[Scott Warren]

Tom had this to say earlier in another thread:

when you are doing routings, every hole affects at least two others.

The interesting thing about your example [Bethpage Black 4th] is, it's possible you have the Butterfly Effect backwards.  The 4th hole is so counter-intuitive, that I would be surprised if it was one of the first holes Tillinghast decided on.  He might well have decided the 5th was a great hole, so he had to get up the hill on #4 in order to use it. 

There is a process to this that most people cannot appreciate, that's why I'm going to try to write a book about it.  I suspect you'd be surprised which holes I designed different courses around.

Made me wonder which holes on the Renaissance Golf Design courses I've played came to be as a way of facilitating the holes Tom really wanted to include.

Here's a stab:
Renaissance Club (original)
The par three 13th felt to me like a hole that primarily served to get you from the fantastic skyline green at 12 to the far end of the property for the run home.

On the front nine, the 7th stands out in my memory as comfortably the most severe dogleg I have seen from Tom - which makes me wonder if it was built more out of necessity than outright desire. And it gets you to the best hole on the course with a fun drive and exacting approach, so it does that well.

7th hole: Greenside bunker visible in the RHS of the pic through the trees.


13th hole:


St Andrews Beach
I know Tom has said this was among the best properties his team has had to work with, so maybe there are no connectors out there! But I'm inclined to suggest the par three 16th as a hole that seems a bit jammed in to make the course 18 holes, because you could fairly easily have walked from 15 green to 17 tee, and there doesn't feel like another place where you could have fit another hole in, other than maybe a short par three between 2 and 3.

Kyle Henderson golf porn of the 16th hole at StAB below:


Barnbougle Dunes
Another par three, and again the 16th hole. I wonder if the 16th doesn't just fill one of the 18 spots and get you between a great greensite at theshort par four 15th and a fantastic teeing ground for the 17th.

The 16th at Barnbougle Dunes, courtesy Bryan Izatt:


Ballyneal
Perhaps the 5th? I have more plays at Ballyneal than any of the others above, so maybe with more plays the perceived purpose of every hole is stronger. But the 5th is the one hole I can think of out there that appears to rely more on smart man-made features than natural landforms. And if it is one, it's a hell of an achievement IMO, because it's my favourite par three on the course.

It's positioning gets you from the great benched 4th green to a great angle and distance from which to approach the site of the 6th green, which in turn allows the 7th hole to exist.

Another of Kyle's pics below of the 5th at Ballyneal.


I'm interested to hear what others think, and of course to be marked by Tom if he sees the thread and feels like chiming in.

[Matt MacIver]

The long par 5s at Pacific Dunes on relatively flat land, to get you to the ocean, #s 3 and 13?

Or the quickly land of #6 and 16 where something had to go?

[Matthew Mollica]

Interesting thread Scott. I look forward to Tom's thoughts. I imagine it is indeed hard to tell which holes are the connectors on some of Tom's courses, with the land being so good for much of the properties, and for his ability to create fun strategic holes anywhere.

St Andrews Beach #5 ?

It would seem to have less bells and whistles than most on the property, on the surface occupies less remarkable land thn much of the course, and facilitates the journey from the stretch of 2 and 3, to the holes which feed off and to the wooded rise, which is incorporated within each hole during the middle third of the round.

MM

[Scott Weersing]

This has been discussed before.

For example, there are some who believe that there are two connector holes at Pacific Dunes. What? How could there be connector holes on one of the best courses in the USA?

But some believe no. 12 and no. 15 are connector holes because they are side by side and connect to the great holes on no. 13 and no. 14.

[Mark_F]

St Andrews Beach
I know Tom has said this was among the best properties his team has had to work with, so maybe there are no connectors out there! But I'm inclined to suggest the par three 16th as a hole that seems a bit jammed in to make the course 18 holes, because you could fairly easily have walked from 15 green to 17 tee, and there doesn't feel like another place where you could have fit another hole in, other than maybe a short par three between 2 and 3.

That's not the reason for the existence of 16, Scott.   You originally went from 15 to the would-be 16th of the Fingal course.  When they expanded to 36 holes, they needed to add 16.

7 is the connector hole at St Andrews Beach.

St Andrews Beach #5 ?

It would seem to have less bells and whistles than most on the property, on the surface occupies less remarkable land thn much of the course, and facilitates the journey from the stretch of 2 and 3, to the holes which feed off and to the wooded rise, which is incorporated within each hole during the middle third of the round.

I'm not sure of your logic here at all, MM.

[Tom_Doak]

Scott:

I am going through all my courses with my interns one at a time, to try and reproduce the process that led to the final plan.  I don't want to get ahead of myself too far, and I don't want to spoil the book, so I won't go through all of my courses now.

