THE BRIEF A&G TOUR

[Sean_A]

This thread includes tours of Montrose Medal, Trump International, Royal Aberdeen, Carnoustie Burnside & Cruden Bay.

Taking on Angus & Grampian from a random perspective, we first visit the Montrose 1562 Course.  Claiming ancestry back to 1562, during the reign of Mary Queen of Scots, Montrose is the 5th oldest golf course site in the world.  While parts of the course are over 350 years old, much of the current design is attributable to HS Colt likely with tidbits of Willie Park Jr. and Old Tom Morris somewhere in the mix. Incidentally, a famous son of Montrose, Alex Finlay, known as The Father of American Golf, was one of the most prolific architects working on either side of the Atlantic during the early years of the 20th century.   

The tight knit layout runs admirably over the most humpty- bumpty section of the links.  The terrain of many holes is reminiscent of The Old Course.  While TOC and the town’s handsome main street are well known for their width, the 1562 can be quite snug at times.  The punishing rough and many diagonal drives may soon lead one to discover this course cannot be taken lightly. Two Scottish Professional Championships, a Scottish Amateur Championship and twice selected for Final Open Qualifying are proof of its ability to provide a challenge.   

The first is rather straight-forward except for being the first!  Threatened by coastal erosion, the second is the first of many holes on which a diagonal tee shot is featured. 


I wonder if CBM ever saw the 3rd as a Short?  The green is huge!


After a diagonal tee shot similar to the 2nd, the approach to the 4th rolls over typical Montrose terrain.


The 5th is a short two-shotter with hidden bunkers between golfer and green.




More interesting terrain, yet somehow the course is lacking that punch its near neighbour Carnoustie Burnside provided in spades.   


The shape of the 7th bends away from the sea.


More to follow.

Ciao

[Sean_A]

The short two-shotter 8th offers the first view of the iconic church spire which is in the centre of the burgh. The motif of OOB down the right continues, but the fairway is ample. 


Considering the terrific movement displayed on the fairways, with a few exceptions, the greens are disappointingly flat.   


The 9th is a 120 yard longer version of the 8th.
 

The first straight hole since #1, the 10th is perhaps a bit too straightforward. 


The long 11th plays over and between the whins.  One gets the impression there is more open area to the right, but that isn't really the case.   


Taken from well beyond the driving area - more lovely terrain. 


It is a pity there are not more than three short holes for the set is the highlight of the course. Although not readily apparent, like the other par 3s, the 12th green is huge.  The bunkering too is a bit more meaningful than seen previously.
 

Yet another legger, #13 is a short par 4; probably just out of reach for the run of the mill good single digit marker.  Although, one may be long enough to sneak up the left wing and perhaps take the front bunkers out of play. 
 

 

More to follow.
 

[Ally Mcintosh]

Considering I grew up 40 miles up the road, I’m sorry to say I’ve never made it to Montrose and wish I had… Love the look of these pictures…

I think Hawtree have done some bunker repositioning there over the last few years. As well as realigning the 2nd hole due to the erosion.

[Niall C]

Sean

Thank you for the photo tour. Was Montrose not the course where Colt redesigned 4 or 5 of the holes to take in some dunes but after finding it too difficult to make it work the club largely reverted to what they had before ? I may be getting confused with Monifieth or Arbroath but don't think so.

Either way I have a standing invite from someone I know who is a member to get a game there. Your photos have just reminded me to get that organised.

Niall

[Thomas Dai]

Thank you for this report and photos Sean.

The Championship course at Montrose is a really pleasant course to play, not quite in the league of the other East Coast 'big boys' but still thoroughly enjoyable. There is also a second 18-hole course at the same location, a lessor, shorter course. I can't remember it's name but it was perfectly acceptable to play.

Some holes on the Championship course that immediately come to mind are the par-4 2nd, which has probably, to use Seans phrase, the most humpty-bumpty fairway I ever recall playing, and the par-3 3rd. The chasm in front of the green shown in Seans photo, is probably 15-20 ft deep and has severely sloped sides. There is also a similar chasm across the back of the green, which is thus very plateau like. There's also a very long par-3 near the end of the round, the 16th maybe, which I recall being quite awkward to score well on. Nice to see some of the gorse blooming.

