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Michael Wharton-Palmer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« on: June 09, 2014, 02:39:55 PM »
Fot those that have had the pleasure of playing both, which one would you choose to play?
thanks

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2014, 02:48:56 PM »
Michael:

Most people will prefer the scenery and fun of the older course, because the Craighead is pretty testing, especially around the greens.  But you're a really good player, so I'd guess you would prefer Craighead.

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2014, 02:51:38 PM »
MWP,

Test yourself on the Craighead AM, a good lunch and then walk it off playing the Balcomie.

Rich Goodale

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2014, 03:47:32 PM »
Scott's answer is the best if you have to play at Crail, but I'd play Elie and/or Leven instead.
Life is good.

Any afterlife is unlikely and/or dodgy.

Jean-Paul Parodi

Michael Wharton-Palmer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2014, 03:53:14 PM »
Any disagreements with Rich's comments here on course choice?

Mac Plumart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2014, 03:55:02 PM »
Michael,

I'm no expert and have only played Crail Bailcomie.  But it remains one of the most memorable rounds of golf in my life.
Sportsman/Adventure loving golfer.

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2014, 04:41:42 PM »
MWP,

Test yourself on the Craighead AM, a good lunch and then walk it off playing the Balcomie.

That's what I did my first day ever in Scotland and it was a great day.  Two very different courses.

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2014, 06:02:18 PM »
As a member of both Crail and Elie I agree with both Tom D and Rich G.  I would say, however, that the more I play Craighead the more it has grown on me.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Ben Voelker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2014, 06:45:46 PM »
Of the "second tier" links in Fife (excluding St. Andrew's) I would go:

1. Elie
2. Crail Craighead
3. Crail Balcomie
4. Leven
5. Lundin

Elie is one of the best experiences I have ever had on a golf course. Great scenery and great variety, especially for 16 par 4's.

I thought Craighead and Balcomie were very close with similar amounts of quirk and each with a couple of mundane holes.  I would go with a bit more challenge on Craighead versus the history of Balcomie.

I would suggest, if you have an extra hour early or late in the day, to stop by the nearby 9 holer in Anstruther.  Its another quirky course with one of the hardest par 3'ds around.

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2014, 01:40:44 AM »
It is worth pointing out that Craighead isn't a links course.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2014, 07:55:18 AM »
Michael

Comparing Balcomie and Craighead is an apples and oranges thing. Balcomie has a lot of old fashioned things going on such as uphill par 3's, blind shots, 90 degree dog-legs etc whereas Craighead is a nice conventional modern course with a few better than average holes.

Personally I could go for either depending on the mood.

Include Elie in the options and I'd probably go there, mainly because I've only played it once before and I'd like to play it again. From what I recall it's less quirky than Balcomie but of similar quality.

Niall

Ed Brzezowski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2014, 10:45:58 AM »
I agree with Scott, do a double at Crail. Played them all and then joined Crail, Balcomie is just a boatload of fun. The folks are great, the food is good and you cannot touch the view from the bar. A very special place.

ed
We have a pool and a pond, the pond would be good for you.

Alex Miller

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #12 on: June 10, 2014, 10:59:10 AM »
Craighead is a very good course that does a nice job of seeming like it's much older in spots, but if you're playing one round at Crail, Balcomie is the one to see. The routing is very impressive, and while the greens aren't much to look at from afar, I really enjoyed their subtlety and how the course played overall.


We played Craighead as our first round in Scotland, and it was a nice transition from more traditional courses in the US that we were used to, but later played a day of Balcomie + Elie that was one of the best days of golf EVER. If you can do that 36, do not stop, do not pass go, spend that $200 (or whatever it is, probably less).  ;)

David Lott

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2014, 10:53:23 PM »
It is worth pointing out that Craighead isn't a links course.

