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Brian Potash

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Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« on: April 29, 2013, 08:01:03 PM »
http://thecourseatyale.org/


I know much has been written about The Course at Yale.  I played it for the first time today and thought I'd share my thoughts.

The course opens at 12p on Mondays.  I made the first tee time, no one was there to join me, and I was off at 1140a.  Finished up 3 hours later.  Carried my own bag.  90 minutes from downtown Manhattan, no big deal.

I knew the course was going to be BIG.  Indeed it was.  But not just in the sense that the course covers 700 rolling acres with some tremendous greens.  It was such a wide open course that even though it was not easy (rating around 72 for a par 70 and slope 135), I always felt that I could take a full swing without feeling constrained or fearful.  With my game (12 index), this almost always means I play better and have more fun.

The course was unique in that there were so many blind shots, big hills, bells to ring, deep bunkers, aiming targets, etc.  The course had a very old school feel (built in 1926).  There was a lot of walking forward a good distance from my ball to figure out where to hit.  All in all, this made for a very long walk, but a good day of exercise.  I would describe the conditioning as "fair", but it didn't really negatively impact my round, or enjoyment at all.

There were many template holes (redan, biarritz, eden, alps, short).  What I really liked is that I am at the point in my GCA education where when I saw "nose" as the name of a hole, I figured there would be a principal's nose bunker, which of course there was.  3 years ago I would have had no idea what that meant.  A few years from now this will probably be no big deal.  This reminds me of when I was starting to follow the Grateful Dead.  At the beginning I had no idea what the songs were.  At the end, unless I heard a certain grouping of songs I was disappointed.  It was the middle, or the "sweet spot" that was the best.  Hopefully the GCA sweet spot lasts longer than the Grateful Dead sweet spot.

Where was I.....

Holes to note -

# 3 (Blind) -  A difficult hole to play for the first time, both to determine where to land your drive and then the blind shot to the green.  I found the hazard on the right, but was able to play from the hazard and salvage a bogey.

# 5 (Short) - I really like the short template hole.  My favorite one is at Sleepy Hollow.  For some reason they never play as easy for me as they should.  I thought this one looked great, except for my score (5).  

# 7 (Lane) - Just a wide open hole to an elevated green.  Fit my eye nicely.

# 9 (Biarritz) - This lived up to the hype.  The shot across the water was much easier because there was no one in sight.  Even the halfway house was closed.  The pin was in the front, but I took a practice putt from way back and through the swale, which was fun.  This swale was more extreme than the other Biarritz holes I have played at Greenbrier and Tamarack in CT.

#10 (Carries) - A blind tee shot with a second that that plays to a very elevated green.  I added 25 yards to account for the elevation and some wind and still found the large front bunker.  Not an easy start to the back 9.

# 14 (Knoll) - The only hole I kept driver in the bag, as I thought I would go through the fairway.  This hole was a contrast with most of the other wide open holes and was a good change of pace.

# 15 (Eden) - Relatively easy par 3.  175 yards.  I made birdie so it stood out.

# 17 (Nose) - I think the principal's nose is such a cool feature.  So old school.  Tough drive over a lake uphill to the fairway.  Long second shot as well which carries the principals nose.  I think this was the longest par 4 on the course.

# 18 (Home) -  Par 5 with the first shot semi-blind and the second shot totally blind.  Had to walk forward a good deal to get the line.  Not my favorite finishing hole, but would be more fun after repeated play.

All in all a great day.  I look forward to my next trip to New Haven and The Course at Yale.

Brian
« Last Edit: April 30, 2013, 11:32:06 AM by Brian Potash »

Keith Phillips

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2013, 08:35:16 PM »
I played Yale for the first time last Fall as part of an Outpost event (welcome!!) - the course blew me away - I think the word 'big' is apt...it is a big property with dramatic terrain and some phenomenal green complexes - I actually thought the 'short' was one of the poorer holes on the course.  The conditioning was mediocre in late-Fall, and I think Yale could be a top-20 course with private club conditions

Scott Warren

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2013, 10:25:40 PM »
The great shame of my one play at Yale was that it started pouring with rain on the 16th tee and I only got to walk the final three holes.

