Underrated

[Malcolm Mckinnon]

Every time that I play Springdale GC. in Princeton. NJ I think about the the fact that William Flynn rebuilt the the golf course in 1926  as a tribute to his friend and mentor Hugh Wilson.

Underrated, for sure!

Great green complexes, of course!

[Carl Rogers]

Jason-Good call on Ballyhack. 

because it is so viciously difficult!

Tom D's Riverfront in Suffolk, VA

[Tim Martin]

Shennecossett Golf Club
Keney Park

[Mark McKeever]

Mark,

Fair enough...  Would you agree they are under-rated by golf digest standard?

Absolutely!  Luckily Golfweek gives them some more praise.

Mark

[Parker Reeves]

Awesome replies everyone.  Keep them coming!

[Ben Voelker]

A few that come to mind immediately off the top of my head:

Knoll (West) in Parsippany, NJ - A great Banks in North Jersey that almost no one I meet even knows exists, let alone had the opportunity to judge.

Bayside in Brule, NE - I really feel this is the red headed stepchild of the central US prairie golf movement.  The back nine is a bit extreme, but I though it was very, very good.

Highlands in Lincoln, NE - I grew up playing this course and I think it is exactly what public golf should be; inexpensive to build, inexpensive to play with loads of architectural interest, especially on the front 9.

I would also second Lulu and Atlantic City.

Also, while I haven't played it yet, Twisted Dune looks really neat.

[Mac Plumart]

Rustic Canyon

[Jud_T]

two courses in California on good but not GREAT sites - Riviera and Pasatiempo - why does Riv get so much love by raters (31 in the world says Golf magazine) and Pasa comparatively less? Not a rhetorical question by the way...

'Cause one's private, holds Tour events and is in great condition and the other is a public track that only plays firm a couple months a year?

[Mark McKeever]

A few that come to mind immediately off the top of my head:

Knoll (West) in Parsippany, NJ - A great Banks in North Jersey that almost no one I meet even knows exists, let alone had the opportunity to judge.

Bayside in Brule, NE - I really feel this is the red headed stepchild of the central US prairie golf movement.  The back nine is a bit extreme, but I though it was very, very good.

Highlands in Lincoln, NE - I grew up playing this course and I think it is exactly what public golf should be; inexpensive to build, inexpensive to play with loads of architectural interest, especially on the front 9.

I would also second Lulu and Atlantic City.

Also, while I haven't played it yet, Twisted Dune looks really neat.

Ben, if the Knoll can just get the momentum to reclaim some of the lost putting surface, I think it would get A LOT more recognition!!

Mark

[John Shimony]

I'll be the first to second McKeever's metion of Eastward Ho!.  I've not gotten around like a lot of members of this site by Ho!'s use of its dramatically rolling topography addes loads of excitement and interest to nearly every hole.  Pair that with beautiful bay and ocean views and it's all world.

[Lou_Duran]

The most underrated course IMO is OSU's Scarlet, at least before renovation.  It was a stern test of golf, and despite being very under-managed for decades, it provided me great pleasure and the stimulus to learn to play golf at a higher level.  It is not the cup-of-tea for many on this site who prefer a wider, more "playable" course, but as a starter there for one season, it never ceased to amaze me how bogie (and higher) and distance-impaired golfers would wait for hours to get on the first tee for a 5-6 hour round while the much friendlier, fun Gray was often wide open.

Dayton's NCR-South is another one.  I haven't played nearby Morraine, but a well-travelled golfer (and a member of a Top 100 club) I know competed in a three-day senior event there in the past couple of years and raved about it- great green complexes.  Ohio is very golf-rich at the private club level.  

[Tom Allen]

Great call on NCR and Moraine being underrated.  I played Moraine in an Ohio Am qualifier years ago and those were some of the toughest greens I've ever seen.  In tournament conditions, they were lightning fast especially with those slopes--I saw someone four-putt from 5 feet.  Granted he still ended up at even par and qualifying while I struggled home :-)  I've never played it, but have also heard great things about Springfield CC too. 

Tom, have you ever played Windy Knoll around Springfield? 

Hi Chris.  I have played Windy Knoll, and really enjoyed it.  Very nice layout.  Now that you mention Springfield:  Springfield Country Club, which was mentioned by someone above, is a very nice Donald Ross gem I also enjoyed a lot.  I putted completely off two greens there--either more slope than I envisioned, or they were faster than I thought (or I am simply a bad putter--probably that ).  It was a real challenge, and thoroughly enjoyable.

I agree with Lou--Ohio really does have some outstanding choices for golf (albeit most of the great ones are private).  I'd like to eventually venture north and play a few of the courses up that way.  I read about them a lot, but have not played any of them yet (other than Inverness, which all readers here know about).

