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JESII

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #75 on: June 19, 2013, 09:47:21 AM »
Could be anybody Mayday...could be anybody.

Dan Herrmann

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #76 on: June 19, 2013, 09:51:48 AM »
LaRue Temple certainly did NOT suck!

Mark McKeever

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #77 on: June 19, 2013, 10:20:31 AM »
Could be anybody Mayday...could be anybody.

Probably some 15 year old with glasses wearing an Oak Hill shirt.

Mark
Best MGA showers - Bayonne

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john_stiles

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #78 on: June 19, 2013, 10:49:55 AM »

What sucked was the running commentary by USGA  equating several things....great architecture equals high scores equals great course and great technology won't defeat great architecture.

It is known that Merion has great bones, great architecture, and is a great course via many opinions over many years.   So low scoring, from the get-go, was going to be laid at the feet of technology.

All the while,   the USGA had 25 yard fairways,   greens stimping up to 14,  and rough up to 4 inches.   The architecture was largely hidden by the set up.    The USGA was beside themselves about the scoring,  absolutely giddy.

It sucked that it was scoring versus architecture, and scoring had to win for the USGA to say  SEE. ALL IS OKAY. THE BEST PLAYERS COULD BARELY BREAK PAR.

Mark Bourgeois

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #79 on: June 19, 2013, 06:01:09 PM »
1) Luke Donald tweeted that modern architects needed to study Merion because it was a great example that length was not needed to make a challenging course...something to that effect. I was astounded that he advocated going to the lengths they did to make distance less of an issue: narrow fairways and deep ass rough. Try that at your neighborhood course. He didn't even mention the greens. The stupidity in his statements amazed me almost as much as some English architect tweeting him in response that he needed to help them design a golf course.


Isn't this a self-serving argument on his part? That kind of setup is likely to favor his game over others'.

Re sustainability, that half-inch fairway thing had to be a last-minute effort to lengthen the course and mess with ball spin / control. My hunch is "sustainability" lasted all the way up until the fairways started drying out. They didn't look half-inch to me on Saturday, but I'm no expert and I didn't bring a ruler.
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Tom ORourke

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #80 on: June 20, 2013, 09:29:53 PM »
I was a volunteer in the merchandise tent so I both worked and spectated. A few things struck me:

1. How about one mid-length par 3, something in the 175 -180 range? Either 3 or 9 could have been set up that way.

2. The merchandise tent was basically sold out on Saturday. I worked Sunday. I did not sell one shirt by Adidas, Cutter & Buck, Under Armour, Ralph Lauren or Fairways and Greens. They were all gone before Sunday. I sold 3 Nike shirts, all XXXL. All of the hats were gone as well. They could have sold at least 5 to 6,000 more hats, and another 5 to 10,000 shirts. If you hear about the USGA not making enough money at Merion part of it is their underestimation of the Philly crowd purchasing ability. Some number of people had tickets only for Sunday and had almost no viable merchandise available. That should not happen.

3. The second round finished around 9:30 Saturday morning. Instead of sending guys out quickly the USGA decided that TV was more important and went with threesomes off spilt tees starting at 12:30. That meant that for 3 hours on a gorgeous Saturday morning 25,000 spectators sat on a golf course WITH NO GOLFERS! That was really boring for just about every sober spectator.

4. The 18th green seems to be too severe at these speeds. When the guys finished Saturday morning many of them came up short in 2. The pin was middle left, and most chips either came back to their feet or went to the back fringe. The fifth green is tough enough but you have a better chance at holding that green than 18.

Overall I thought it was an A or B+ week for the course. I would have been happy if the winning score was -10 but I obviously do not work for the USGA. The greens seemed to confuse most players and that was a major reason for the high scores. I was okay with that. I hope they go back. Good job on most of the grandstands, especially behind 17 green.

Joe Bausch

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #81 on: June 21, 2013, 01:40:34 AM »
If you hear about the USGA not making enough money at Merion part of it is their underestimation of the Philly crowd purchasing ability.

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Charlie Gallagher

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #82 on: June 21, 2013, 10:06:22 AM »
Kelly,
  You and others have made lots of good observations. I especially agree that the narrowness and fairway movement on certain holes was unneeded, 2 being a prime example. The USGA blathering on aboiut great classic architecture while they did the things they did to render it irrelevant is also well stated. Once again, it's why I much prefer the Open Championship to the US Open. I get to see creativity and problem solving via a variety of techniques, not just wedge flops. The point about tv coverage was a good one as well, I wondered why there was no golf in two somes after the cut. It could have been set up quickly at the conclusion of round two. Re cut the cups into new hole locations and go.

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #83 on: June 23, 2013, 04:05:47 PM »
Tom I find it unbelievable the USGA employed volunteers to sell their merchandise. Volunteers should be used to help make the event run not make them money.

Volunteers at the British Amateur received a decent embossed waterproof jacket and cap, free of charge, as well as meals for the hours worked.
Cave Nil Vino

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #84 on: June 23, 2013, 04:39:04 PM »
Brian - it's denying workers of wages as would using volunteers for things such as car parking. Marshalls, players drivers, practise ground assistants, scoreboards, etc are volunteer jobs.
Cave Nil Vino

john_stiles

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #85 on: June 23, 2013, 05:21:22 PM »

The gentlemen from England are surely chuckling as they prod those from USA.  Good on R&A is about all I can say.

Okay,  I'll bite and continue.

Having volunteered for early 90s PGA events, Ryder Cup at Oakland Hills, and a few USGA events,  volunteers get nada, zilch, zero.

Okay, okay, food is often included though.  Yeah !