Labeling some holes as "connectors" is not quite fair to them ... it is rare that you have two holes you won't budge on, and are stuck using one other hole to bridge the gap.  I prefer to think of it that there are some holes I found earlier in the routing, and some I didn't find until I needed to, and those are often the best surprises.

Short answers for your guesses:

The Renaissance Club:  not even close.  We actually thought the 13th would be one of the best holes, once we cleared out all the trees up there; the 12th was blind luck really because the trees were so thick and we just didn't know what we were going to get.  It turned out so well, that's the one hole I hated to give up to make the new plan work.

St. Andrews Beach:  The 15th and 16th were some of the few holes not in my original 27-hole plan, so I guess they're connectors of sorts.

Barnbougle:  Yes, 16 is a connector, due to re-routing the back nine quickly.  [That hole was actually Mike Keiser's suggestion after I walked him back to 17 tee.]  But other holes that came later in the process included 4, 7, and 12.

Ballyneal:  We moved the 5th green and 6th tee during construction, to make the connection between holes better.


Tell you what, I'll post ALL the process for one course when I'm happy with our format.  But it won't be for a couple of months; I've got a ton of traveling to do between now and then.

[Niall C]

Scott

I can only comment on the Renaissance Course as that's the only one of Tom's I've played but for my money, the two holes you highlight are two holes that are both memorable and fun to play. Neither seems forced or just there to join the dots. Specifically as to your comment on the 7th being a severe angle for the dog-leg, I think it maybe feels like that because given the green complex there is no compulsion or desire to take the racing line, and instead a play out left isn't a daft option.

BTW - the cut of rough is certainly a lot different to how I remember it.

Niall

[Scott Warren]

Tom,

Fair enough and thanks for humouring me with some feedback on my guesses! Sad that 12 at Ren Club is no longer, but at least it existed once.

Looking forward to reading more about how it all works and comes together.

[Sean_A]

I am not sure I understand connector holes.  It was my impression that they simply provide a link to other holes which are very good and/or leading to/from a "main" section of the property.  I don't equate "connector" with quality of hole.  Connectors could be outstanding holes.  For instance, I can see how St Enodoc's 4th could be a connector hole, but I can also see how using the corners and odds n' sods (which I think of as #4) of the property were essential in getting 18 holes in.  Its quite a squeezed in property so I could understand if a great many of the holes were considered connectors, but it wouldn't mean much in the scheme of the design because loads of the holes could be considered connectors.

Ciao      

[Scott Warren]

Sean,

I agree "connector" is no slight on a hole's quality the way "breather" may be. As noted above, the "connector" I nominated at Ballyneal is my favourite par three on the course.

Hanley Common is an example where the routing consists of a series of little triangles and the likes of 5 & 9 are connectors between those triangles.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Sean,

I'm not sure I understand it either.  At least, I have never quite thought about it in those terms.  Granted, is you look at all 18 holes you have proposed (either prelim or final, as you usually do many routings) you do usually find that you can group your holes into the best, average and worst in terms of natural use of land.  

Does that make the worst 1-3 holes connectors, by definition?  Or do most pieces of property simply offer a few less than 18 natural golf holes, and you accept that a few must be corrected with man made work?  To me, a natural golf hole is one you can see from tee to green without any earthwork, and that drains reasonably.  If it has pleasing rolls to the eye, or some natural feature you can use without bunkers, it is both natural and very good to great.

So, I would only view a connector hole as one that has some earthmoving required to establish a good basic hole (maybe flatten a side hill lie, cut through a hill for vision, fill the fw for drainage, etc.)

I do agree that sometimes, those man made holes turn out to be the golfers favorites.  They like the visuals of bunkers and other man made work in many cases.

[Ben Sims]

I think the dead-horse of the connecting par 5's at Pacific Dunes has been well beaten. Particularly the 12th hole--as good as that greesite is, exposed and whatnot--as a way to get to the all-world 13th.

I recently walked Tumble Creek at the NCAA regionals. I think the 4th hole is a spectacular example of a connector hole being one of the better ones in the routing. I think I remember someone mentioned more earth being moved on that hole than the entirety of the other 17 holes!

[Kyle Henderson]

Barnbougle:  Yes, 16 is a connector, due to re-routing the back nine quickly.  [That hole was actually Mike Keiser's suggestion after I walked him back to 17 tee.]  But other holes that came later in the process included 4, 7, and 12.

That boggles my mind. 7 is perhaps the best short par 3 I've ever played and 4 and 12 are among the very best short par 4s. I suppose that property was so good, a talented eye could probably find great puzzles to tease and turf just about anywhere.

