The strangest European Golf Course Ranking of all Time?

[Ruediger Meyer]

A german golf magazine called "Golf Journal" just released their 100 best courses of Europe (non-private clubs). Basis is their own course ranking system which is strange to begin with and accounts for difficulty, conditioning, design, setting and quality of service (!). The results are mindblowing and I thought you might get a good chuckle (and a confirmation that we germans don't know anything about golf architecture)

1. Royal County Down 169,4
2. Turnberry Ailsa 167,0
3. Royal Dornoch 165,4
4. Portmarnock 165,0
5. Royal Portrush 164,8
6. Ballybunion Old 163,7
7. Bro Hof Slott 162,9
8. Royal Birkdale 160,7
9. Woodhall Spa 159,1
10. Sunningdale New 157,0
11. Royal Troon 156,9
12. Muirfield 156,8
13. Trump International Golf Links 155,5
14. Carnoustie 154,9
15. Kingsbarns 154,8
16. Lahinch Old 154,6
17. Ganton 154,4
18. Valderrama 154,2
19. Royal Aberdeen 152,8
20. Sunningdale Old 152,6
20. Wentworth West 152,6
22. Waterville 152,3
23. Gleneagles King's 152,1
24. Adamstal 150,9
24. Noorwijkse 150,9
26. Kennemer 150,8
27. PGA Catalunya 150,6
28. Winston Links 150,5
29. Thracian Cliffs 150,2
30. St. Andrews Old 150,0
31. North Berwick 148,9
32. Hamburg Falkenstein 148,2
33. Castle Stuart 148,1
34. Swinley Forest 146,9
35. Sporting Club Berlin Faldo 146,6
36. Cruden Bay 146,5
37. Royal Zoute 146,2
37. Walton heath Old 146,2
39. Halmstad GK 146,1
40. Old Head 145,1
41. Prestwick 144,7
42. Royal Porthcawl 144,6
42. Royal St. George's 144,6
44. Druids Glen 144,5
45. Royal St. David's 144,2
46. Finca de Cortesin 144,0
47. Celtic Manor 2010 143,9
48. St. george's Hill 143,0
49. Rosapenna 142,8
50. Western Gailes 142,7
51. St. Enodoc 142,5
51. Machrihanish 142,5
53. Falsterbo 142,4
53. The Scandinavian Old 142,4
55. Lough Erne Faldo 142,3
55. Royal Cinque Ports 142,3
55. Royal Liverpool 142,3
58. Royal Park I Roveri 142,2
59. Oitavos Dunes 142,0
60. Ballyliffin 141,9
61. Sotogrande 141,6
62. The European Club 141,4
63. Monte Rei 141,3
64. Castelfalfi 140,9
65. Tralee 140,8
66. Trevose 140,7
67. Barsebäck 140,6
68. San Roque 140,5
69. Bokskogens 140,4
70. Adare 140,3
71. Kempferhof 140,2
71. Terre Blanche 140,2
73. Troia 140,1
74. Antalya Sultan 140,0
74. Circolo Golf Torino 140,0
76. Le Golf National 139,9
77. Budersand 138,6
78. Golf de Sperone 138,5
78. The Grpve 138,5
80. Royal Lytham 138,4
81. Nairn 138,3
82. Haagsche 138,2
83. Saunton East 138,0
84. PGA National Sweden Lakes 137,9
84. Portstewart 137,9
86. Royal West Norfolk 137,8
87. Vale do Lobo 137,7
88. Chantilly 137,4
89. San Roque Old 137,3
90. St. Loen-Rot 137,2
91. Formby 137,1
91. West Sussex 137,1
93. Lübker Golf 137,0
94. San Lorenzo 136,9
95. The Berkshire 136,8
96. Modry Las 136,7
96. Rye Old 136,7
98. GC Biella 136,6
99. Green Eagle North 136,5
100. Castelconturbia 136,4

[David Davis]

Rudy, thanks for posting. It gets a bit strange with Bro Hof up at the top. While it's fun to see my home club up high I'm afraid that's also not realistic given the company.

However, it also depends on how high of a factor difficulty plays into the role. If that's worth 25-40% for the Germans ranking then why not.

What's also weird is that Falkenstein is not the highest German course.

[Tom_Doak]

What is Adamstal? 

[Besides, obviously, an advertiser in this magazine.]

[Mike Nuzzo]

Maybe they didn't like the changes to The Old Course?
#savetheoldcourse

[Jud_T]

What is Adamstal? 

[Besides, obviously, an advertiser in this magazine.]

A line item tax write-off for the 2nd revision of the forthcoming CG? 