Nor is Balcombie, for that matter. But it's a wonderful round of golf.
David Lott

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2014, 11:08:32 PM »
They are really a pretty close grouping.  If you looked them up in The Confidential Guide [when it's ready], these are the ratings from the four of us [me, Ran, Masa, Darius]:

Crail Balcomie 5 - - 5
Crail Craighead 5 6 5 5
Elie 6 6 5 5
Leven 4 - 4 4
Lundin Links 5 6 3 5

My review of Elie:

This lovely old links was James Braid's boyhood home.  Many holes play on a long slope toward the sea, and many visitors are hapless at figuring out how to play approach shots to greens that run away from them.  The par-4 13th and the downhill par-3 3rd are the best holes, but the most memorable is the opening tee shot, played blind over a ridge from beside the clubhouse after obtaining clearance from the starter, who consults a submarine periscope to check on the group ahead.  With so few severe hazards in your way, you will probably scratch your head why you aren't scoring better, but par-4's are the hardest holes to score on, and Elie has sixteen of them!

P.S.  Ran does not ALWAYS give the highest grade of the four of us, but I think he does the most frequently.


Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2014, 02:01:58 AM »
Tom

I am holding out for Elie being the superior course of those minus Craighead because I wasn't impressed by the other courses.  Well, not impressed enough to skip the New or try another Links Trust links.  Different part of the world but as a marker, I preferred Gullane 3 to Crail, Leven or Lundin!

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Jim Nugent

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2014, 02:07:28 AM »
They are really a pretty close grouping.  If you looked them up in The Confidential Guide [when it's ready], these are the ratings from the four of us [me, Ran, Masa, Darius]:

Lundin Links 5 6 3 5


Does is surprise anyone to see such a big spread of opinion, as in Lundin Links above?  Ran rates it 6, where Masa rates it 3. 

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2014, 02:08:56 AM »
Curious.  I have yet to play either but I thought the recieved view  held Lundin over Leven without there being that much in it?   Tom's mates ( ;)) seem to STRONGLY agree and yet several posters above vote the other way round.  Is there that much difference to confidently say why you prefer one over the other to be worth at least a point on the DS, or does it just come down to personal preference?
Let's make GCA grate again!

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2014, 04:25:57 AM »
It is worth pointing out that Craighead isn't a links course.

Nor is Balcombie, for that matter. But it's a wonderful round of golf.

Not sure why you think that, David.

For certain, the new holes around 5th and 6th that were built in the early 90's using arable land. And I'm sure there are a couple of other areas (9th green up the 10th, maybe 18th green area) that were built on less than ideal soil... But the main plain that Balcomie is built on is pure links land I would have thought... It would have seemed strange for Old Tom to pick anything but in the 1890's....

I have a soft spot for the course... I think it is tremendous fun with some great holes such as the 2nd and some really cool greens such as the 8th.... I wouldn't miss it... A 36 hole couple of days at Balcomie, Elie, Lundin & Leven would be an excellent agenda...

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2014, 08:12:52 AM »
While risking the wrath of Old Melvyn  ;D I'm not sure that the present layout is entirely his as I think the pro AH Scott had a hand in rejigging the layout in the 1890's. I suspect I shall shortly get an email to put me right.

Niall

JBovay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2014, 10:32:54 AM »
Niall,

I had the pleasure of playing Balcomie three weeks ago, and later stopped by the restaurant and found a very interesting series of routing maps in a single frame showing how the course has changed since it was built. From 1907 to 1994, the routing was almost identical to the present course [except for the new section on 5 and 6, and a par 3 removed to compensate]. Before that, there were a couple of different 18 hole layouts. As I recall (but I did not get any photos, regrettably), the first had many of the holes playing in the reverse direction from today and rather than 5 parallel fairways, that section of the course had several much shorter holes and no more than 2 parallel fairways at any point. The second 18-hole routing did something similar, but with the present direction of holes.

This made me wonder whether OTM had much to do with the present course. Would he have redone his course twice within less than a decade?

It would be cool if someone could post an image of this series of maps.

In regards to the original post, Balcomie is the only of the "second tier" Fife courses outside of St. Andrews that I've played. I had a great experience, expecting a nice warm-up for my rounds on tougher courses later in the week, but finding stirring scenery and an incredibly difficult course for one at 5800 yards. When you arrive at the parking lot for the first time, you'll see how much the satellite images fail to capture what's on the ground. I'll be posting a full writeup with several photos sometime this month or next.

