[Tom_Doak]

... according to a chart in the latest GOLF Magazine [August 2014].  He's a very well-traveled guy.  I've only played 86 of them myself, but I've also seen eight of the ones I haven't played.

I am not surprised at the ones Mr. Player hasn't played ... which include Crystal Downs, Cape Kidnappers, Ballyneal and Old Macdonald.  We travel in different circles.

I was a little more surprised that the only other older courses he's missed are The Golf Club and Camargo. 

I was most surprised that he HAS played Pacific Dunes and Barnbougle Dunes, and nobody in either location ever mentioned it to me.

[Tim_Weiman]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs? Did Ben Crenshaw's praise for the course back in the 1990s encourage many to make the journey (aside from the tournament)?

[Tom_Doak]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs? Did Ben Crenshaw's praise for the course back in the 1990s encourage many to make the journey (aside from the tournament)?

Tim:

Not many, which is not that surprising.  It's a long detour from the PGA Tour.  A handful have made the trip; I'm not around enough these days to know for sure who all has been there, but I don't think it would include anyone in the top 20 players in the world today.

[J_ Crisham]

... according to a chart in the latest GOLF Magazine [August 2014].  He's a very well-traveled guy.  I've only played 86 of them myself, but I've also seen eight of the ones I haven't played.

I am not surprised at the ones Mr. Player hasn't played ... which include Crystal Downs, Cape Kidnappers, Ballyneal and Old Macdonald.  We travel in different circles.

I was a little more surprised that the only other older courses he's missed are The Golf Club and Camargo. 

I was most surprised that he HAS played Pacific Dunes and Barnbougle Dunes, and nobody in either location ever mentioned it to me.

Has he played Chicago Golf Club? Having played a few of his courses I would struggle to describe which if any Golden Age architect influenced him.

[Nigel Islam]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs? Did Ben Crenshaw's praise for the course back in the 1990s encourage many to make the journey (aside from the tournament)?

When I played there one of the caddies told us a story that Tiger wanted to play the course, but didn't as Crystal Downs would not shut down the course to the members while he was there.

[Michael Felton]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs? Did Ben Crenshaw's praise for the course back in the 1990s encourage many to make the journey (aside from the tournament)?

When I played there one of the caddies told us a story that Tiger wanted to play the course, but didn't as Crystal Downs would not shut down the course to the members while he was there.

That's ridiculous. I played golf with a guy on Cape Cod a couple of years ago who told me that he had played somewhere near Martha's Vineyard the previous year and the President was in the group behind him. The Secret Service had vetted them and okayed it, but if the President is happy to play on a course with the hoi polloi, then Tiger Woods should be too.

[jeffwarne]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs? Did Ben Crenshaw's praise for the course back in the 1990s encourage many to make the journey (aside from the tournament)?

When I played there one of the caddies told us a story that Tiger wanted to play the course, but didn't as Crystal Downs would not shut down the course to the members while he was there.

That's ridiculous. I played golf with a guy on Cape Cod a couple of years ago who told me that he had played somewhere near Martha's Vineyard the previous year and the President was in the group behind him. The Secret Service had vetted them and okayed it, but if the President is happy to play on a course with the hoi polloi, then Tiger Woods should be too.

I know some caddies selling oceanfront property in Arizona if you guys want to bite on some of that too....

[Nigel Islam]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs? Did Ben Crenshaw's praise for the course back in the 1990s encourage many to make the journey (aside from the tournament)?

When I played there one of the caddies told us a story that Tiger wanted to play the course, but didn't as Crystal Downs would not shut down the course to the members while he was there.

That's ridiculous. I played golf with a guy on Cape Cod a couple of years ago who told me that he had played somewhere near Martha's Vineyard the previous year and the President was in the group behind him. The Secret Service had vetted them and okayed it, but if the President is happy to play on a course with the hoi polloi, then Tiger Woods should be too.

I know some caddies selling oceanfront property in Arizona if you guys want to bite on some of that too....

I didn't say I believed him

[Jud_T]

GP has played 90 of the world's top 100.  Begs the obvious follow up question- so how come he still can't design his way out of a wet paper bag?  

The Tiger thing has to be BS.  He played my old club, with MJ no less, while the rest of us members went about our business and pretended not to stare.  

[Keith Grande]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs? Did Ben Crenshaw's praise for the course back in the 1990s encourage many to make the journey (aside from the tournament)?

When I played there one of the caddies told us a story that Tiger wanted to play the course, but didn't as Crystal Downs would not shut down the course to the members while he was there.

Mo' money, mo' problems... 

[Tom_Doak]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs?

When I played there one of the caddies told us a story that Tiger wanted to play the course, but didn't as Crystal Downs would not shut down the course to the members while he was there.

I didn't realize the kids caddying at the Downs were so creative.  I'll check with the professional, but I would put the odds of this being true at 100:1.  Crystal Downs would not shut down for anybody, but I can't imagine Tiger or anyone else insisting on it.

It IS true, however, that Stonewall nixed a visit by President Clinton [and then-Governor Tom Ridge] years ago, because the Secret Service said he'd need a cart, and Stonewall doesn't allow carts.

[Tim_Weiman]

I am pretty sure Ballybunion has never shut down the course when Bill Clinton, a member, has come to play, but the security approach has been to keep a tight lip on letting people know he is stopping by.

Crazy if Tiger really thought CD should shut down the course for him. Sounds like a troll job to me.

[Ulrich Mayring]

I bet most people, who have played 90 of the Top 100, can't design a lick. They should be able to recognize a great course, when they play it, but design one... different story.

Ulrich

[Mike_Clayton]

Tom

Gary Dixon tells me as far as he knows Gary has not played Barnbougle. He would know seeing he is there every day pretty much.