[Adam Lawrence]

Adamstal is a course in Austria designed by Irish-based, Canadian-born architect Jeff Howes.

[Bob_Huntley]

A german golf magazine called "Golf Journal" just released their 100 best courses of Europe (non-private clubs). Basis is their own course ranking system which is strange to begin with and accounts for difficulty, conditioning, design, setting and quality of service (!). The results are mindblowing and I thought you might get a good chuckle (and a confirmation that we germans don't know anything about golf architecture)

What is your definition of non private?

Bob

[Ruediger Meyer]

Bob, they said they included only course that allow public play.

David, if I understood the formula correctly, difficulty makes up almost 30% of the grade. Add 17% of the rating for service (they define it as practice facilities and, I kid you not, availabilty of carts and ball washers) and you can see why this rating is so silly

[Tom_Doak]

Bob, they said they included only course that allow public play.

David, if I understood the formula correctly, difficulty makes up almost 30% of the grade. Add 17% of the rating for service (they define it as practice facilities and, I kid you not, availabilty of carts and ball washers) and you can see why this rating is so silly

The Old Course probably lost a few points on the availability of carts.

[Niall C]

Ruediger

Many thanks for posting that. Frankly I haven't played nearly enough on the continent or indeed outwith Spain and Portugal to comment on the non-UK courses listed however I think looking at things from a German/European perspective is no bad thing as I suspect the traditional rankings have a UK bias and have become self-perpetuating in some instances. Always good to look at things from a different perspective to make you think.

Niall

[Tom_Doak]

What is Adamstal? 

[Besides, obviously, an advertiser in this magazine.]

A line item tax write-off for the 2nd revision of the forthcoming CG? 

Well, so is every course now.    The question is, why that one?

[Ally Mcintosh]

What is Adamstal? 

[Besides, obviously, an advertiser in this magazine.]

A line item tax write-off for the 2nd revision of the forthcoming CG? 

Well, so is every course now.    The question is, why that one?

Adamstal is a wonderfully scenic, mountain design. I suspect that gets it recognised alone. I can't comment on the overall quality other than a guess based on knowing a lot of other work by the architect.

Have to say, don't see anything wrong with the top 6. (Insert wink emoticon)

[Mike_Clayton]

No Morfontaine, Fontainbleau??

[Adam Lawrence]

Morfontaine is probably excluded because it doesn't take public play.

[Tony_Muldoon]

Perhaps our German friends can comment but...this list seems biased towards Ireland with 4 of the top 6? I know Ireland gets a lot of German tourists but that's quite a result.  I think England comes out pretty well overall, even if the SE links rankings are too low.  Generalising it's Scottish courses that overall seem to be a bit low ?

I'd love to play more continental courses but also loving cities and history, golf takes a back seat in my travels.


PS one of the fun things at the Renaisance Cup was listening to a well travelled Frenchman telling me why he loved playing Portmarnock best of all.

[Jim McCann]

Ruediger:

Some might consider it a very brave/foolish move to attempt to combine continental European and GB&I golf course charts.

I’m not interested in the position of the courses in relation to each other but I’ve had a closer look at the “mainstream”
European element of the list (comprising 43 layouts) and found that there were eight surprise inclusions for me:

64 Castelfalfi
68 San Roque (New?)
69 Bokskogens
87 Vale do lobo
89 San Roque (Old)
90 St Leon-Rot
96 Modry Las
99 GreenEagle (North)

An eyebrow could be raised at the appearance of these courses in the lower reaches of the list but the exclusion from the chart
of courses like Lykia, Visby and El Saler might be of greater concern.

[Mike_Clayton]

Adam

No Morfontaine - but Swinley is in and it's hardly public.

[Ally Mcintosh]

PS one of the fun things at the Renaisance Cup was listening to a well travelled Frenchman telling me why he loved playing Portmarnock best of all.

You tease, Tony

[Mike_Clayton]

Brian,

I assumed that too. I did knock on the secretaries door a few years ago and asked 'if it would be a problem if I walked the course'
'Why would that be a problem? - I'll let them know you're out there so they don't annoy you'

It doesn't get any friendlier than that.

[Ruediger Meyer]

Ruediger:

Some might consider it a very brave/foolish move to attempt to combine continental European and GB&I golf course charts.

I’m not interested in the position of the courses in relation to each other but I’ve had a closer look at the “mainstream”
European element of the list (comprising 43 layouts) and found that there were eight surprise inclusions for me:

99 GreenEagle (North)

An eyebrow could be raised at the appearance of these courses in the lower reaches of the list but the exclusion from the chart
of courses like Lykia, Visby and El Saler might be of greater concern.