What's worse - Tom Dunne and Chip Gaskins will surely attest - was that if I hadn't torched 10-15 minutes pre-round waiting in the dining room for a chicken sandwich we would have got out in front of a slow fourball, would never have been saddled with the slowest and most annoying playing partner of all time (he's still grinding over that four-foot putt for a 7 at the 18th!) and would have comfortably finished before the rain!

The scale of the course is immense and the variety of the holes and features is wonderful. As an engineering feat alone, it is mind boggling.

Rory Connaughton said that perhaps the biggest compliment he could pay to Yale was that he starts smiling on the first tee and doesn't stop until the 18th green. That sums it up - the course is chock full of exciting shots, fun greens and unique holes.

I'll definitely be back to see those final three holes properly next time I'm in the area.

Jon Byron

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2013, 12:36:22 AM »
Brian - I have played Yale may times and I am in NYC. Let me know and let's do it again. 18 great golf holes.
Haven't played since yesterday, not playing until tomorrow, hardly playing at all!

Tom Culley

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2013, 06:35:15 AM »
Brian, do the conditions of the course allow a ball to land at the front of the biarritz, and then release to the back half?

I have never played a biarritz but find it a really interesting concept. I understand that with the technology of old players HAD to try to play the chasing shot to the back... but with modern technology, are players able to simply fly to a back pin position if conditions allow it?

Has the advancement of technology made greenkeepers have to really firm up holes like Biarritz and Redan in order to defend them?
"Play the ball as it lies, play the course as you find it, and if you cannot do either, do what is fair. But to do what is fair, you need to know the Rules of Golf."

Brian Potash

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2013, 07:08:58 AM »
Tom,

I think to land on the front half of the green and then roll through the hugh swale all the way to the top/back of the green you would really need to hit a low shot.  Even then it would be really difficult.  And this is after clearing a 175 or so yard carry over the lake.  Tough shot!!  At least too tough for me.

John Mayhugh

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2013, 07:48:33 AM »
Tom,
That's the biggest problem with Biarritz greens combined with today's ball flight. 

Brian,
I think the 18th is one spot at Yale where you really wish you had taken a cart.

Tim Martin

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2013, 08:10:12 AM »
Brian, do the conditions of the course allow a ball to land at the front of the biarritz, and then release to the back half?

I have never played a biarritz but find it a really interesting concept. I understand that with the technology of old players HAD to try to play the chasing shot to the back... but with modern technology, are players able to simply fly to a back pin position if conditions allow it?

Has the advancement of technology made greenkeepers have to really firm up holes like Biarritz and Redan in order to defend them?

Tom-From the back tee I have to hit a fairway wood and will occasionally get one to chase through the swale to a back pin. To watch it disappear and then reappear on the proper level is as good as it gets.

Sven Nilsen

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2013, 09:16:20 AM »
Brian:

I liked your GD analogy with respect to how you've hit the sweetspot of your appreciation of GCA.  Perhaps you can extend the thought a bit to how a setlist is akin to a routing. 

As you mentioned, certain songs often go better together, just like certain combinations of golf holes work well.  Care to point out the CCS>IKYR, Scarlet>Fire, Help>Slip>Franklin or Anything>Cumberland of Yale?

Sven
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Colin Sheehan

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2013, 09:42:07 AM »
Brian,
Delighted to read your dispatch. The course is still a few weeks behind it's normal spring schedule, which is the case for all golf courses in the northeast this year. I look forward to joining you on a weekday in June when it is much more grown in.

I agree with you about the sweet spot of intellectual discovery I felt that way about jazz for a number of years and now I'm currently in the thick of it with classical music, like getting turned on to Chopin's 20 nocturnes and Beethoven's 32 piano sonatas as I did back in January.

The original play for nine would have been to draw a brassie (two wood), played  a little towards the toe, that would have bounded down and up through the swale and onto the green, which, of course, was originally just the back half.

 

 

Ross Harmon

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2013, 10:27:36 AM »
Glad you had a great time! I love Yale.

Would you say that holes 8, 9 and 10 are Yale's Help > Slipknot! > Franklin's?

Paging Jay Flemma...