[Mike Bowen]

Great topic and very thought provoking.  I can't wait to hear Tom's future post.

The only Doak course I have played is Pacific Dunes and as mentioned earlier, the 3rd and 13th are possible "connectors."  I personally love the tee shot on the 3rd as well as the green site.  I can see how the 13th could be a connector, however I love the simple strategy that is used for that hole.

One thing I have noticed great courses have in common is the more bland the land may be for a certain hole, the more the architect will bring in strong strategic elements.  An example would be the 8th hole at Pacific Dunes.  Relatively bland land but then Tom put in one of the most fun green complexes to play.  A green like this may be an afterthought if it were located on the 4th hole.

[Scott Warren]

Barnbougle:  Yes, 16 is a connector, due to re-routing the back nine quickly.  [That hole was actually Mike Keiser's suggestion after I walked him back to 17 tee.]  But other holes that came later in the process included 4, 7, and 12.

That boggles my mind. 7 is perhaps the best short par 3 I've ever played and 4 and 12 are among the very best short par 4s. I suppose that property was so good, a talented eye could probably find great puzzles to tease and turf just about anywhere.

Absolutely. I'd love to see what those three holes looked like before a sod was turned.

[Tom_Doak]

Barnbougle:  Yes, 16 is a connector, due to re-routing the back nine quickly.  [That hole was actually Mike Keiser's suggestion after I walked him back to 17 tee.]  But other holes that came later in the process included 4, 7, and 12.

That boggles my mind. 7 is perhaps the best short par 3 I've ever played and 4 and 12 are among the very best short par 4s. I suppose that property was so good, a talented eye could probably find great puzzles to tease and turf just about anywhere.

Absolutely. I'd love to see what those three holes looked like before a sod was turned.

Well, I guess I should have been more clear about what you meant by "connector hole," vs. Jeff's definition which is quite different.  No earth was moved for any of the holes mentioned at Barnbougle.  I just meant it in terms of the process of getting the routing up to 18 holes. 

On #4, that green site was always going to be the west end of the golf course, but for the longest time we were looking at a much longer hole to get you there ... a par-5 starting from the ladies' tee on #3.  I was never happy with that arrangement, but it took me a long time to get comfortable that we could squeeze two holes into the area where today's 3rd and 4th are.

On #7, originally the hole was laid out to be more crosswind, to a green higher up overlooking the water, but the green site always felt too small for that shot ... so Mike Clayton and Brian Schneider and I went wandering around for other possibilities, and came up with the current green site for #7, even though it meant a good walk from there to #8 tee.  [It's not really a good connector at all, in that sense, but it's a much better hole.]

I always intended to use #13 green site, but when the routing for the back nine was reversed, the tee would have been in what's now the 12th fairway.  When we reversed everything, there was barely room for a fairway on #12, and the tee shot was quite severe ... so we had to move up the tee, and build tees out of fill 75-100 yards forward from the original location.  That made it JUST long enough to qualify as a par-4, with the tees for #13 moved to their present location.

[Tom_Doak]

Actually, the first few holes we sorted out at Barnbougle were 1, 2, 5, 6, and the second half of 9, and the rest revolved around those.

On the back, once we reversed the flow generally, 10, 13, 15 and especially 17 were the linchpins.

[Scott Warren]

Thanks Tom - my post was unclear,sorry. I wasn't rolling off Jeff's post and suggesting those holes must have featured a heap of earthmoving, I don't see a connector hole that way, the above post was more an aside from the main topic. Kyle's post made me realise I've never seen "before" pics of Barney Dunes and those three holes are the ones I'd most like to see nude.

[Adam Makepeace]

Scott, Tom,

I had always considered 'connector holes' to be those that took you from one desirable piece of land or feature (the previous hole) to another.

Using Barnbougle as an example, #2 gets the golfer from the interesting green site at 1 to the dunes for the first time at #3. It may have already been in the routing plan, but it's purpose is quite clear.

Due to the walk between 7 and 8, my impression is that rather than being a connector hole, 7 was about finding the best hole rather than facilitating the best transition to 8 tee.

[Sean Leary]

I think the dead-horse of the connecting par 5's at Pacific Dunes has been well beaten. Particularly the 12th hole--as good as that greesite is, exposed and whatnot--as a way to get to the all-world 13th.

I recently walked Tumble Creek at the NCAA regionals. I think the 4th hole is a spectacular example of a connector hole being one of the better ones in the routing. I think I remember someone mentioned more earth being moved on that hole than the entirety of the other 17 holes!

The 4th at Tumble is one of the best Par 5s Tom ever built. And it was the key to the routing working. Couldn't agree more.

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