Jim, I'm pretty sure Green Eagle got in because of its difficulty. It is one of the longest courses in Europe and quite frankly it is horrendous. They had the Challenge Tour there and had to use the forward tees at a few holes because against the wind it was deemed too difficult for the pros if I remember correctly. I myself found it an absolute terrible layout and I haven't talked to anyone who liked it with a few suggesting it was one of the worst layouts they played so far.

I can't comment on the GB/I courses with authority, but judging from the german courses in the list I am dumbfounded. Winston Links did A LOT of advertising in every german golf magazine so that might explain the high ranking a bit. St. Leon-Rot and Sporting Club Berlin are difficult and get a boost for having been the venue of the BMW Open and German Open (yes, they gave bonus points for being a tournament venue). I honestly can't say with a clear conscience that besides Falkenstein and Budersand any german course deserves to be included in such a ranking. Maybe Club zur Vahr if they'd clean out some of the trees, but I am biased towards that course because it is so close to home.

[Ulrich Mayring]

Hubbelrath (near Düsseldorf) is deserving.

Ulrich

[Niall C]

Ruediger:

Some might consider it a very brave/foolish move to attempt to combine continental European and GB&I golf course charts.

I’m not interested in the position of the courses in relation to each other but I’ve had a closer look at the “mainstream”
European element of the list (comprising 43 layouts) and found that there were eight surprise inclusions for me:

64 Castelfalfi
68 San Roque (New?)
69 Bokskogens
87 Vale do lobo
89 San Roque (Old)
90 St Leon-Rot
96 Modry Las
99 GreenEagle (North)

An eyebrow could be raised at the appearance of these courses in the lower reaches of the list but the exclusion from the chart
of courses like Lykia, Visby and El Saler might be of greater concern.

Jim

I've played both the San Roque courses, the Old quite a few times and the New for the first time last year. I think I'm right in saying the Old is a Dave Thomas design (?) which I quite enjoy with only one hole verging on Mickey Mouse. Not earth shattering but solid none the less. The New is altogether a different proposition as its designed on a much tighter site with probable constraint of having to retain a number of olive trees that impinge on the layout. For instance being blocked out with your approach shot even though you are on the fairway. Not one for this DG I suspect although I quite enjoyed it with a lot of good things going on in terms of green complexes. One negative was that there was a tendency to situate a rock or a bush or a tree at the lowest point of run off and collection areas around greens which became very annoying very quickly. Rather than an interesting and challenging chip you had a hack out. A Perry Dye design I think.

Now as I said before I haven't played enough on the continent to say how these courses shape up to others but two of the better ones on the Costa Del Sol which admittedly isn't saying a lot.

Niall

[Jim McCann]

Niall:

I note your comments on the San Roque courses and I'm sure they're both very fine layouts.

Nevertheless, I'd have thought the likes of La Reserva, Las Brisas and Real Sevilla were better placed to make a European Top 100 than either
of the two San Roques.

I've never played in that part of the world myself; all my Spanish golf games have taken place in the Canary Islands.

I would like to play some of the classic old tracks in Madrid sometime, right enough...

 

[Adrian_Stiff]

Ruediger:

Some might consider it a very brave/foolish move to attempt to combine continental European and GB&I golf course charts.

I’m not interested in the position of the courses in relation to each other but I’ve had a closer look at the “mainstream”
European element of the list (comprising 43 layouts) and found that there were eight surprise inclusions for me:

64 Castelfalfi
68 San Roque (New?)
69 Bokskogens
87 Vale do lobo
89 San Roque (Old)
90 St Leon-Rot
96 Modry Las
99 GreenEagle (North)

An eyebrow could be raised at the appearance of these courses in the lower reaches of the list but the exclusion from the chart
of courses like Lykia, Visby and El Saler might be of greater concern.

San Roque (new) I think is really nice, cant find much love for the old San Roque, Vale da Lobo has a couple of good holes but  unless you are factoring in the sun neither these would not make the GB & Ire top 300 IMO. Others I don't know.

[Gary Slatter]

It's interesting.  The Old Course rangers are not too friendly to German golfers, and service is self-service.
I would think Ville D'Este would make their top 100.

We had a group from Hamburg playing the Torrance a few years ago.  Our starter was having trouble getting them from the range to the first tee and was frustrated, and called me on the radio.  As I arrived their conversation was something like:
 German guest:  You should come to Germany sometime to see how polite our golf staff are.   have you ever been to Germany.
Starter Bob:  Please tee off, the last group is 300 metres away.  no I've never been to Germany.  My father and uncle used to go often.
Guest:   Did they like Germany
Bob:  I don't know, they only went at night.