Colin Sheehan

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2013, 10:37:34 AM »
Ross, I think hole nine at Yale deserves better than slipknot, which is really just a minor, transitional jam. For the epic nature of eight, nine and ten, Dark Star > St. Stephen > The Eleven from Live Dead comes to mind. But I'll defer to people way more knowledgeable.

Kevin_D

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2013, 10:54:06 AM »
This is too funny.  I just played Yale for the first time on Sunday and was debating posting about it because, well, what more do I have to add?  But since Brian got the ball rolling I'll add my 2 cents.

I would pretty much agree with and echo all his comments, but would add that some of the bunkering, with amazingly steep dropoffs from the greens, is just amazing, especially #2 (the appropriately named "The Pits") and #8 ("Cape").  I had a fairly stiff wind in the face on the Biarritz, so hit an easy 3 wood, which stuck and held the front portion of the green.  My par there was the highlight of my golfing year so far!

I also appreciated Brian's comments about his GCA appreciation "life cycle".  I am more in the upslope of education/experiences rather than the sweet spot just yet, but had just a fantastic day at Yale.  In addition to playing a great course (my first Macdonald), my host couldn't have been more gracious and helpful in navigating the many blind shots. 

A few pictures:

The Pits:


Short:


Cape:


Biarritz:


Carries (looking back):


Redan:


Nose:


Home (view from where tee shot landed):


Cheers,
Kevin

Mark Bourgeois

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2013, 11:04:53 AM »
Kevin, thanks for posting those pics. Looks like you caught the place on a nice day. I think the first pic is a Cape.
Charlotte. Daniel. Olivia. Josephine. Ana. Dylan. Madeleine. Catherine. Chase. Jesse. James. Grace. Emilie. Jack. Noah. Caroline. Jessica. Benjamin. Avielle. Allison.

Tom Dunne

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2013, 11:12:59 AM »
I played my first round of the year at Yale the other day and was startled by all the NEW stuff, starting with the DYSON AIR BLADE hand dryers in the men's locker room. My heart practically turned a cartwheel at the sight of this marvelous amenity.

The course has been re-rated (downward, surprisingly) and a new set of fancy-plated back tees has been added. Our group played the Blue tees, second from the back, and I can safely say it's a stiffer challenge than the Blue course of 2012. Not surprisingly, there are a couple of places where I don't feel adding length via tee placement improves the playing experience. On 11, for example, the Blue tee is placed at the very back of the box, rendering the (downhill) hole blind. All you see is the rest of the tee box and the tree line. I don't think this enhances the challenge in any meaningful way. Even the newish way-back tee for the collegians is a better way to experience the hole.  

Low-level griping aside, the course appears to be coming along very nicely. It should be an enjoyable season up in New Haven.

Mark Pearce

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #15 on: April 30, 2013, 11:33:05 AM »
Yale was my first (and so far only) Macdonald and was, to me a striking contrast in style to almost anything I had played before.  The scale of the holes, the steep drop offs as noted by Kevin D and the bunkering really impressed me.  It was, to me, the first US parkland course I played that revealed how, in the US, this type of course can far exceed the level of parkland course in the UK.  I loved Yale and would return in an instant next time I'm within a few hours drive.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Kevin_D

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #16 on: April 30, 2013, 11:38:25 AM »
Kevin, thanks for posting those pics. Looks like you caught the place on a nice day. I think the first pic is a Cape.

You're welcome Mark!  Yes, it was a beautiful day.

The first pic is #2 (the Pits) and the third is #8 (Cape) - I am sure since I have them in order on my phone.  And I was in the bunker on the Cape!

Joey Chase

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #17 on: April 30, 2013, 03:59:02 PM »
Kevin, thanks for posting those pics. Looks like you caught the place on a nice day. I think the first pic is a Cape.

You're welcome Mark!  Yes, it was a beautiful day.

The first pic is #2 (the Pits) and the third is #8 (Cape) - I am sure since I have them in order on my phone.  And I was in the bunker on the Cape!
It is definitely The Pits!  I love the bunkers on both of those holes.  The 8th may be one of my favorites on the course.  I just love the green and the right greenside bunker.

