[Ben Malach]

I have been thinking a lot recently about the limiting factors around golf. The main three that everyone talks about are time, money and difficulty. For my money I think the best solution to a lot of these problems. Is the 9 hole course. It halves of all the expenses. Plus if properly managed should reduce the round time down as well. There for allowing more people to play enabling the owners of the facilities to reduce the cost of the round. Plus when I think back to when I was learning the game and how much time I spent learning on some good nine holers. Plus its also a great place to tune up your game because on your second time around you can try new things on your second time around.  If all of this makes sense why are there so few new nine course being built. If feel that this is a great way to grow the game. Has anyone played any great nine hole tracks. I saw the thread on the sacred nine and though looked really cool. I have also played the old course in Musselburgh. Which I though was a great example of classical golf architecture and a lot of fun to play. 

[Steve_ Shaffer]

The PGA&USGA have endorsed 9 holers as way get people into the game and for those who are time restricted:


http://www.pga.com/news/golf-buzz/new-initiative-encourages-9-hole-rounds-usga-pga-america-provide-support

Other threads:

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,45422.0.html

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,43301.0.htm

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,34631.0.html

[Ricardo Ramirez Calvo]

The Argentine Golf Association is currently analysing the possibility of accepting 9 holes scores for handicap purposes. The goal that they are trying to achieve is to attract new golfers by reducing the time required to practice the sport. Bear in mind that in Argentina, handicap is a must in order to play golf. We have plenty of 9 holes courses.

[Bill_McBride]

Ben, I'm not sure all the costs will be halved.

You have to build a maintenance building and a clubhouse.  Could you cut them in half for a nine hole course?  Doubtful.  Even if you did there are fixed costs in any construction project that couldn't be halved.  A half size clubhouse will still need a kitchen, locker room, bar (I hope!) that would reflect the size of the membership.   Could have the crew maintain a nine hoke course?   You would need one superintendent, one GM, one pro, although I love the mom-and-pop model where some of these roles could be combined.  

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of nine hole courses.  I played quite a bit as a kid at the Mare Island course in Vallejo, Calif, and really enjoyed it with completely different back nine tees.   I just don't think it's realistic to think costs would be cut in half for a nine holer.  

[JC Jones]

The Dunes Club in New Buffalo, MI is the absolute model for this.  It is one of the few places I've played where I think the club gets everything 100% right.  I count my day there as one of my top handful of experiences I've ever had in golf.

McBride, no bar but drinks a plenty and the best clubhouse one could hope for.

[Carl Johnson]

See: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,52315.0.html

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,52630.msg1208028.html#msg1208028

[Tom ORourke]

There are a number of nine hole courses in the Philadelphia golf association. There are Moorestown Field Club and Merchantville, both built in 1892, and 3 others. The courses take turns hosting the Junior - Junior championship every 5 years. There are some cost savings maintaining 9 holes and some advantages. Crossovers at the turn are no big deal as everyone knows to do the alternate feed routine. I was a member for 20 years at Moorestown Field Club and they have 9 holes, 10 greens, and some of the tees are different between the front and back. The par 5 fifth becomes the par 4 14th, the par 4 sixth becomes the par 5 15th, etc.  A local pro once told me we had a 14 hole course as there enough changes between nines on some of the holes. This can work for tight real estate locations. MFC is on 54 acres and has no place to expand. But it is a place where you can play fast due to the closeness of greens and tees. I once lost in the finals of the club championship and we played the first 18 in 2 hours, and that is about as fast as you can go without running.

[Dane Hawker]

Are there any 27 hole complexes out there that are 18 hole private with a 9 hole for the public?

[Ross Tuddenham]

I started the game on a nine holer, and remained a member until leaving home for university. So for me 9 holes seemed the norm for a very long time, and for some time I probably equated having 18 holes as a sign of being a better course.  In a similar vain to some thinking a championship course means quality.  Neither of which is the case.

Even when a member of 18 hole courses I rarely feel the need to play a full 18 unless my playing partners want to.  There are a few 9 and even 6 hole loops I am happy to play.  I wonder if I am more prone to playing 9 holes because growing up I only really played 18 holes in competitions or on days out, but trough the week 9 holes in the evening was the norm.