Neill mentions Arbroath, just a few miles south along the coast. Arbroath, or Elliott, as it's sometimes called, is a James Braid design bounded closely on the seashore side by the main Dundee-Aberdeen railway line. It is another thoroughly nice links to play, normally extremely firm and fast and bouncy, although not as good a course as the Championship course at Montrose.

Looking forward to seeing the photos of the last few holes.

All the best.

[Tony_Muldoon]

I look forward to the rest of the tour.


Niall AS far as I could see the dunes have al been incorporated into the course, there is less interest once you come down from them.


Anyone know who is responsible for the green on 16?  It's a belter of a Par 3.  I can best describe the green shape as being like the container for a microwave meal, with a sauce and a rice portion plaed sideways!    The routing in the Steel  book shows 3 bunkers in front of it and I think they are now gone.  Its the standout green with big contours in marked contrast to the rest, so it makes me think it's by someone else. Someone with a wicked sense of humour.

[David Harshbarger]

Sean, those first few holes are gobsmacking, though later it seems the steam runs out.  Yet again, though, here in the states left feeling that as far as our run of the mill courses ago we've been saddled with an inferior bean.

The diaganol tee shot is just a winner IMHO if not overdone in the course of a round. Even if you don't want to think, you have to think.

[Sean_A]

The routing forms a squat T.  We are now at the bottom of the stem where the terrain is flat.  Ready for the run home, no surprise, #14 is another dogleg, but to an interesting plateau green. 


The last of two par 5s, the second shot on #15 is one of the more compelling on the course. 


Perhaps the best hole on the course and maybe the best par 3 of the trip, the sixteenth is 226 yards long, but on the day it played far shorter.  One needs to carry broken ground about 30 yards shy of the green and let the terrain do the rest. I think the green area is the where OTM's famous Gulley hole was located.


The narrow seventeenth plays over more admirable terrain to a long shelf green. 


With terrain like this, why is the green raised?  It seems to me it would be more interesting to use this terrain with a green at the same height as the fairway.



The last is straight forward.  One feature which I really like is the forward centre bunker.  Most of the course is not imaginatively bunkered and this is a welcome diversion to the usual patterns. 


So ends the first leg of the tour.  To be fair, Montrose was always going to struggle to impress after seeing a cache of wonderful courses.  I can't help think a much better design could be had from what is essentially ideal terrain.  The greens are for the most part terribly uninteresting and to add insult to injury, they were incredibly slow.  Montrose, while pleasant enough, will not make many highlight reels.  Regardless, the erosion damage caused in the past few decades is disconcerting. It seems all but certain that the course as it currently exists will not have long for this earth.  See video below.

www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/local/angus-mearns/787302/video-angus-golf-course-fairway-turns-into-worlds-biggest-bunker-during-biblical-storms/
 
2013

Onto to TRUMP INTERNATIONAL.

I wasn't sure what to make of this development, after playing the course I still don't.  Driving north from Aberdeen along the A90 one is eventually greeted by a huge sign proclaiming the existence of Trump International.  By contrast, Royal Aberdeen doesn't have a sign indicating the club even exists.  I spose after nearly 200 years there isn't much need to proclaim anything.  I gather much of the grounds one drives through leading to the course will eventually be houses and a hotel.  As to be expected, there is ample practice facilities and the temporary clubhouse is quite comfortable.  While having lunch, not much of the course is revealed.  Instead, we see golfers and caddies walking back and forth.  Indeed, there seems to be preponderance of staff constantly buzzing about.  I suspect that eventually a permanent clubhouse will be built above the practice green, 1st tee and 9th green.  So far the impression is quite corporate and busy.  I couldn't wait for a bit of peace and quiet on the course. 

