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Ran Morrissett

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The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« on: July 17, 2013, 12:51:16 PM »
 ... under Architecture Timeline and Courses by Country.

Most clubs/courses scream for publicity. Not The Country Club.
 
Other than learning that Gil Hanse had become the club’s architect of record in 2007, I hadn’t read much as to what was going on. Have you?

Hence, one of the most bizarre things happened to me when I climbed onto the third tee at The Country Club two weeks ago: I became disoriented. My head exploded! Everything was the same yet everything was different. Over on the right was the seventh with its plateau green exposed - not framed by trees. Through the limbed-up specimen trees I could see the fifth hole to the left and below. The third hole looked ‘bigger’ for a lack of a better word. Having not been there since 2004, and having scrolled through its profile the prior night on GolfClubAtlas.com, it was overwhelmingly evident that much had changed. So ... I stopped playing for a few holes! There was too much to process.

Coincidentally, Ben Cowan-Dewar had played it a week earlier. We compared notes about its ample but not wide fairways and small canted greens and marveled that not a single architect builds courses remotely like it today. 50 yard wide fairways, big bunkers, and wild interior green contours have people fixated at the moment. Yes, TCC is getting ready to host the 2013 U.S. Amateur next month, so it has its game face on, but those descriptives are never what TCC is about. Bending fairways, little bunkers that don’t always flash toward the green's center, and greens that average a scant 3,600 square feet on the Composite Championship course (the Main Course greens average 3,400 sq.feet) provide a distinctly old-fashioned challenge. Give me a hole like the penultimate one here: the inside of the dogleg left is well protected via bunkers/rough and the long, thin green tilts left. Its very simplicity makes 9X% of modern architecture look labored/contrived.
 
Along with seeing Merion prior to the U.S. Open, seeing this course marks the second time that I have ever felt pity for contestants. The stretch of holes on the Composite from 9 (this time being played as a par 4!) through 15 is the most brutal, searching stretch of holes that I have ever seen. Below is a picture of the embankment that you now must carry for your second shot at the newly configured 625 yard twelfth:
 

What a superb Sahara feature – 2013 U.S. Amateur contestants beware! The yellow flag is barely visible under the tree on the left.

Ben concluded with the following pithy observation: ‘TCC is like French food. Fusion or ethnic might be what is ‘in’ right now but as soon as you have French, you remember nothing beats it.’ Spot on!

Bottom line: It was a full notch better than I remembered. The club has done everything right and is nearing that rarified state of presenting their course at its peak state. IMO, less than ~30 courses/clubs can say the same around the world. Indeed, I now push TCC to a AA on the Morrissett scale (or a 9 on the Doak scale). Like Prestwick, the more the game changes, the more you appreciate TCC. To heck with all the new courses being built; play TCC and you might want to retreat into a shell and focus on but a dozen or two courses. You know’em and I know’em. If confined to such a limited number of courses to play the rest of my life, TCC would be one of them, it’s that different from the rest. Put another way: I couldn’t not select it. There are too many neat features best found here.
 

There is primrose and then there is Primrose. There are country clubs and then there is The Country Club.

Leave the last word to my idol, Francis Ouimet, who said in 1932, "To me, the ground here is hallowed. The grass grows greener, the trees bloom better, there is even warmth to the rocks. Somehow or other the sun seems to shine brighter on The Country Club than any other place that I have ever known."

Cheers,

Phil McDade

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2013, 02:49:54 PM »
Ran:

Thanks for this particular course profile -- arguably the course where the most important thing in the history of American golf occurred. Wonderful photos as always.

PCCraig

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2013, 06:12:17 PM »
Ran,

I just saw this and I am ecstatic that you updated your profile given all the work that's been done since 2007. The Country Club is a fantastic golf course that is well regarded but isn't discussed nearly enough!!
H.P.S.

Joel_Stewart

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #3 on: July 17, 2013, 07:20:13 PM »
Ran,

I just saw this and I am ecstatic that you updated your profile given all the work that's been done since 2007. The Country Club is a fantastic golf course that is well regarded but isn't discussed nearly enough!!

I agree.   My only other comment is I wish we could see the before and after photos.

Matthew Rose

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #4 on: July 17, 2013, 07:43:44 PM »
Wow, I didn't know they'd done work on TCC. Looks fantastic.

I think I like the 12th hole as a long par-five, but where is the new tee? I'm looking at an aerial trying to figure out where it might go. On the other side of the pond next to the (Composite) 11th green?
American-Australian. Trackman Course Guy. Fatalistic sports fan. Drummer. Bass player. Father. Cat lover.

Thomas Dai

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2013, 07:27:48 AM »
Very informative and enjoyable to read. Well Done Ran. Splendid photographs.
All the best.

PCCraig

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2013, 07:30:17 AM »
Wow, I didn't know they'd done work on TCC. Looks fantastic.