At PGA events (the two I was involved with)  you are expected (required is a better word) to buy  event merchandise.  At PGA event, I think that was a shirt and hat.   At Ryder Cup,  it was more than a shirt but I forget exactly was it was.  It was about $100 or so though.  They want the volunteers to be more easily identified to the public and to each other. 

My USGA event was not the US Am but memory is that we did not have to buy,  but I forget.  Other than club members, volunteers, players plus player friends,  I  would guess the Womens Mid Am drew less than 200 per day as a wild guess.  Other than US Open, Womens Open, and Senior US Open,  it would be interesting to hear if any of the othe USGA events even make money, even with volunteers unpaid.

Would be interesting to hear if volunteers were required to buy US Open apparel.

The English are having a good time with us,  even taunting I say, with the free rain gear jab.

How else could the local organizers who are very generous with money and time, and the local volunteers giving their time, how could the local organizers, and PGA Tour,   raise so much money for charity.

You go VOLUNTEERS !

John........from the Volunteer state

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #86 on: June 23, 2013, 05:39:02 PM »
John - the Amateur championship must cost the R&A many tens of thousands of pounds to run. Giving out 140 volunteers jackets and hats isn't that expensive.

I have no doubt the primary object of the USGA and the PGA tour is raising money for charity.
Cave Nil Vino

Dónal Ó Ceallaigh

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #87 on: June 23, 2013, 05:42:53 PM »
I was a volunteer at the Scandinavian Masters a few week ago. We worked about 4 hours per day and got the following free: lunch, parking, coffee & snacks, golf cap, rain jacket, polo shirt, voucher for reduced price of matching rain gear throusers and entry for the days we didn't work as volunteers. The rest of the time we could spend watching the tournament.

I don't see working the parking lot as denying anyone a wage, as we don't have parking attendants anyway. That job is definitely the short straw when it comes to volunteering.

Dónal Ó Ceallaigh

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #88 on: June 23, 2013, 05:51:35 PM »
Years ago I remember Sam Snead saying that the only way Merion was a US Open worthy venue was if they grew the rough up to your "fanny" (his word, not mine). Was he right? 

The rough was penal, but not only because of its height; I read somewhere (probably Golfweek.com) that they spent time before every round raking the rough so that a player would have to hit most every shot into the grain.  If true, there's some cruelty in that decision!

Terry, that is true. During the rain delay on the first day they showed one of the ground's staff raking or brushing the grass collar around one of the greens. Why not let the grass lie as it is? I've never seen that before.

john_stiles

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #89 on: June 23, 2013, 06:03:30 PM »
Mark,

Agree.  

As to the charitable nature,  this is also the goal of the hundreds and hundreds of volunteers and the local sponsors who work long hours getting local sponsors, raising money at every event benefit their charities.

The local people who run the web.com in my hometown work very long hours when you consider the work for next years event begins a few weeks after the last one ends.  Frankly, without the volunteers, I am not sure how many web.com events could even be held.  PGA Tour might be different but it would cost quite a bit to run those events without a host of volunteers.

Take care,
John
« Last Edit: June 23, 2013, 06:21:49 PM by john_stiles »

Tom ORourke

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #90 on: June 23, 2013, 09:50:45 PM »
We actually paid to be volunteers. We bought 2 shirts (cotton, not clima-cool, so I will be wearing them in the fall, not in summer in South Carolina) a non-functional wind jacket which will never be worn on a golf course, a visor (yes!) and a water bottle. We did 4 shifts of about 5 hours. It was a lot of work to stand in one place for 5 hours but worthwhile. My wife and I did this and we did feel like we were part of the Open experience and don't regret it. We are getting too old to do it again, but once was nice. A number of people came up to us as we spectated to ask for information and we were able to help, so we felt like we were among the group that helped Merion have an Open. I can live with that.  There were volunteers that ran the tent that came from all over the country and they had some expenses paid, but they worked from 6 AM to 9 PM every day and were on a different level than what we did. Overall I think most volunteers that I spoke with were glad they did it, and the USGA folks that I talked to raved about the support that was there, so it was not a black eye for Philly fans, but exactly the opposite. The fans that came through the tent were marvelous and I feel like we did some charity work for an organization that does not need much charity, but we did help the game of golf to some degree. I would not have minded a little discount on merchandise but we did get a free lunch voucher each day that was worth around $13 for a hamburger, snack, and soda. That helped.

Terry Lavin

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Re: What Sucked about Merion This Week?
« Reply #91 on: June 24, 2013, 11:51:17 AM »
We actually paid to be volunteers. We bought 2 shirts (cotton, not clima-cool, so I will be wearing them in the fall, not in summer in South Carolina) a non-functional wind jacket which will never be worn on a golf course, a visor (yes!) and a water bottle. We did 4 shifts of about 5 hours. It was a lot of work to stand in one place for 5 hours but worthwhile. My wife and I did this and we did feel like we were part of the Open experience and don't regret it. We are getting too old to do it again, but once was nice. A number of people came up to us as we spectated to ask for information and we were able to help, so we felt like we were among the group that helped Merion have an Open. I can live with that.  There were volunteers that ran the tent that came from all over the country and they had some expenses paid, but they worked from 6 AM to 9 PM every day and were on a different level than what we did. Overall I think most volunteers that I spoke with were glad they did it, and the USGA folks that I talked to raved about the support that was there, so it was not a black eye for Philly fans, but exactly the opposite. The fans that came through the tent were marvelous and I feel like we did some charity work for an organization that does not need much charity, but we did help the game of golf to some degree. I would not have minded a little discount on merchandise but we did get a free lunch voucher each day that was worth around $13 for a hamburger, snack, and soda. That helped.

This is entirely consistent with my recollection of the volunteers' experience at the 2003 US Open.
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