No worries, there is plenty of solitude to be had as with a few exceptions, each hole is more or less a secluded property.  We did get the odd meet and greet with other golfers, but at no time does one feel crowded or rushed.  The course has two loops of nine.  The front holes head south then north.  The routing for the back nine is a bit more interesting as it weaves into a figure 8 and features the 13th, the only hole playing toward the sea.  It is easy to see why Trump coveted this property, it is stunning. 

The opening hole is a par 5 which plays longer than the card suggests.  The green, as is the case throughout, is very interesting.   


As hoped, there is water in play on the course and to good effect on the medium length par 4 second. 


The picture post card 3rd is more than merely pretty, it is a very good par 3 without being overly difficult. 




More to follow.

Ciao

[Britt Rife]

Mr. Arble,  Thanks very much for doing the Montrose tour.  I played there on my first trip to Scotland and liked it very much, though I could only recall a few holes (2, 3, 17 and 18, the last of which perhaps only because my far-overclubbed approach shot slammed into the fence beyond the green on the fly).  But I notice I continue to talk about the course a lot, using it as a reference point, even though, on a hole-by-hole basis, it was not nearly the most memorable course of the trip.  I think the humpy bumpy terrain and the general atmosphere held me in thrall.   

My trip to East Lothian earlier this month failed to produce a course with as much fun terrain as Montrose, though on a hole-by-hole basis, many of the courses were more memorable.

 I suppose I just like Montrose taken as a whole.  I hear people voice similar sentiments about courses such as Pinehurst no. 2.

Funny to me that you back up the Montrose tour with Trump's course.  I recall as I was driving from Montrose up to Cruden Bay on that trip that I pointed out a stretch of land that I told my passenger "would be perfect for a new course".  I later found out that it was the site on which Trump would build.

[Adam Lawrence]

One of the interesting things about the third at Trump is the variety of tees. It is a very different, and much harder, hole from the tees on the right hand dune, away from where Sean has taken his first picture.

I liked the second, I think it is a sound strategic hole, especially when the pin is behind the front right bunker - can you clear the burn down the left side with your tee shot for the best line in; if not, how far up the right should you go? I also like the fact that there's a hidden hollow behind the bunker, it makes the approach over it more interesting than a straightforward carry.

[Niall C]

I look forward to the rest of the tour.


Niall AS far as I could see the dunes have al been incorporated into the course, there is less interest once you come down from them.


Anyone know who is responsible for the green on 16?  It's a belter of a Par 3.  I can best describe the green shape as being like the container for a microwave meal, with a sauce and a rice portion plaed sideways!    The routing in the Steel  book shows 3 bunkers in front of it and I think they are now gone.  Its the standout green with big contours in marked contrast to the rest, so it makes me think it's by someone else. Someone with a wicked sense of humour.

Tony

The more I think about it, the more I think it was Arbroath I was thinking about. I'll need to check or it's going to annoy me.

Niall

[Sean_A]

Britt

The problem I have with Montrose is the man-made elements don't nearly live up to what can only be called an outstanding site. 

Niall

I agree with Spangles, given the property boundaries, the dunes are incorporated into the design.  I didn't see much duneland on the second course.

Adam

I notice you didn't single out the 1st for comment.  Do you think the 5s are lacking? 

TRUMP INTERNATIONAL TOUR CONTINUED

The second par 5 follows the pattern of all the long holes, uphill and plays longer than yardage indicates.  In fact, most holes have an uphill approach.  One reason for this are the many elevated tees.  I can fully understand wanting to showcase the views, but perhaps the concept was taken too far and as a consequence variety was sacrificed.  To compound the issue, bunkering and or the very consistent use of swales at the front and sides of greens made the option of the ground game very difficult to achieve successfully.  Effectively, Hawtree created a ton of plateau greens which are designed for aerial approaching.  The player who hits a flat ball or doesn't have a long carry is at a huge disadvantage.


An aspect of the design I very much appreciated is the pair of short 4s.  The 5th is the first of the two and features a gathering centreline pot bunker.  In this instance, the hilltop tee works very well because it contributes to the temptation factor to unnecessarily take on the bunker.


A look at the green from the 6th tee.  Without exception, the greens are interesting, fun and challenging; one of the very best sets I have experienced in GB&I.


