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Forrest Richardson

  • Karma: +0/-0
What Era Are We In Now?
« on: May 22, 2014, 02:10:41 PM »
I re-read recently the thoughtful piece by Steve Sailer, writer for the American Conservative, titled FROM BAUHAUS TO GOLF COURSE: The Rise, Fall and Revival of the Art of Golf Course Architecture.   http://www.isteve.com/Golf_Art.htm

Sailer makes good sense in describing the eras of golf design, basically (with one addition by me) as:

FOLK ERA … that period before and up to the Old Course being purposefully changed

CRAFTSMAN ERA … that period forward from when Morris and Robertson changed the Old Course, by design

INLAND AND GLOBALIZATION ERA [my addition] … when golf began to move inland, and was exported with little in the way of a "How--To" guide

GOLDEN AGE … 1901 to 1934, although it has been argued that it begins with the National Golf Links in America (1908)

MODERN AGE … Transitioned at the building of Augusta National (1934), and formed largely by Robert Trent Jones, Sr.

POSTMODERN ERA … Ushered in by Pete Dye, followed by many and visited, briefly, by Desmond Muirhead

---

So, where are we now? Are we in the RETRO ERA? After all, with lacy-edges so remarkably in vogue, and a body of restoration and nearly-restoration and restoration-only-in-name work being done, it seems most of what we see is in homage to the past, embracing the Golden Age, and striving for the simplicity that was not only cost efficient, but also good for the game.

And, if you feel I missed (or Sailer missed) an era or two, please chime in.


« Last Edit: May 22, 2014, 02:12:22 PM by Forrest Richardson »
— Forrest Richardson, Golf Course Architect/ASGCA
    www.golfgroupltd.com
    www.golframes.com

Sven Nilsen

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2014, 02:30:26 PM »
The Renaissance.  Unfortunately someone had the foresight to use the name of the era for their design company.
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Randy Thompson

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2014, 02:35:35 PM »
Forrest,
I think a good title for our current era, would be the Disco Era because the first thing that pops into my mind is, "Staying Alive"! On a serious note, not sure of a good name for this era but it seems to be a mixture of, efficiency, making golf fun again and a whole lot of modern abstract art.

Forrest Richardson

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2014, 02:43:27 PM »
Randy, what would an example of abstract-modern art be in current course design?
— Forrest Richardson, Golf Course Architect/ASGCA
    www.golfgroupltd.com
    www.golframes.com

Bill_McBride

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2014, 02:48:53 PM »
Randy, what would an example of abstract-modern art be in current course design?

just jumping in, how about Tobacco Road?

David Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2014, 03:11:07 PM »
Whatever you call the era we are in now, we are at the tail end of it.
"Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent." - Judge Holden, Blood Meridian.

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2014, 03:16:11 PM »
Whatever you call the era we are in now, we are at the tail end of it.

Why's that, David?  The leading lights, Doak, Crenshaw/Coore, Hanse, that minimalist gang, are all younger guys.  The style they seem to represent should survive as long as they and their acolytes do.   I'd say they will be here longer than Fazio, Nicklaus and that group.

There are a number of talented GCAs I didn't mention, just trying to point out the extremes. 

Peter Pallotta

Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2014, 03:17:29 PM »
In addition to the list provided: after the Post Modern Era can the white hot intensity of the "Industrial Era", and then after that, and currently, came the "Post Industrialist Era". I think after that we'll have what will be called (anachronistically) "The Arts and Crafts Era".

Peter
« Last Edit: May 22, 2014, 07:40:36 PM by PPallotta »

Forrest Richardson

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2014, 03:20:17 PM »
OK, Bill…but, since Tobacco Road opened in 1998, I think it might be among the POST MODERN ERA ??

I suppose that needs some discussion, too. When do we set the start of this current era, whatever we might call it?

2001…after 9/11 and the collapse of the world economy? That is nearly 15 years ago. And, while the crew of minimalists and "let's go back to a better time" designers may have been busy before 2001, it was not yet the fad or trend as we see it today.
— Forrest Richardson, Golf Course Architect/ASGCA
    www.golfgroupltd.com
    www.golframes.com

David Kelly

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2014, 03:28:06 PM »
Whatever you call the era we are in now, we are at the tail end of it.
Why's that, David?  The leading lights, Doak, Crenshaw/Coore, Hanse, that minimalist gang, are all younger guys.  The style they seem to represent should survive as long as they and their acolytes do.   I'd say they will be here longer than Fazio, Nicklaus and that group.