[Jim Nugent]

Rock Creek Cattle Company.  Golf Week ranks it 15 among the nation's modern courses.  But neither GD nor GM rank it at all.  I bet outside GCA it's not well known at all. 

[Ben Voelker]

A few that come to mind immediately off the top of my head:

Knoll (West) in Parsippany, NJ - A great Banks in North Jersey that almost no one I meet even knows exists, let alone had the opportunity to judge.

Bayside in Brule, NE - I really feel this is the red headed stepchild of the central US prairie golf movement.  The back nine is a bit extreme, but I though it was very, very good.

Highlands in Lincoln, NE - I grew up playing this course and I think it is exactly what public golf should be; inexpensive to build, inexpensive to play with loads of architectural interest, especially on the front 9.

I would also second Lulu and Atlantic City.

Also, while I haven't played it yet, Twisted Dune looks really neat.

Ben, if the Knoll can just get the momentum to reclaim some of the lost putting surface, I think it would get A LOT more recognition!!

Mark

Mark,

I had never thought about green loss before.  It is interesting to look at the aerial images from Google Maps as I now notice a number of holes where there is clearly some room for expansion.  Thanks for that.

No doubt the conditioning is part of the issue as well.  I am a public golfer, and I think its condition compares well with the other public facilities in the area, but surely is lacking compared to the more highly rated courses.

Lastly, I think Knoll West is an interesting case study in the effect of marketing on the perception of public golf.  Through last year, they only accepted cash, have a poor website compared to other courses in the area, and do not seem particularly interested in attracting play outside of the residents of Parsippany.  I have played with a number of people that live within 30 miles of it who do not realize it EXISTS.  In this day and age, that is amazing to me.

[Michael George]

I have a hidden gem whose routing and hole designs are incredible.  It has wonderful shot opportunities and is a great walk in the park.  The conditioning is spotty due to being public golf courses in a bad market, but every student of golf course architecture should visit it.

Fowler's Mill - an early Pete Dye design whose minimalistic lay-out, topography and strategic options remind me of The Golf Club.  While one nine is called the Lake and one is called the River, there is not a significant difference in the topography or feel of the nines, except for the use of a lake on #4.  #4-12 are probably the strength of the course.  The 4th is a wonderful Cape that plays entirely around a lake.  The 6th is a dogleg that you can pick your line off the tee but are left with a very elevated green that requires a well hit shot.  7 is a downhill par 3 that is reminiscent of #7 at Pete Dye GC.  The 8th is a strategic par 5 where you can go for 2 if you can carry 230-240 of bunkers or hit considerably out to the right for a 3 shot hole.  The 9th and 12th holes use a creek to divide the fairway in half and provide quite a bit of excitement.  17 and 18 are quite a nice finish as well.   

I am sure all of us have those courses that you would absolutely love to buy and allow it to fulfill its true potential.  This is mine.  A truly special golf course built by Pete Dye.

[J_ Crisham]

Lancaster CC is the epitome of underrated- if it was here in Chicago it would be top 4. In Philly it is under the radar even to locals-some  have little desire to venture out West of town to see just how good it is. Sad . Should be top 40 US IMO.

[John Scharon]

I have a hidden gem whose routing and hole designs are incredible.  It has wonderful shot opportunities and is a great walk in the park.  The conditioning is spotty due to being public golf courses in a bad market, but every student of golf course architecture should visit it.

Fowler's Mill - an early Pete Dye design whose minimalistic lay-out, topography and strategic options remind me of The Golf Club.  While one nine is called the Lake and one is called the River, there is not a significant difference in the topography or feel of the nines, except for the use of a lake on #4.  #4-12 are probably the strength of the course.  The 4th is a wonderful Cape that plays entirely around a lake.  The 6th is a dogleg that you can pick your line off the tee but are left with a very elevated green that requires a well hit shot.  7 is a downhill par 3 that is reminiscent of #7 at Pete Dye GC.  The 8th is a strategic par 5 where you can go for 2 if you can carry 230-240 of bunkers or hit considerably out to the right for a 3 shot hole.  The 9th and 12th holes use a creek to divide the fairway in half and provide quite a bit of excitement.  17 and 18 are quite a nice finish as well.   

I am sure all of us have those courses that you would absolutely love to buy and allow it to fulfill its true potential.  This is mine.  A truly special golf course built by Pete Dye.

Michael,

Fowler's Mill is a gem, and little known outside of NE Ohio.  How different would it be today had the membership of Acacia (NLE) accepted the swap offered by then-owner TRW?  I wish you had bought it.  A group of guys at my club talked about buying it when it was put up for sale in the 80's.  I seem to remember the ridiculously low price of $2 million would have gotten it done.  Back then, it was considered just too far away. 

John 

[Brian Colbert]

Parker,

Welcome. I graduated from Villanova and was a member of the golf team there for four years. I am sure we have some mutual friends. My courses that I see as underrated are:

Ballyneal - gets a ton of deserved hype on this board but is completely disrespected in some of the magazines.