If I am playing an away course I of course want to see the whole course.

I guess my point is that 18 holes has been ingrained in the minds of many and for whatever reason some people feel compelled to play 18 and nothing else. 

Would it be chaos on the course if you had many people simultaneously playing 18, 12, 9 and 6 hole etc rounds?

[Jaeger Kovich]

Are there any 27 hole complexes out there that are 18 hole private with a 9 hole for the public?

Firethorn near Lincoln, Nebraska owned by D. Youngscap has 18 Pete Dye, and a 9 holer by Rod Whitman, that has a second clubhouse, but I think the design has changed a bunch.

[Carson Pilcher]

I am a member of a 9-hole course.  Our maintenance budget is not half and the clubhouse is the same size to support an 18-hole facility, weddings, banquets, etc.

[Phil McDade]

The Dunes Club in New Buffalo, MI is the absolute model for this.  It is one of the few places I've played where I think the club gets everything 100% right.  I count my day there as one of my top handful of experiences I've ever had in golf.

McBride, no bar but drinks a plenty and the best clubhouse one could hope for.

JC:

What's the rate for a round of golf at the Dunes Club (the 9-hole rate)? If it's north of $35, it's not the model for anything that Ben's trying to get at with his post.

[Will MacEwen]

We have a great 9 holer in my town.  AV Macan, nice piece of land, views of the ocean.  I play about 10-15 rounds a year on it.  It is a nice cradle-to-grave kind of course - I can play there with my 10 year old.

The only drawback is that it is very crowded, which is why I would never join it as my primary club.  I'd rather play 18 in 3 hours than 9 in 2.5.

[David Harshbarger]

I am a member of a nine hole course.  It's a fine, fun course.  Our total budget is less than yours.  The staff are friendly, welcoming, and glad to have you here. Our course is a golden age course in construction, but with no provenance. Any one on this site would appreciate my home course, modest as it is. If you are in upstate NY come out to see Battenkill CC, public welcomed,

[Thomas Dai]

Ben,

9-holers are great IMO.

You're in St Andrews right? May I suggest you drive a bit further north and play the Championship course at Cruden Bay one afternoon (if you haven't done so already). But before you play CB's Championship course, play their St Olaf 9-holer. It's exactly the sort course a 9-holer should be. Holes 6 and 8 are just great and the rest are very fine too.

There's also a website dedicated to Scottish 9-hole courses. I can't remember what it's called but it's been referenced on GCA before so I'm sure someone will chip-in and provide it's title.

All the best.

[Ally Mcintosh]

Ben, I'm not sure all the costs will be halved.

You have to build a maintenance building and a clubhouse.  Could you cut them in half for a nine hole course?  Doubtful.  Even if you did there are fixed costs in any construction project that couldn't be halved.  A half size clubhouse will still need a kitchen, locker room, bar (I hope!) that would reflect the size of the membership.   Could have the crew maintain a nine hoke course?   You would need one superintendent, one GM, one pro, although I love the mom-and-pop model where some of these roles could be combined.  

I think this is the main issue...

Otherwise I agree that 9 hole courses would be making (and should be making) a huge comeback...

[Jud_T]

9-holers?  How about someone building a course below 6900 yards and/or Par 71 for starters. .

[Tom_Doak]

Nine hole courses should indeed be making a comeback.  Furthermore, some of the courses that are closing should consider keeping nine holes open and spinning off the land for the rest.

The cost of operating a nine-hole course is more than half of an 18-holer, however.  I would guess it's between 65% and 75% of the cost, because you've still got to pay a golf course superintendent and a golf pro, and you've still got to have a lot of maintenance equipment.  That makes the economics a bit difficult, but not impossible.  However --

I am a member of a 9-hole course.  Our maintenance budget is not half and the clubhouse is the same size to support an 18-hole facility, weddings, banquets, etc.

If you are trying to get into the wedding and banquet market, you are not in the golf business, you're in a different business.

