The greatest courses that no longer exist

« **Reply #25 on:** May 05, 2013, 10:40:02 AM »

I wonder how good Tillinghast's Upper Montclair Country Club, Clifton, NJ was before they plowed it under to build the Garden State Parkway. (Robert Trent Jones came in and built 27 new holes.)

In looking at old aerial photos, I see the most unusual cross bunker built by Tilly: a 55 yard wide by 8 feet long rectangular bunker that completelt blocked the fairway. (It was completely filled in in 1954.)

http://www.historicaerials.com/

« **Reply #26 on:** May 05, 2013, 11:42:45 AM »

The original Banff Springs course. Would be nice to see.

« **Reply #27 on:** May 08, 2013, 01:49:36 PM »

Singer Island

Lester

« **Reply #28 on:** May 08, 2013, 02:06:58 PM »

Do any of the Doak courses that have gone under deserve consideration?

« **Reply #29 on:** May 08, 2013, 02:11:33 PM »

Jason,

No ass kissing please.

How about the Oneck Course in Westhampton Beach ?

The AWT Mountain Ridge in West Orange, NJ

« **Reply #30 on:** May 08, 2013, 02:17:50 PM »

Quote from: Patrick_Mucci on May 08, 2013, 02:11:33 PM

Jason,
No ass kissing please.

I am not sure which way my comment cuts.

« **Reply #31 on:** May 08, 2013, 03:39:46 PM »

Augusta National as seen on that video game..

« **Reply #32 on:** May 08, 2013, 04:28:47 PM »

How many courses that were ever on the GD or GM 100 lists are no longer operating?

« **Reply #33 on:** May 08, 2013, 05:00:15 PM »

Slightly OT, but Rich Mandell did an opinion piece on the best course that NEVER existed, being one he was passed over for a big name who (in his opinion) probably mailed it in. I know I have had some courses that I know I could have done better, with more passion than the one selected for the real design.

So, perhaps we could expand the premise to courses that never got created, although it might get boring to have 15,000 individual examples (every course in the US) that would have been better off with Doak or CC doing it.......but there are definitely some courses out there that would have looked a lot different had they been designed by someone else.

« **Reply #34 on:** May 08, 2013, 05:02:58 PM »

Brian there are plenty of articles praising the New over the Old at the Addington, but like Walton Heath and Sunningdale, each has it’s own advocates. It was a serious loss though.

Quote from: Jon Wiggett on May 05, 2013, 06:34:25 AM

Somewhat of a side-track but what do people think is the best NLE that could be resurrected?

Jon

Jon just needs some TLC and a massive change of heart from the National Trust and the best 9 hole Hickory course could be resurrected.

Brian they are plenty of articles praising the New over the Old at the Addington, but like Walton Heath and Sunningdale, each has it’s own advocates. It was a serious loss though.

Quote from: Jon Wiggett on May 05, 2013, 06:34:25 AM

Somewhat of a side-track but what do people think is the best NLE that could be resurrected?

Jon

Jon just needs some TLC and a massive change of heart from the National Trust and the best 9 hole Hickory course could be resurrected.

« **Reply #35 on:** May 08, 2013, 05:03:38 PM »

Best course I've played that no longer exists: the original Sutton Bay.

« **Reply #36 on:** May 08, 2013, 06:36:39 PM »

Jeff Brauer:

I think your slightly OT is appropriate, though perhaps on a different thread.

I currently live in Houston (not exactly a golf Mecca!), but in the late 1990s I lived in Cleveland and joined Sand Ridge Golf Club, a Tom Fazio course out in Chardon.

Sand Ridge made a quick dash into the Golf Digest Top 100 before falling off the radar screen several years later. But, it will always be special to me because it is the only course I got to spend lots of time at during construction. That experience and being member exposed me to many of the routing plans that didn't make the final cut (mostly due to environmental permitting issues). In all, Fazio did about 25 different plans and many were quite different than the final selection.

IMO, the truth is that the final selection wasn't really anywhere near as interesting as several of the other rejected plans. It's too bad. I would have liked to play many of the holes that were never built.

« **Reply #37 on:** May 08, 2013, 07:08:22 PM »

Colt built a couple of links courses along the North Sea coast of Holland and Belgium that no longer exist that I would have loved to have seen. Specifically Oostvoorne just south of Rotterdam, the old course at Noordwijk just north of the village. Both in Holland.
In Belgium the original course at Knokke, which was amazing, but now is lost and near the French border a links course he mentioned as maybe one of his best... Under housing now.

« **Reply #38 on:** May 08, 2013, 07:33:07 PM »

Timber Point, Huntington Crescent by Emmet. Crescent had Devereux Emmet's wonderful variety of holes on dramatic inland terrain. Timber Point had remarkable angles, strategy and scenery. Charles Alison is masterful !

I would have loved to have seen Northport and Pomonok, both are Emmet designs near NYC. Pomonok's bold bunkering, evocative of NGLA, and the huge greens were superb.

The neatest NLE that I DID see twice, around 1978, was the Links Club near Manhasset, Long Island. a lovely MMacdoald school design with 6,300 yards of charm

« **Reply #39 on:** May 08, 2013, 07:39:47 PM »

What about Foulpointe in Madagascar

« **Reply #40 on:** May 09, 2013, 01:01:15 AM »

Wayne,

Any man who hasn't checked out the Foulpointe site isn't really a die hard golf architecture student. The place is awesome!

« **Reply #41 on:** May 09, 2013, 08:05:58 AM »

Quote from: Greg Tallman on May 08, 2013, 04:28:47 PM

How many courses that were ever on the GD or GM 100 lists are no longer operating?

Greg,

That's a good question

« **Reply #42 on:** May 09, 2013, 08:28:33 AM »

Tim,

Interesting take on playing the numerous routings gca's might have come up with. With environmental restrictions, I can tell you lots of good routings (and even re-routings) are left on the drawing board. I used to letter my routings, but on a few projects, exceeded the nominal max of 26........so I went to numbers instead. It only SEEMS like I would need the infinity symbol on some projects.....

Even in redos, just yesterday wetlands considerations stopped a few key aspects of a reroute. Taking out a double fw concept and one tee extension that would have made a hole much more interesting to get around the corner.

« **Reply #43 on:** May 09, 2013, 09:26:47 AM »

Mark,

Agree on Pomonok...site of a PGA Championship I believe...RHE...Now under the LIE and St John's

« **Reply #44 on:** May 09, 2013, 10:16:10 AM »

In the state of Connecticut, courses that presently exist, but not as they once did, that I would have loved to play on their opening day include Shennecossett, Greenwich Country Club and Country Club of Fairfield.

« **Reply #45 on:** May 09, 2013, 11:00:57 AM »

Ross' Richland CC which hosted the 1980 U. S. Women's Open in Nashville.

« **Reply #46 on:** May 09, 2013, 11:07:17 AM »

Standard response - Princes.

Ciao

« **Reply #47 on:** May 09, 2013, 11:29:55 AM »

Not a ton of information on it, but Royal Palms must have been something.

« **Reply #48 on:** May 09, 2013, 11:49:59 AM »

El Boquerón, a course designed by Mackenzie for Mr. Anchorena in his ranch in Argentina. I think there is some discussion in here about the possibility of somebody building that same course in Texas, based on the original Mackenzie maps.

« **Reply #49 on:** May 09, 2013, 04:13:47 PM »

didnt there used to be another course adjacent to Kilmarnock Barrasie?

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