Commonground - fantastic Tom doak design and a great model for public golf

Cherry hills - though I have yet to play shinnecock, this is far and away the best Flynn I have ever seen.

Baltusrol upper - for my money, more fun and difficult than its more famous counterpart.

White manor - I belong to this club, and it is a fantastic modern bobby weed with a ton of strategic interest. I think it flies under the radar because some of its neighbors are Aronimink, merion, applebrook, and waynesborough.

Beverly - a fantastic Donald Ross. Completely unique in the Chicago area with 18 fun holes. If only they could pull out some trees!

Philadelphia cricket club wissahickon - a great tillinghast. I am anxiously awaiting the restoration they have planned. Although I'd say based on one recent admission, they need stricter membership criteria .

Monroe - another great course with a great invitational. Deserves consideration for top 100 lists.

[Kevin_D]

After playing it this past weekend, I would definitely say Stonewall North Course

[Mark McKeever]

Philadelphia cricket club wissahickon - a great tillinghast. I am anxiously awaiting the restoration they have planned. Although I'd say based on one recent admission, they need stricter membership criteria .

Brutal...

MM

[J_ Crisham]

Parker,

Welcome. I graduated from Villanova and was a member of the golf team there for four years. I am sure we have some mutual friends. My courses that I see as underrated are:

Ballyneal - gets a ton of deserved hype on this board but is completely disrespected in some of the magazines.

Commonground - fantastic Tom doak design and a great model for public golf

Cherry hills - though I have yet to play shinnecock, this is far and away the best Flynn I have ever seen.

Baltusrol upper - for my money, more fun and difficult than its more famous counterpart.

White manor - I belong to this club, and it is a fantastic modern bobby weed with a ton of strategic interest. I think it flies under the radar because some of its neighbors are Aronimink, merion, applebrook, and waynesborough.

Beverly - a fantastic Donald Ross. Completely unique in the Chicago area with 18 fun holes. If only they could pull out some trees!

Philadelphia cricket club wissahickon - a great tillinghast. I am anxiously awaiting the restoration they have planned. Although I'd say based on one recent admission, they need stricter membership criteria .

Monroe - another great course with a great invitational. Deserves consideration for top 100 lists.

Brian,  Thanks for the thumbs up on Beverly - not sure when you last played here but we took out about 600 trees. Nature has additionaly removed some old oaks and elms. We also just completed our bunker reno. Last year was as good as I've seen Bev look since 1978 IMO.

[Brian Colbert]

Parker,

Welcome. I graduated from Villanova and was a member of the golf team there for four years. I am sure we have some mutual friends. My courses that I see as underrated are:

Ballyneal - gets a ton of deserved hype on this board but is completely disrespected in some of the magazines.

Commonground - fantastic Tom doak design and a great model for public golf

Cherry hills - though I have yet to play shinnecock, this is far and away the best Flynn I have ever seen.

Baltusrol upper - for my money, more fun and difficult than its more famous counterpart.

White manor - I belong to this club, and it is a fantastic modern bobby weed with a ton of strategic interest. I think it flies under the radar because some of its neighbors are Aronimink, merion, applebrook, and waynesborough.

Beverly - a fantastic Donald Ross. Completely unique in the Chicago area with 18 fun holes. If only they could pull out some trees!

Philadelphia cricket club wissahickon - a great tillinghast. I am anxiously awaiting the restoration they have planned. Although I'd say based on one recent admission, they need stricter membership criteria .

Monroe - another great course with a great invitational. Deserves consideration for top 100 lists.

Brian,  Thanks for the thumbs up on Beverly - not sure when you last played here but we took out about 600 trees. Nature has additionaly removed some old oaks and elms. We also just completed our bunker reno. Last year was as good as I've seen Bev look since 1978 IMO.

Jack,

Last time I played Beverly was the 2010 state am. This is the first I'm hearing of tree work. Truly excited for the members. One of my favorite ross courses anywhere, and he's my favorite architect.

[J_ Crisham]

Brian,  the tree work was about 10 yrs ago-I agree we could take out a few more- some are needed for safety given the parallel holes and close proximity of green/tees. We have the Western Am next year so it will be interesting to see how Bev handles the best Ams in the world.

[Brian Colbert]

Jack,

I see what you mean regarding player safety in some of those spots. I look forward to the western am there and hope to play in it. The course certainly held up in the state amateur and the western junior. Next year will be an interesting study.

[Rory Connaughton]

Jack, thanks for your kind words about Lancaster.
As luck would have it, I think we are beginning to emerge a bit.  2015 Women's Open, AJGA Rolex Tournament of Champions this year and a Women's Western Am all on the horizon. Our green work from last year is in a much more mature state and has really enhanced the strategic interest of the course