[Jon Wiggett]

Ben, I'm not sure all the costs will be halved.

You have to build a maintenance building and a clubhouse.  Could you cut them in half for a nine hole course?  Doubtful.  Even if you did there are fixed costs in any construction project that couldn't be halved.  A half size clubhouse will still need a kitchen, locker room, bar (I hope!) that would reflect the size of the membership.   Could have the crew maintain a nine hoke course?   You would need one superintendent, one GM, one pro, although I love the mom-and-pop model where some of these roles could be combined.  

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of nine hole courses.  I played quite a bit as a kid at the Mare Island course in Vallejo, Calif, and really enjoyed it with completely different back nine tees.   I just don't think it's realistic to think costs would be cut in half for a nine holer.  

Bill,

I think that many of the problems of costs comes from a perception of what a course needs rather than what they need. You don't need a clubhouse with bar etc. a small changing area with toilet facilities is enough. 1 person is enough to maintain a 9 holer and 2 for 18. Why do you need a GM? or a Pro?

9 holers definitely have a future in golf.
Jon

[Ben Malach]

Thanks Thomas next time I'm up north I will check out St Olafs. I heard it was good but I was on a tight schedule so I could only fit in one round and get back in time for work the next morning.

About the cost of a superintendant. This is one of the areas where I am really out of my depth but could one be hired part time?

[Jon Wiggett]

Ben,

you might ask one of the local superintendents to advise or even share one with another club in the area.

Jon

[jeffwarne]

Nine hole courses should indeed be making a comeback.  Furthermore, some of the courses that are closing should consider keeping nine holes open and spinning off the land for the rest.

The cost of operating a nine-hole course is more than half of an 18-holer, however.  I would guess it's between 65% and 75% of the cost, because you've still got to pay a golf course superintendent and a golf pro, and you've still got to have a lot of maintenance equipment.  That makes the economics a bit difficult, but not impossible.  However --

I am a member of a 9-hole course.  Our maintenance budget is not half and the clubhouse is the same size to support an 18-hole facility, weddings, banquets, etc.

If you are trying to get into the wedding and banquet market, you are not in the golf business, you're in a different business.

+1

[Thomas Dai]

Ben,

There's also the 9-holer at Anstruther, not that far south from St Andrews, with its (im)famous 240 yd par-3 5th hole.

http://www.anstruthergolf.co.uk/anstruthergolfclub.pdf

Let us know what you reckon of the St Olaf if you get up to CB again.

All the best

[Ben Malach]

Thomas, I have played Anstruther. I found it to be a hard golf course. I was playing with one of my friends who was a member and on every hole he was like you have to hit it here or else your going to have a tough approach. When we got to the 5th he told me if I pared the hole he would by my lunch I summarily took a 6. But What i learned from the course it that fun golf can also be blow your brains out hard on alot of other challenging courses I find my self grinding. But at Anstruther I really enjoyed the golf course.

[Carson Pilcher]

Nine hole courses should indeed be making a comeback.  Furthermore, some of the courses that are closing should consider keeping nine holes open and spinning off the land for the rest.

The cost of operating a nine-hole course is more than half of an 18-holer, however.  I would guess it's between 65% and 75% of the cost, because you've still got to pay a golf course superintendent and a golf pro, and you've still got to have a lot of maintenance equipment.  That makes the economics a bit difficult, but not impossible.  However --

I am a member of a 9-hole course.  Our maintenance budget is not half and the clubhouse is the same size to support an 18-hole facility, weddings, banquets, etc.

If you are trying to get into the wedding and banquet market, you are not in the golf business, you're in a different business.

I live in Atlanta.  Every club in Atlanta (except for Peachtree) utilizes F&B to subsidize the golf operations.  Luckily for the "golfers" of our club, we have Settindown Creek that has no pool, tennis, etc and we host no parties.  However, I stand by original post.  A 9-hole facility and the subsequent budget is not 1/2 the budget of an 18-hole facility (clubhouse facilities or maintenance).

Now, do not get me wrong, I would LOVE for every club to be a golf only club.  It just is what it is.

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