I think I like the 12th hole as a long par-five, but where is the new tee? I'm looking at an aerial trying to figure out where it might go. On the other side of the pond next to the (Composite) 11th green?


Yes, you're right about the new tee.
H.P.S.

Paul Rudovsky

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #7 on: July 18, 2013, 06:25:40 PM »
Regarding the new 12th hole.  The new tee is actually directly behind the 7th green of Primrose (which is to the right of the 2nd Primrose green or 11th green of the Composite).  So it is about 140 yards behind the old tee and about 35 yards to the left (as you are playing 12 Composite).  This makes the hole a dogleg left.

What I find interesting about the hole is that with the fairway restart being 525 yards from the new tee (plus the 35-40' raise from the big hill), if you hit your drive in the rough (which is bad stuff on both sides), you are not getting on top in 2 (unless you get a very lucky lie).  This may lead lots of players to play 3 wood/3 wood.  HOWEVER, there is a crest in the fairway about 310 yds from the new tee...and a slight downhill slope for the next 40 yards.  So, if you are a long hitter, you might want to take out the drive, and if you catch the downhill, you can reach in 2...but if you miss the fairway, you got real troubles.

Jeff Spittel

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2013, 07:47:36 AM »
Had a chance to play it a few weeks ago. I was floored by how good it was. Gil Hanse is a genius.
Fare and be well now, let your life proceed by its own design.

PCCraig

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2013, 09:33:01 AM »
Regarding the new 12th hole.  The new tee is actually directly behind the 7th green of Primrose (which is to the right of the 2nd Primrose green or 11th green of the Composite).  So it is about 140 yards behind the old tee and about 35 yards to the left (as you are playing 12 Composite).  This makes the hole a dogleg left.

What I find interesting about the hole is that with the fairway restart being 525 yards from the new tee (plus the 35-40' raise from the big hill), if you hit your drive in the rough (which is bad stuff on both sides), you are not getting on top in 2 (unless you get a very lucky lie).  This may lead lots of players to play 3 wood/3 wood.  HOWEVER, there is a crest in the fairway about 310 yds from the new tee...and a slight downhill slope for the next 40 yards.  So, if you are a long hitter, you might want to take out the drive, and if you catch the downhill, you can reach in 2...but if you miss the fairway, you got real troubles.

Whoops, I was a little off with the location of the new tee. Thanks for clarifying, Paul.

I think #12 Composite is the best of the Primrose holes that are included in the Championship course. As a par-4, it was just a brutal test as the second shot was blind, uphill, and to a pretty tiny target. Most of the times I played the hole, I ended up short right of the green with a pitch. It should be a really exciting par-5 as it will likely yield quite a few birdies as well as a fair share of bogeys or more.

One note from Ran's updated tour, the golf course looks incredible with all the tree removal over the past five years.
H.P.S.

John Ezekowitz

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2013, 04:38:12 PM »
Great to see TCC getting some well-deserved plaudits. I had thought of starting a thread about its seemingly anonymous status on here but didn't have any new pictures to post.

12 Composite (8 on the Prim) used to play as a long 4, which really just didn't work. Trying to hit a long club around those trees onto the green, which is tiny and only open to a running shot from the front left, was almost impossible. Now it requires two good shots to get on the upper level and hit a wedge to what will likely be tucked pins. A true three-shot par 5.

Leo Barber

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2013, 10:54:00 PM »
Thanks Ran.  Really enjoyed the updated profile.  I have recently returned from a trip to the states where I was very fortunate to play TCC and honestly it was the surprise package for me.  I expected history, I expected a true championship test, I expected a great experience with amazing conditioning but......what I didn't expect was the pure architectural brilliance of this course.  I absolutely loved it.  The course is quite unique I think for its continuous long short long short sequence of holes broken only perhaps when the long 14th and 15th follow on from the long 13th (members course I am talking).  3 and 17 were possibly the best two shotters of the trip.   

Wade Whitehead

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2013, 09:54:18 PM »
How often, and when, do players get to play the composite 18?

WW

PCCraig

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2013, 08:53:11 AM »
How often, and when, do players get to play the composite 18?

WW

Wade,

Members can play it a couple times a year either through team events (member-member/member-guest) or a special weekend in August where the course is in play. They also set it up for some outside tournaments. Of course, when the courses aren't busy, you can play it fairly easily. It doesn't get played a lot because the Primrose course gets a fair amount of play (kids, women, etc.)
H.P.S.

Brad Swanson

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2013, 11:01:52 PM »
Fantastic profile.  Can't wait to see it in HD when the flatbellies take it on in a few weeks.

Bryan Lewis

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2013, 04:20:56 PM »
I'm on site for the US Amateur.  I've walked it the last two days and I am so impressed!  Not exactly what I expected.  I think it is going to play tough.  The rough looks longer and thicker than Oak Hill.  It should be a good test.