Another fine par 3, the 6th.


The excellent golf continues with the 7th; very drivable and very dangerous.  The green complex is excellent, but like Cruden Bay's 3rd and 8th, its the half par yardage which really makes the hole. 


A great hole!




More to follow.

Ciao

[Sean_A]

delete

[Adam Lawrence]

Britt

The problem I have with Montrose is the man-made elements don't nearly live up to what can only be called an outstanding site. 


Niall

I agree with Spangles, given the property boundaries, the dunes are incorporated into the design.  I didn't see much duneland on the second course.

Adam

I notice you didn't single out the 1st for comment.  Do you think the 5s are lacking? 

I didn't think the first was anything special to be honest. I like the fourth very much, primarily for the green, which I thought outstanding. Will save detailed comments on ten and eighteen till you get there, but in general terms I'd say the former just doesn't work, and the latter is overdone. So as a set, yes, perhaps I would agree they are lacking (though I hadn't considered it in those terms before).

[Tony_Muldoon]

Wow - it's like Portsalon all over again - raised green,  large bunker on one side with land falling away from it so the ball cannot feed toward the hole using the ground but away from it. Therefore a pitch landing on the surface of the green is the only option. Rinse, repeat. This feature was used on probably about half of the holes at Portsalon and it looks like something similar is happening at Trump although it appears not quite as bad. Personally, I can't stand the feature - chucking down the drain your number one asset (i.e. firm, fast running turf) like this is something I do not comprehend. Why not, instead, give a player 2 or 3 different options of getting a ball to the hole from any given spot - as opposed to just one? Why are so many more modern links courses like this - instead of a Deal or the Old Tom Morris course at Rosapenna or Royal St George's - lay of the land links golf - to me it's the best kind - and I'm going to need to hear a very good argument to be convinced that a series of raised greens defended by large bunkers is a better option.

Sorry if I am sounding hysterical, and I may well be misreading things from the pics but can you talk a bit more about this, Sean?

If that's hysterical then I'm an Austrailian goal kicker. 

Brian I agree completely with your thoughts on this tendency on modern links,  but found it far more pronounced at Rosapena and Ballyliffin Glasheedy than Portsalon (although I saw it just before the other two as the formula became more and more apparent)?  It's also the apparent random way the bunker in front of the green is placed, one left, then  one right and one centre with no regard to the land around them.

[Ben Stephens]

Sean et al,

I don't know if anyone has picked this up - the fairways and the green surrounds at Trump International are different shades of green - is it  different type of grasses used or was it 'hair' dye to make the fairways greener.

This is a remarkable similarity to Mr Trump's barnet.

I admit that the landscape is spectacular but can't help feeling that it is over bunkered in areas with similar sized bunkers which makes it look repetitive and artificial. Hawtree should have taken a look at Muirfield where the cluster of bunkers are of different sizes and scale which makes look more pleasing to the eye.

Sean hope that you can manage to get to Downfield and Caird Park in Dundee as well as Blairgowrie's Rosemount. Pitlochry is probably to your taste. Panmure and Carnoustie Burnside are good tracks as well as Monifieth Medal.

Cheers
Ben 

[Adam Lawrence]

Sean et al,

I don't know if anyone has picked this up - the fairways and the green surrounds at Trump International are different shades of green - is it  different type of grasses used or was it 'hair' dye to make the fairways greener.
 

Ben - the greens and surrounds were turfed, while the fairways were seeded, thus the grass is at different levels of maturity. In a few areas, when I was there last summer, the fairways had been overseeded with perennial rye to get full coverage, because the fescue wasn't mature enough; I've been told there was quite a bit more of that done over the close season, but I haven't been there this year so I can't say so for sure.

[Greg Taylor]

Yup, raised greens + firm conditions + wind = tough golf

Thanks for these pics Sean, please keep them coming.

[Thomas Dai]

"If that's hysterical then I'm an Austrailian goal kicker"..............thank God you're not Tony...... otherwise the folk from Downunder might have won the 1st Test!!!