Tim Martin

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #18 on: April 30, 2013, 08:26:56 PM »
Kevin, thanks for posting those pics. Looks like you caught the place on a nice day. I think the first pic is a Cape.

You're welcome Mark!  Yes, it was a beautiful day.

The first pic is #2 (the Pits) and the third is #8 (Cape) - I am sure since I have them in order on my phone.  And I was in the bunker on the Cape!
It is definitely The Pits!  I love the bunkers on both of those holes.  The 8th may be one of my favorites on the course.  I just love the green and the right greenside bunker.
I am a diehard fan of the golf course but the 8th is my favorite as well. The green really is incredible and with so many pinnable areas the variety of approach shots is as varied as any other hole I can think of.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2013, 08:30:26 PM by Tim Martin »

Mark Bourgeois

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #19 on: April 30, 2013, 09:38:24 PM »
I suspect the hole names reference the yardage book. Those names are not from MacRaynor. The 2nd is a Cape and the 8th is not a Cape. Anyway, too bad the 2nd green was flattened a few decades ago. I understand it was more like the 8th green today. For left / back left flags you could use the right side of the green to funnel shots.
Charlotte. Daniel. Olivia. Josephine. Ana. Dylan. Madeleine. Catherine. Chase. Jesse. James. Grace. Emilie. Jack. Noah. Caroline. Jessica. Benjamin. Avielle. Allison.

Peter Le

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #20 on: April 30, 2013, 10:01:33 PM »
Brian,
I'm a newbie on GCA and I'm lucky to say that Yale is my home course. The first time I played it, I knew something was special but couldn't define it (especially after being used to modern courses in Colorado, where I'm from). After joining Yale a few years ago and spending time on GCA, I really came to appreciate the template holes and the ones in between.

The conditions now are truly "fair," at best. Definitely come back and play when the greens get into form. I suspect you'll find the course plays even better (eg hopefully the pin on #9 will be in the back to play it properly and you can play #18 again to see which route you favor). If you're out this way again, let's get out there for a round on a great course!
PL
PL

Ronald Montesano

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #21 on: May 01, 2013, 10:39:32 PM »
I can't think of a better place to have a GCA outing than Yale. I know that the orchestration could be daunting, but it seems there are enough course members on this site to perhaps accommodate such an endeavor. Even though Yale is a private club, it is more accessible than most and is such a singular work that I can't imagine not playing it during one's lifetime.

It really is worth a trip from the tips. You realize what the challenge was meant to be, after carrying the pond on 1, not knowing which way to go on 3 (or was I the only one?) and on until you get to the 18th and cannot believe the wall that you are about to play.
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Alex Lagowitz

Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #22 on: May 01, 2013, 11:17:49 PM »
Brian,
Delighted to read your dispatch. The course is still a few weeks behind it's normal spring schedule, which is the case for all golf courses in the northeast this year. I look forward to joining you on a weekday in June when it is much more grown in.

I agree with you about the sweet spot of intellectual discovery I felt that way about jazz for a number of years and now I'm currently in the thick of it with classical music, like getting turned on to Chopin's 20 nocturnes and Beethoven's 32 piano sonatas as I did back in January.

The original play for nine would have been to draw a brassie (two wood), played  a little towards the toe, that would have bounded down and up through the swale and onto the green, which, of course, was originally just the back half.

 

 

Colin,

During the practice round for the spring invite, I was glad to show my teammates how to play a shot to the back flag - 3/4 four iron that landed on the front and rolled within inches of where the pin was during the tournament.  Everyone who tried to fly it to the back either ended up in the swale or over the green.
Cool shot.

Alex

Mark McKeever

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #23 on: May 02, 2013, 09:14:44 AM »
I'm surprised Shi$ hasn't come out of the woodwork to comment on the redan hole.   ;D

Mark
Best MGA showers - Bayonne

"Dude, he's a total d***"

SteveOgulukian

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Re: Thoughts on Playing Yale for the first time today
« Reply #24 on: May 02, 2013, 09:49:03 AM »
I think 8 is my favorite hole on the course as well.  I'm probably biased because I hit a perfect drive and approach the last time I played it.  Enough so that my 3-putt couldn't ruin my memory of the hole.  As Tim knows, I had plenty of 3 putts that day.

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