I say that not because of a lack of talent being around but more because there will be a lack of opportunity going forward.
"Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent." - Judge Holden, Blood Meridian.

Paul Gray

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2014, 03:29:04 PM »
Whatever you call the era we are in now, we are at the tail end of it.

No way.

The 'Renaissance Era,' if that's what we can call it for now, is only just beginning to filter down into the minds of the average club golfer, not to mention the management of clubs. The vast majority of club golfers are going to be puzzled by what they see in the U.S. Open. Surely that says it all.

And I'm personally of the opinion that too much empathise is put on this question of defining eras because we now assume that everything is temporary. I actually think that the current avant garde, rather than simply being a passing phase, is part of a longer term return to what has existed for hundreds of years. Old Tom Morris and Young Tom Doak worked (or, in the case of the latter, works) in the same paradigm.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2014, 05:26:48 PM by Paul Gray »
In the places where golf cuts through pretension and elitism, it thrives and will continue to thrive because the simple virtues of the game and its attendant culture are allowed to be most apparent. - Tim Gavrich

Eric Smith

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2014, 03:47:16 PM »
The southern hemisphere has a # of what appear to be exceptional golf courses in the pipeline..

AUS







NZ


Sven Nilsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2014, 04:02:24 PM »
Randy, what would an example of abstract-modern art be in current course design?

just jumping in, how about Tobacco Road?

Can an outlier define an era?
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Forrest Richardson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #13 on: May 22, 2014, 04:08:41 PM »
Paul — The Toms work in the same paradigm? Really? I think Old Tom was recruited into the CRAFTSMAN ERA and made due with what he had, and knew. He was at the beginning of something, and he helped define it. He took golf from found ground, to purposefully developed ground. That was his paradigm. He was an inventor and among the earliest of routers of the game. Until then, bands of players routed courses and they did so not by design, but by necessity. Old Tom got on the bandwagon of growth in the game, and he helped evangelize the sport and its playing boards. Forever more, players would not lay out courses with sticks and balls — the game became formalized, at least so with regard to the laying out of courses.

— Forrest Richardson, Golf Course Architect/ASGCA
    www.golfgroupltd.com
    www.golframes.com

Bill_Yates

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2014, 05:13:58 PM »
Whatever it is, I'm hoping it's not the "Build Another Golf Course Housing Development" era.
Bill Yates
www.pacemanager.com 
"When you manage the pace of play, you manage the quality of golf."

Forrest Richardson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #15 on: May 22, 2014, 05:19:37 PM »
Oh, come on Yates. You have to love Pasatiempo?
— Forrest Richardson, Golf Course Architect/ASGCA
    www.golfgroupltd.com
    www.golframes.com

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #16 on: May 22, 2014, 05:23:32 PM »
Whatever you call the era we are in now, we are at the tail end of it.
Why's that, David?  The leading lights, Doak, Crenshaw/Coore, Hanse, that minimalist gang, are all younger guys.  The style they seem to represent should survive as long as they and their acolytes do.   I'd say they will be here longer than Fazio, Nicklaus and that group.

I say that not because of a lack of talent being around but more because there will be a lack of opportunity going forward.

But it does seem that most or at least a lot of new work is going in that direction. 

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #17 on: May 22, 2014, 05:26:22 PM »
OK, Bill…but, since Tobacco Road opened in 1998, I think it might be among the POST MODERN ERA ??

I suppose that needs some discussion, too. When do we set the start of this current era, whatever we might call it?

2001…after 9/11 and the collapse of the world economy? That is nearly 15 years ago. And, while the crew of minimalists and "let's go back to a better time" designers may have been busy before 2001, it was not yet the fad or trend as we see it today.

That was offered as an example of abstract-modern art.

Ronald Montesano

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #18 on: May 22, 2014, 05:28:36 PM »
I think you need to bracket years for your last two periods, before we proceed.