I take Adams point about the turfing around the greens and the seeding of the fairways at Trump and the differing grass maturity etc, but it's very noticeable from Seans photos of Montrose how beige/brown Montrose's fairways are in comparison to Trump. Fairway sprinkers as well? It'll be interesting to note how the fairways are at the other courses in Seans tour.

Given the steepness of the dunes and the amount of mounding at the edges of the fairways/greens/tees etc it would be interesting to know how they could accommodate large numbers of spectators should they desire (hope) to hold a significant event one day.

By the way, any news on the houses and the hotel development, the second course......and the windfarm?

All the best.

[Sean_A]

Tom

I don't think it is reasonable to expect a newly sodded/seeded course to be allowed to brown out.  First things first - the grass needs to grow in and knit together before stressing it. 

TRUMP CONTINUED

Back to banger golf.  For some reason we played the Blue tees on this hole (as we did sporadically throughout the round).  At 463 with an uphill approach I think we pushed the boat out too far.  Straight-forward hole regardless - a good change of pace.


Another interesting green which is more traditional.


The side finishes with an intimidating driving hole.  The hole spreads right, but I think the best position is to hug the inside of the leg.  I didn't make any enquiries, but I suspect the house will be built on the same location as the hospitality tent to the rear of the 9th green.


Probably my favourite tee shot on the course.  The marsh to the right is used well.  There is also more fairway further right (out of photo). That route opens up the green, but its a tough target to hit, plus for the large hitters the driver can be taken out of their hands. 


In the general shape of an S, the hole climbs into a large hollow.  I don't usually like S shaped holes, but the 10th is very well executed. 




A view from the 11th tee toward the 13th (on right) and 17th greens.   


Another intimidating drive.  Note how the dunes abruptly end with arable land adjacent. 


From the prime position on the left, perhaps the approach to #11 is too similar to the 9th.  Both greens are generally angled front right to rear left.


More to follow.

Ciao

[Jon Wiggett]

Sean,

looking at the photos it appears they have really gone to town on cutting back the rough on some of the holes which was much needed. I think it will be another 4 or 5 years before it will be possible to judge the playing characteristics of the course. I fear they will regret the ryegrass overseed if F&F/running game is wished.

Jon

[Adam Lawrence]

Sean,

looking at the photos it appears they have really gone to town on cutting back the rough on some of the holes which was much needed. I think it will be another 4 or 5 years before it will be possible to judge the playing characteristics of the course. I fear they will regret the ryegrass overseed if F&F/running game is wished.

Jon

I assume they will use Rescue to take it out.

[Niall C]

Sean

Thanks for another wonderful photo tour. I think your comments, and Brians comments about the greens sum it up nicely. The internal contours are by far the best feature of the course for me but the wide open and flat landing areas and push up greens makes it more modern parkland than traditional links.

Niall

[Adam Lawrence]

Sean,

looking at the photos it appears they have really gone to town on cutting back the rough on some of the holes which was much needed. I think it will be another 4 or 5 years before it will be possible to judge the playing characteristics of the course. I fear they will regret the ryegrass overseed if F&F/running game is wished.

Jon

I assume they will use Rescue to take it out.

Can you ensure complete elimination with rescue, Adam?

The course does look much more playable and a fair bit less green than this time last year.

Complete, no, but if you go to Bearwood Lakes and look at the roughs you'll see what it can do. I think Dan has the best stand of fescue rough I've seen in this country, even though his soil is far from great (though I was at Brocket Hall last week and tat was pretty impressive too, presumably for the same reason).

[Adam Lawrence]

Rescue is a pretty new product, and frankly I think it's fairly remarkable. I remember the first time I talked to Gordon Irvine about his work at Deal; he told me that when he arrived there, he found that they were overseeding the links with ryegrass, because the then greens chairman freaked out at the cost of fescue seed. Now, this would still be a stupid idea, but if you have a herbicide that takes out the rye while leaving all the desirable grasses, it suddenly becomes far more straightforward to maintain a stand of fine grasses.

The holy grail, of course, is something that takes out poa, and leaves the good grasses alone!