Bryan

Mike Feeney

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2013, 11:20:47 PM »
Mass. Golf Association's magazine covers the US Amateur in this month's issue...you may find the head pro's take on key TCC holes interesting - see pages 24-25...http://onlinedigeditions.com/publication/?i=169297

Jason Topp

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #17 on: August 13, 2013, 06:16:38 PM »
Thank you for the profile and the wonderful interview.  The course appears incredibly difficult for those of us not playing in major championships.  How does it play for the club player?

Dan_Callahan

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #18 on: August 14, 2013, 03:45:56 PM »
Jason,

I played it last summer and this summer. It was definitely more difficult this summer as they were preparing for the Am. Having said that, when played from the member tees, it is a very fun course. I had low expectations when I first played it. I thought I was going to find a boring, overly penal slog. Instead, I found the exact opposite. I think it's definitely a second-shot course. On many of the holes, the tee shot is to very wide fairways. But the greens are tiny (think Pebble) and surrounded by thick rough and deep bunkers. If you miss the greens to the wrong side, you're in trouble. There's also a good variety of hole lengths. There's one driveable par 4, and another that you can get your tee shot near the green if you're willing to risk hitting to a blind landing area. Unfortunately, on TV at the Am you won't see one of my favorite holes on the course. The 12th is skipped in the jump to the Primrose. It's a drop-shot par 3 that's similar to 7 at Pebble. Slightly longer, but possibly a smaller green that is raised significantly and surrounded by bunkers. It may as well be an island green. It's usually only a gap wedge (depending on the wind), but it's a really small target.

Alex Miller

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2017, 05:38:17 PM »
Question for those familiar with TCC!


I was going through the updated tour recently and decided to get a better understanding of the composite course and routing used for the U.S. Amateur. Not to get too hung up on par, but let's since it will be hosting the 2022 U.S. Open. It appears the course will be a 34-36-72 with the front nine around 3,300 yards and the back nine at nearly 4,000 yards(!). I think that's great by the way and am not proposing that be changed.


But I do want to know why the 4th hole is included at the expense of the 10th hole (main course). This is also done by somewhat neutering the 2nd hole and turning it into a par 3 rather than an exciting short par 4. Ran notes both the 2nd and 10th as highlights of the main that aren't included in the composite, and it seems like the routing is more cohesive when skipping the 4th hole anyway.

So those familiar with TCC, can you tell me if my armchair instinct has merit?

Brad Tufts

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2017, 09:10:13 PM »
Hi Alex,

I will take a shot...a lot of it has to do with logistics of how the routing comes together.

While #4 could be skipped logistically as #3 green and #5 tee aren't too far apart, #10 really can't be added back into the routing.  The Composite skips Member's #9 (it has been the range in the past), going right from M#8 to M#11, so there's no way to get to the M#10 tee without a 450y walk.

Secondarily, #4 is one of TCC's most unique holes and best short par fours, especially because of the minuscule sloping green.  #2 is a very strong hole as a slightly uphill 215y par three.  As a 310y par four, it isn't nearly as interesting as the two other short fours (#4, #6) on the front nine, and its really awkward as a drivable par four.

#10 has always been an old-timey hole because of its completely blind green.  It was improved when Hanse moved the tee away from the putting green up the hill, creating a dogleg of 330y.  While the old-schooler in me thinks a completely blind green in a major would be neat, it would be unprecedented, and as I said above, there is too much distance between #8 green and M#10 tee.

Also...replacing M#10 (330y) and M#12 (125y) with long par fours on the Primrose gets the Composite much of its championship-level length, so it all (very uniquely) makes sense!
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

MCirba

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2017, 09:53:07 PM »
I love the Flynn holes but a big part of me would LOVE seeing them play the 1913 Ouimet routing.
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Alex Miller

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2017, 10:45:17 PM »
Brad thanks so much for your answer.


Here's the problem, I'm an idiot and meant #12 not #10  ??? . So routing-wise were back to making sense, but you still say #4 is a much better short 4 than #2, correct?

Ben Stephens

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #23 on: January 07, 2017, 01:30:15 PM »

Here is a link to the layout to be used for 2022 US Open on Gil Hanse's website


It looks like that they are going to use the short par 3!

www.hansegolfdesign.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/The-Country-Club-Routing.png

Brad Tufts

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Re: The Country Club updated profile is posted ...
« Reply #24 on: January 09, 2017, 09:17:31 AM »
Hi Alex,

As the routing above confirms, looks like they are taking Members' #4 out of the Composite for 2022, and replacing it with Members' #12.  A conversation with someone in-the-know cited the removal of #4 due to nobody going for the green in stroke play (unlike match play where you'd have some guys trying to hit up near the green), and the addition of #12 because all the other par threes played similar lengths (C#2 is 210y, M#7/new C#6 is 195y, M/C#16 is 180y), and adding #12 back in will be in the 140-150y range with a potential new tee.
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....