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #21 on: June 13, 2014, 11:53:02 AM »
JB

Excellent stuff. On the number of times I've been in the clubhouse I've never seen any plans so it would be good to see that. Perhaps Mark P would be able to take a picture next time he's there. Anyway, look forward to the tour.

Niall

Alex Miller

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #22 on: June 13, 2014, 12:04:55 PM »
They are really a pretty close grouping.  If you looked them up in The Confidential Guide [when it's ready], these are the ratings from the four of us [me, Ran, Masa, Darius]:

Crail Balcomie 5 - - 5
Crail Craighead 5 6 5 5
Elie 6 6 5 5
Leven 4 - 4 4
Lundin Links 5 6 3 5

My review of Elie:

This lovely old links was James Braid's boyhood home.  Many holes play on a long slope toward the sea, and many visitors are hapless at figuring out how to play approach shots to greens that run away from them.  The par-4 13th and the downhill par-3 3rd are the best holes, but the most memorable is the opening tee shot, played blind over a ridge from beside the clubhouse after obtaining clearance from the starter, who consults a submarine periscope to check on the group ahead.  With so few severe hazards in your way, you will probably scratch your head why you aren't scoring better, but par-4's are the hardest holes to score on, and Elie has sixteen of them!

P.S.  Ran does not ALWAYS give the highest grade of the four of us, but I think he does the most frequently.



Man I clearly need to be a harsher critic... or understand the Doak scale better  :D.

My ratings:
Crail Balcomie 6
Crail Craighead 5
Elie 7
Leven 5

I think I probably factor charm & adventure of playing these courses a bit more. Elie being an adventure and Balcomie having immense charm (at least for my group, which incidentally was 3 scratch players who did not break par.)

Rich Goodale

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #23 on: June 13, 2014, 12:10:13 PM »
They are really a pretty close grouping.  If you looked them up in The Confidential Guide [when it's ready], these are the ratings from the four of us [me, Ran, Masa, Darius]:

Crail Balcomie 5 - - 5
Crail Craighead 5 6 5 5
Elie 6 6 5 5
Leven 4 - 4 4
Lundin Links 5 6 3 5

My review of Elie:

This lovely old links was James Braid's boyhood home.  Many holes play on a long slope toward the sea, and many visitors are hapless at figuring out how to play approach shots to greens that run away from them.  The par-4 13th and the downhill par-3 3rd are the best holes, but the most memorable is the opening tee shot, played blind over a ridge from beside the clubhouse after obtaining clearance from the starter, who consults a submarine periscope to check on the group ahead.  With so few severe hazards in your way, you will probably scratch your head why you aren't scoring better, but par-4's are the hardest holes to score on, and Elie has sixteen of them!

P.S.  Ran does not ALWAYS give the highest grade of the four of us, but I think he does the most frequently.



Tom

I'm a bit shocked by these rankings.  I've played all of the 5 courses, and I would give them relative rankings of:

1.  Elie
2.  Leven
3.  Craighead
4.  Balcomie
5.  Lundin

My reasons?

Elie--it's the Myopia of Scotland--a bit goofy here and there but mostly solid and occasionally fantastic golf, and looked after by the members with great TLC
Leven--the poor man's Elie
Craighead--a goofy routing with far too many shots over dry stane dykes, but ameliorated with the modern touch of Gil Hanse
Balcomie--great fun, great views, but relatively unchallenging without a significant wind
Lundin--highly overrated.  I've played it many more times thabn the other 4, but it is a course without a soul and it's appeal to me gradually decreases every time I play it.
Life is good.

Any afterlife is unlikely and/or dodgy.

Jean-Paul Parodi

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Balcombie Links or Craighead Links
« Reply #24 on: June 13, 2014, 07:13:37 PM »
It is worth pointing out that Craighead isn't a links course.

Nor is Balcombie, for that matter. But it's a wonderful round of golf.
David,

The new holes (5 and 6) are on arable land but for the most part Balcomie most certainly is a links.  Why do you say otherwise?
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.