better than the other mountain resorts who sent their grounds crew to run the lifts and work on the ski patrol.       

[RJ_Daley]

Aerator on ice sheets has been used here on thr frozen tundra for decsdes.

Timing and selection of solid or hollow tines is not set to specific weeks of the year if the super's have their way because the decicion should be specific to the conditions of compaction and root growth and thatch as it has developed that year.  If it has been a long hot summer, roots are in decline.  Disruption on fragile shallow roots in heat decline can open up pathways to all kinds of trouble.  The need to take care that a hard pan doesn't develop just at the depth the tines reach is a concern.  I've heard more sups favoring more frequent and varied depth solid tine in recent years.

[Anthony_Nysse]

Lot of northern clubs aerify late summer because they still have a higher number of staff and allows the turf to heal much quicker, as opposed to October when soil temps have dropped drastically.

[Jim_Coleman]

    We have double drilled and filled (with heavy sand) the last 6 early Novembers in Philadelphia.  I think it is a total disaster.  Mid May is a good recovery; mid June a bad one.  I hope this practice has now come to an end.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Thanks for the input, all; very helpful.
Cheers

[RJ_Daley]

Always good information available at MSU turf library and other sources.