-==============================================================================-
FOLK ERA … that period before and up to the Old Course being purposefully changed

CRAFTSMAN ERA … that period forward from when Morris and Robertson changed the Old Course, by design

INLAND AND GLOBALIZATION ERA [my addition] … when golf began to move inland, and was exported with little in the way of a "How--To" guide

GOLDEN AGE … 1901 to 1934, although it has been argued that it begins with the National Golf Links in America (1908)

MODERN AGE … Transitioned at the building of Augusta National (1934), and formed largely by Robert Trent Jones, Sr.

POSTMODERN ERA … Ushered in by Pete Dye, followed by many and visited, briefly, by Desmond Muirhead
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Bill_Yates

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #19 on: May 22, 2014, 05:31:20 PM »
Forrest, you're right, I do. And I love Pebble Beach, Muirfield Village, and Mission Hills in Rancho Mirage.

And by the way, what are you doing awake at this hour?
Bill Yates
www.pacemanager.com 
"When you manage the pace of play, you manage the quality of golf."

Paul Gray

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #20 on: May 22, 2014, 05:33:27 PM »
Paul — The Toms work in the same paradigm? Really? I think Old Tom was recruited into the CRAFTSMAN ERA and made due with what he had, and knew. He was at the beginning of something, and he helped define it. He took golf from found ground, to purposefully developed ground. That was his paradigm. He was an inventor and among the earliest of routers of the game. Until then, bands of players routed courses and they did so not by design, but by necessity. Old Tom got on the bandwagon of growth in the game, and he helped evangelize the sport and its playing boards. Forever more, players would not lay out courses with sticks and balls — the game became formalized, at least so with regard to the laying out of courses.



Everything you describe, save for technology, is the same. Adding a bulldozer to the equation may provide greater options but it doesn't mean the philosophy isn't from the same page.
In the places where golf cuts through pretension and elitism, it thrives and will continue to thrive because the simple virtues of the game and its attendant culture are allowed to be most apparent. - Tim Gavrich

Forrest Richardson

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #21 on: May 22, 2014, 05:46:29 PM »
Paul — An interesting theory. Not sure I agree, but interesting.

Ronald — POSTMODERN = 1970 in my opinion. But, some may place it later. To me it was ushered in with Harbor Town and the TPC.

Bill Y. — I am asleep, I just look busy.
— Forrest Richardson, Golf Course Architect/ASGCA
    www.golfgroupltd.com
    www.golframes.com

Randy Thompson

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #22 on: May 22, 2014, 06:06:21 PM »
Randy, what would an example of abstract-modern art be in current course design?
Umm, why do I feel your fishing when you know what I am going to respond, ok I will bite and you can reel me in! Sqiggley, wiggley bunkers that are not so efficient. Lots of color contrast now a days which is not so much abstract art but arty. I think in the hotel business the best of the five star categories. that seperate themselves from the average five star, do so by paying attentions to details and creating lots of Eye Candy. I think we are seeing that in superior golf designs today. Good basic design principals that have worked for years, such as large challenging greens with lots of movement and a variety of challenging recuperation shots around the greens. Throw in as much natural vegetation as you can in order to produce color and size contrast. If the αrea doesnt have sufficient natural vegetation to work with, invent something that looks natural. This type of natrual art is eye candy but really using the word abstract probably only applies to the bunkers. There is also lots of thnking out of the box going on and some will be accepted and other new concepts will go over the heads of Jon Q. Public and fade out.

Paul Gray

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #23 on: May 22, 2014, 06:11:55 PM »
Forrest,

We can certainly agree to disagree.

I just think there's sometimes an urge to over categorise these things.

I'll leave you wish this thought: look at the courses on James's wee nine holer tour and look at Sand Hills and consider if they aren't really the same thing.
In the places where golf cuts through pretension and elitism, it thrives and will continue to thrive because the simple virtues of the game and its attendant culture are allowed to be most apparent. - Tim Gavrich

Jeff_Brauer

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Re: What Era Are We In Now?
« Reply #24 on: May 22, 2014, 06:14:06 PM »
Minimalist Era now. Post Minimalist at some point.
Jeff Brauer, ASGCA Director of Outreach

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