[Tom_Doak]

Gary Dixon tells me as far as he knows Gary has not played Barnbougle. He would know seeing he is there every day pretty much.

Mike:

I am not surprised by that.  When I met Mr. Player in Rio two years ago, he said he had not had the chance to play one of my courses yet.  I was going to be flattered if he had gone to play two of them in the interim, but I was also going to be very surprised.

[Paul Gray]

I bet most people, who have played 90 of the Top 100, can't design a lick. They should be able to recognize a great course, when they play it, but design one... different story.

Ulrich

Which, if I were a cynic, I'd suggest might also be the case for an old pro keen to attach himself to what he perceives to be a simple route to architectural kudos.

[Jaeger Kovich]

Tom, if he hasn't seen your best courses. Would that mean he likely hasn't seen a few of C and C's best either? I supposed it could be just a timing thing, but I cant imagine going to Taz or Bandon without teeing it up at the other, with the exception of a paid appearance/match. Were Bandon Trails or Last Farm checked?

I was reading Paddy Harrington's list a few weeks ago w Don... I think Paddy had 42, so I thought I had a chance to beat him but came up just shy (including walks), not bad considering he has 20ish years on me. Don got him by a few! (Actually, I may be past/tied since the last 2 weeks!)

[Steve Salmen]

This is just my opinion, but I don't think Tiger has any interest in playing Crystal Downs.  I've heard him say that he does not take golf vacations and does not play much recreation golf.  If memory serves, it had to do with Pine Valley.  He did not seem to have any interest in playing it and it's far easier to get to than Crystal.

[John McCarthy]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs?

On Tuesday when the Justice and Ian had us out to Beverly,  my caddy said the most famous person he saw on the course was President Obama.  He said they wanted a buffer around him and everyone got searched 2 or 3 times but the rest of the course was open (I am sure the extreme segregation of the nines at Beverly helped with security.)  Those that were there - was 87th and/or Western closed?

When I played there one of the caddies told us a story that Tiger wanted to play the course, but didn't as Crystal Downs would not shut down the course to the members while he was there.

[J_ Crisham]

Tom,

How many pros have played Crystal Downs?

On Tuesday when the Justice and Ian had us out to Beverly,  my caddy said the most famous person he saw on the course was President Obama.  He said they wanted a buffer around him and everyone got searched 2 or 3 times but the rest of the course was open (I am sure the extreme segregation of the nines at Beverly helped with security.)  Those that were there - was 87th and/or Western closed?

When I played there one of the caddies told us a story that Tiger wanted to play the course, but didn't as Crystal Downs would not shut down the course to the members while he was there.

John , When Obama played at Bev it was on Father's Day 2 years ago. There was very minimal disruption for anyone. There was a buffer zone of a couple holes . The only unusual happening was that the Secret Service did not allow him to go thru the tunnel under 87th St to the back nine. Also , none of our kids were allowed to caddy for him. Several of the kids had pictures taken with him. It was no big deal that he was at Bev. My sense is that it we would be the logical club for him to join after office- he has several close friends who are longtime members. As an aside, it was Andrew not Ian who cohosted your group onTuesday at Bev.

[John Cowden]

There's talk the prez may be house-hunting around Palm Springs.  I'd like to see him join Stone Eagle-- as a second course, of course, because his three girls deserve a real country club.  If the Koch brothers are safe there, he will be, too. 

On second thought...

[Ryan Coles]

Player doesn't let the truth get in the way of a good story/sound bite.

He is prone to exaggeration. Peter Allis once said that every time he met him, he'd managed too add another 10 career wins.

Then there was the time he waxing lyrical that about how many miles he'd flown in his life. Someone worked it out and he'd have to be up there for 180 years continuously.

He's also done more sit ups than anyone, never eaten bacon and regularly beats Usain Bolt when jogging to the shop to pick up a paper.

[Niall C]

I've told this story before on here but a few years ago GP was playing in a Seniors comp on one of the great links courses. Before the comp he joined a couple of Scottish pro's playing a practice round and all the way round the course he bitched about the blindness, the rough, the positioning of the bunkers, the greens, just about everything he could think of. At the end of the round he bid farewell to his playing companions and as he walked off the last green he spied members of the host club committee standing with R&A types. GP rushed straight over and the two Scottish pro's who'd just spent 4 hours listening to his moaning were astonished to overhear GP give the most fulsome praise of the course to this group of the great and the good.

As one of the Scottish pro's later put it, what a two-faced lying b*stard.

Niall

[Sean_A]

I've told this story before on here but a few years ago GP was playing in a Seniors comp on one of the great links courses. Before the comp he joined a couple of Scottish pro's playing a practice round and all the way round the course he bitched about the blindness, the rough, the positioning of the bunkers, the greens, just about everything he could think of. At the end of the round he bid farewell to his playing companions and as he walked off the last green he spied members of the host club committee standing with R&A types. GP rushed straight over and the two Scottish pro's who'd just spent 4 hours listening to his moaning were astonished to overhear GP give the most fulsome praise of the course to this group of the great and the good.

As one of the Scottish pro's later put it, what a two-faced lying b*stard.

Niall

Hang on, Player may have been talking in a general context about the course being good/great, but that there were things he didn't like.  He happens all the time around here and sometimes people forget that often, the quality of the course is a given, more or less.  We are just talking about the pros and cons within that context.

Ciao

[Adrian_Stiff]

I lost a lot of respect (but not all) for Mr Gary Player when he commented that I cant hit a 3 iron as straight as him when referencing that makes pro's better golf course designers than non pro's. Anyway I reckon a can draw a straighter line with a pencil than he can hit a 3 iron.

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